Login / Register
 
Gap 73 vs 73 dlxworth the extra?
New Reply
Subscribe
Jeffguitar
Thread Starter
#1
13th April 2012
Old 13th April 2012
  #1
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 513

Thread Starter
Jeffguitar is offline
Gap 73 vs 73 dlxworth the extra?

Not finding much about whether the extra money for the dlx version is well spent. For instance, I have seen the original Gap 73's on Ebay for around $250 used, and the dlx new for 500, basically double the cost. So if you were wanting a Gap pre 73, would you spend the 250 on a used original and spend the other 250 on a new mic or compressor, or would you blow the whole 5o0 dollar wad on the dlx version? In fact, I could get two channels of the original at the cost of one channel of the new dlx version. hmm. Any thoughts?
#2
13th April 2012
Old 13th April 2012
  #2
Lives for gear
 
kidvybes's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Location: Banana Republic
Posts: 3,545

kidvybes is online now
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
Not finding much about whether the extra money for the dlx version is well spent. For instance, I have seen the original Gap 73's on Ebay for around $250 used, and the dlx new for 500, basically double the cost. So if you were wanting a Gap pre 73, would you spend the 250 on a used original and spend the other 250 on a new mic or compressor, or would you blow the whole 5o0 dollar wad on the dlx version? In fact, I could get two channels of the original at the cost of one channel of the new dlx version. hmm. Any thoughts?
...having had one of the original PRE-73s, I can vouch for it's value...not sure I can see the improved version being worth twice the cost...if I were looking for a "better PRE-73", I'd wait on Black Lion's 1073 clone, due out any day...for an additional cost over the stock PRE-73 (the Dizengoff D73 costs $449) you get dual Cinemag input tranny's and a custom wound (to original spec) output tranny...looks most promising to me...

Black Lion Audio Dizengoff D173 Microphone Preamplifier | Alto Music
__________________
"It was only four tracks on the machine, but I was picking up twenty from the extra terrestrial squad."
LEE 'SCRATCH' PERRY (avatar)
Jeffguitar
Thread Starter
#3
13th April 2012
Old 13th April 2012
  #3
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 513

Thread Starter
Jeffguitar is offline
I also see this new WARM audio Api 312 style unit, but only one review and it sounds like a marketing department wrote it, so I hate to be a test subject, especially when I am a single dad that struggles by on being a musician. I can't afford to lose 449 dollars and be dissatisfied.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kidvybes View Post
...having had one of the original PRE-73s, I can vouch for it's value...not sure I can see the improved version being worth twice the cost...if I were looking for a "better PRE-73", I'd wait on Black Lion's 1073 clone, due out any day...for an additional cost over the stock PRE-73 (the Dizengoff D73 costs $449) you get dual Cinemag input tranny's and a custom wound (to original spec) output tranny...looks most promising to me...

Black Lion Audio Dizengoff D173 Microphone Preamplifier | Alto Music
#4
13th April 2012
Old 13th April 2012
  #4
Lives for gear
 
kidvybes's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2005
Location: Banana Republic
Posts: 3,545

kidvybes is online now
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffguitar View Post
I also see this new WARM audio Api 312 style unit, but only one review and it sounds like a marketing department wrote it, so I hate to be a test subject, especially when I am a single dad that struggles by on being a musician. I can't afford to lose 449 dollars and be dissatisfied.
...understood, but few products of this quality and affordable pricepoint are introduced by a company with the established rep of Black Lion Audio...certainly the PRE-73 did not have such a pedigree...BLA's API style B12A pres were a big hit, even on the high-end forums...your choice, of course...

...but from what I've been reading, that WARM WA12 looks impressive too...I'm betting they both eat the PRE-73 for an extra $100 new...

...and as far as that review goes, if you only read the "sound-bite" edited version on the WARM website, it does read like a marketing promo, but go to the original unedited review to get more sense of the reviewer's impressions:
http://everythingrecording.com/revie...rm-audio-wa12/
#5
13th April 2012
Old 13th April 2012
  #5
Lives for gear
 
guitarboy94's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,878

guitarboy94 is offline
I own the GAP PRE73. It really is a terrific preamp on just about anything. I love the warmth I can dial in, particularly on vocals, as well as the mic impedance variations. There is a tiny bit of unpleasant distortion after the gain hits about 55db, but I rarely ever dial in that much gain.

KiDV,

You're tempting me with this new Black Lion pre. You know all about my gear addictions! Why'd you have to go and post that???
__________________
Visit my website for free music:
www.patrickskelton.com

Audiobook for my suspense novel, THE DEVICE. 4-Stars!

http://www.amazon.com/The-Device/dp/...s=kurt+feldner

Music Sample:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQSESRzhkkw
#6
13th April 2012
Old 13th April 2012
  #6
Gear addict
 
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Sweden
Posts: 304

bace is offline
I own the original and the dllx. The dlx solve most of the critics of the originals problem. The meter psu does not interfere and it has tantalum caps. And it also a lot easier to put in carnhills transformers. Very nice indeed, but if it is worth the double cost im not so sure. For me it is though, more versatile and i am allergic to noise ;-)
#7
17th April 2012
Old 17th April 2012
  #7
Jai guru deva om
 
warhead's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 13,974

warhead is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by bace View Post
And it also a lot easier to put in carnhills transformers.
I can tell you that they did not deliver an easier way to do this mod, it still requires a complete disassembly and reassembly of the unit AND it does not use the same model # Carnhill that the other units use (so buying a DLX and Googling what transformers you need will likely net the wrong info). They are mounted up differently is all.

I too thought it was going to be easier to do until we received them...they say "board ready" but these are not plug and play.

Far from it.

War
__________________
Warren Dent, Owner - ZenPro Audio: Gear Now & Zen

#8
17th April 2012
Old 17th April 2012
  #8
Lives for gear
 
NYCruiser's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Yonkers, NY
Posts: 1,673

NYCruiser is offline
I bought two Pre-73's from ZenPro several months ago (thanks again for the coffee Warren!) along with the rack kit for them. Unmodded originals. I think they're the MkII with the insert jacks and the gain knob raises clockwise.

I don't have the Comp 54's for them, but they are great when run through my ART Pro VLA II. Nice to blend the tube sound with the tranny's in the 73's.

I love them. Don't use them on everything, but they have never sounded bad. Vocals, acoustic gtr, fiddle, drum ovhds, DI for keys. Has worked on it all.

I wouldn't bother getting a modded version. Just my opinion. Forget about what they are trying to emulate. They are what they are, and they sound great. Especially when pushed to just the right point.
__________________
PapaPugs Studio
Yonkers, NY
#9
17th April 2012
Old 17th April 2012
  #9
Jai guru deva om
 
warhead's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 13,974

warhead is offline
You are welcome for the coffee! Also, an opinion on the mod is perfectly valid both ways. It's not like they're not already very good right out of the box.

When you mention being able to gain stage them to just the right point, the interesting thing about the DLX is they have done something different with this model.

They placed a variable pad AFTER the output transformer, giving you the opportunity to find the right input gain, output gain, and then DRIVE that output transformer without clipping your next piece of gear, all in one box. Very different from padding the INPUT as found in virtually all pres.

The fact that it's pretty much already got the "TT" mod we normally do and is only $50 more (our full mod adds the Carnhill, as well as Motorola 2N3055 output transistor) makes the DLX attractive in at least those ways. The improved power supply situation is also nice.

War
#10
17th April 2012
Old 17th April 2012
  #10
Lives for gear
 
NYCruiser's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Yonkers, NY
Posts: 1,673

NYCruiser is offline
I wasn't aware of them installing a pad after the output tranny. I actually have done that myself manually with an inline pad. Great effect to rattle the output tranny too and not clip. I would get the DLX model just for that!
Jeffguitar
Thread Starter
#11
17th April 2012
Old 17th April 2012
  #11
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 513

Thread Starter
Jeffguitar is offline
War, what do you mean 50 dollars more? From what I see the deluxe is 499 and the MKII is like 349.00 new at ZZZounds nd other places. 150 dollars more for the TT Caps and the output pad, am i correct?

Also, how much d you charge if someone buys the Delux and simply wants the Carnhills added, as opposed to if someone wants the full upgrade on an MKII model, and an original.

I am wondering if it is cheaper to buy an original and get a full upgrade from you, or buy and MKIi, or a delux. Not asking for specific prices cause i know you don't like to do that, just asking which of the three models cost less to upgrade depending on what model they send you and what they pay for it. I can find the used original on Ebay for 250, the MKII for 350.00, and the delux for 499. Which should I buy for the cheapest upgrade path total?
#12
17th April 2012
Old 17th April 2012
  #12
Jai guru deva om
 
warhead's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 13,974

warhead is offline
Sorry, I was comparing to our TT mod which at the time of this writing is $449 (so a stock DLX with tantalums installed from factory is $50 more).

All of our mod pricing is current on our pages, including the DLX (which is the Carnhill install for mic in, line out).

Any questions shoot me an email.

War
#13
3rd May 2012
Old 3rd May 2012
  #13
Gear maniac
 
Joined: Aug 2011
Location: Austin/San Antonio,Texas / Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 194

EngineerTHIS is offline
Sorry to Regurge this one, but I'm genuinely interested in the finer points of this debate too...

I've heard a pre 73. I know I like it. Hell I'd love to get more than a couple. I do like the idea of the Pad on the DLX, and the electronics upgrade. Of course what an indecisive guy like myself is really looking for is some overhwhelming praise from someone who knows their stuff as to why the DLX is a solid investment over the 73. Doubt that will materialize, but in hope we find a way to labour on...

I'd love the chance to AB them, but I don't think that'll shake out either. Anything definitive to say here War? ...Seeing that I'll be using a fine little outfit called zenpro one way or another
#14
3rd May 2012
Old 3rd May 2012
  #14
Jai guru deva om
 
warhead's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 13,974

warhead is offline
I think the easiest way I can put it is, the DLX essentially delivers what our "TT" mod does plus the extra pad, filters etc, over the MK2. The MK2 however is a more simple, straight forward pre / DI that would be preferred for those who don't want to use those features. Another way might be that the more features and more complex the design, the higher chance something can go awry...just a natural fact worth considering.

We're happy to take care of you either way...

War
#15
17th June 2012
Old 17th June 2012
  #15
Gear addict
 
Joined: Oct 2008
Location: Sweden
Posts: 304

bace is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by warhead View Post
I can tell you that they did not deliver an easier way to do this mod, it still requires a complete disassembly and reassembly of the unit AND it does not use the same model # Carnhill that the other units use (so buying a DLX and Googling what transformers you need will likely net the wrong info). They are mounted up differently is all.

I too thought it was going to be easier to do until we received them...they say "board ready" but these are not plug and play.

Far from it.

War
They use the mu-metal shielded version, which I sees as very appropriate for a unit in a aluminum box. And it is also smaller so it can be board mounted. But I think here is place for have hole-mount for the non mu-metal version too.
#16
30th June 2012
Old 30th June 2012
  #16
Lives for gear
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 502

Kumbari is offline
I own the original GAP PRE73 and have just bought the BLA12 pre. I tell you its a pleasant change to use the BLA12 without the noise from the GAP PRE73. I found the GAP PRE73 had more highs and lows. I dont know whether this was exaggerated highs and lows but the BAL12 had no noise issue and the sound was tight and good. I have had the GAP PRE73 for over 2 years now and use it heaps. I am going to buy the upgraded DLX and sell the original unit within the next couple of months.
Its amazing how a pre can sound so fantastic when you get it but the more you use it the more some little annoying problems become too much. I think when you hear some noise and your other gear doesnt have that level noise you really start to question whether you want it or not. I mean when I first got the GAP PRE73 I could hear the low end sound not so clean and defined so I got Joe Malone to swap out the transformer with his so now it sounds heaps better in that department.
The noise has never really been an issue its just now that when you start using better gear you want to eliminate problems before they are there.
Anyway I still use the Pre quite regularly and love it.
I will be asking whether someone can report back on the findings between the the original and the DLX and why they would or would not upgrade?
New Reply Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook  Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter  Submit Thread to LinkedIn LinkedIn  Submit Thread to Google+ Google+ 
 
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
illiummusic / So much gear, so little time!
7
R08 / Music Computers
10
A27Hull / Geekslutz forum
11
AlexLakis / So much gear, so little time!
6
FFTT / Geekslutz forum
43

Forum Jump

SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.