Replacing All Drums EXCEPT Cymbals

[jaysunice]

Working on a project that's going to require replacing all of the drums EXCEPT the cymbals (hi-hat) included. I will still mic all the other pieces so that I can trigger samples likely from BFD.

I'm looking for any pointers in how to save the cymbals and not get too much bleed (given that everything eles will be replaced).

We don't want to replace the cymbals because the drummer has a decent set, moreover, I've never felt like any "replaced/triggered" cymbal can hold up to a real one.

[AlexLakis]

Interesting, a lot of people replace ONLY the crash cymbals.

If the drummer has a decent set, why are you all ready conceding to using triggered samples?

Try using some SDCs with a lot of low end roll off.

You could always just close mic each cymbal as well.

[jackinthebox]

Originally Posted by jaysunice

Working on a project that's going to require replacing all of the drums EXCEPT the cymbals (hi-hat) included. I will still mic all the other pieces so that I can trigger samples likely from BFD.

I'm looking for any pointers in how to save the cymbals and not get too much bleed (given that everything eles will be replaced).

We don't want to replace the cymbals because the drummer has a decent set, moreover, I've never felt like any "replaced/triggered" cymbal can hold up to a real one.

I've recently replaced all the drums apart from the cymbals on a track i recorded a while ago. I found the best way was to record the kit as you normally would, make a midi map of all the seperate trackss , kick snare toms etc. replaced all the sounds using DFH superior custom and vintage and used the overheads and room mics for general kit sound. i found the overheads are largely cymbals if you place them right and if you roll off the bottom end they are quite well seperated. This way you get the natural feel of the drummer and the ambience of the room but you can really get the kick and snare how you want them and you don't have to worry about bleed. I like being able to choose a different snare a the mix stage when you know what space you have to fill. Same with the kick. It is important to midi map with the velocities as well otherwise it sounds obviously synthetic.

[markblasco]

Are you going to need the acoustic drum sounds at all? If not, maybe you can detune and dampen the heads to the point where they just make a dull thud, run triggers off of the drums, and also record the thuds in case the triggers don't work correctly. That would give you very little sound from the drums, but should work. Now, if you need the acoustic sounds, that is another story. You are better off just doing everything like you normally would and try to get the best sound you can.

[jaysunice]

Originally Posted by owl

I've recently replaced all the drums apart from the cymbals on a track i recorded a while ago. I found the best way was to record the kit as you normally would, make a midi map of all the seperate trackss , kick snare toms etc. replaced all the sounds using DFH superior custom and vintage and used the overheads and room mics for general kit sound. i found the overheads are largely cymbals if you place them right and if you roll off the bottom end they are quite well seperated. This way you get the natural feel of the drummer and the ambience of the room but you can really get the kick and snare how you want them and you don't have to worry about bleed. I like being able to choose a different snare a the mix stage when you know what space you have to fill. Same with the kick. It is important to midi map with the velocities as well otherwise it sounds obviously synthetic.

I'm curious as to what exactly you mean by a midi map -- drumagog? Or something else? I am planning on using Logic Pro's built in Audio to Midi (Score) feature, but if it gets frustrating, I'm planning on purchasing drumagog and using the midi out to trigger BFD or other samples.

[jaysunice]

Originally Posted by AlexLakis

Interesting, a lot of people replace ONLY the crash cymbals.

If the drummer has a decent set, why are you all ready conceding to using triggered samples?

Try using some SDCs with a lot of low end roll off.

You could always just close mic each cymbal as well.

The drummer's set is crap -- he's upgrading kit slowly and chose to do his cymbals first and they are very nice sounding in the room. He's going to purchase a new kit in the future and we'll likely re-record the drum tracks then, but for now, we're going to use this approach. Not to mention the experience I'll gain and techniques/methods I'll acquire for future projects

[Nutmeg II.]

There are several options:

• You could, like mentioned bevor, deaden the drums (Tape down, towels remove reso stick mic inside...)
• Get a set of meshheads and triggers! That way you will have no drum sound in the overheads at all! And you could use the triggers for future recordings (always nice! even if you only use them on the gate SC)
• Rent or buy your self a set of Ddrum "pads", but this will be more expensiv than the mesh heads + triggers.

[Nutmeg II.]

PS.:
I totaly forgot:

• Call the drummers in town and ask if they would rent out their good set with new heads and a tuning job.
• And of course the classic, get a good drummer into the studio with new batter and reso heads and let him do a nice tuning job! I did record a old crappy Pearl Export with a new set of Remo Amassador Coated heads and it did sound mighty fine!

[matt thomas]

Originally Posted by Nutmeg II.

PS.:
I totaly forgot:

• Call the drummers in town and ask if they would rent out their good set with new heads and a tuning job.
• And of course the classic, get a good drummer into the studio with new batter and reso heads and let him do a nice tuning job! I did record a old crappy Pearl Export with a new set of Remo Amassador Coated heads and it did sound mighty fine!

yeah if you have a decent recording set up, TOTALLY go for the borrow a kit and get a good drum tech approach.

Otherwise deaden the drums, maybe try micing the cymbols from underneath (never tried it) to get less leakage from the other drums

narco