Warming a mix/tracks

[hemmick reef]

I use a UAD-1 card but I would like to use some external processing to really get that smoothness/warmth in a sound. Digital is ok but I don't believe from what I have read it can sound like good hardware?


Any suggestions thumbsup

[I play in a ban]

This isn't what you want to hear, but keep practicing with what you have. I have heard excellent in the box mixes done with less plugs than a UAD-1.

Use your ears, you might want to work on the environment your mixing in... ie broadband absorbers.

Oh, and the actual samples and tracks you use/record play a little bit in the role of this sound we all want to achieve.

good luck bro

p.s. everyone hates the word "warmth" in here, see tape op

[3rd world order]

Originally Posted by hemmick reef

I would like to use some external processing to really get that smoothness/warmth in a sound. Any suggestions

put some mixes on a cd and visit a local studio with a high end 1/4" or 1/2" machine... bang some mixes down to tape then back into the computer. see if this is what you want. It took me 7 years to finally figure out this is what I want.

Analog Tape. First and Last and Always.

P.S. I recommend either a Studer or Ampex machine.

[max cooper]

Originally Posted by 3rd world order

s.

P.S. I recommend either a Studer or Ampex machine.

I'm with you, but heck, try dropping some drum tracks onto cassette tape and back into the DAW.

It doesn't hash things up as much as you'd think (depending on the cassette machine and the tape) but it is tape!

Really, try it!

William Wittman mentioned here somewhere that one of the songs on a Joan Osborne CD was mastered from a mix that Joan had on cassette. It does sound different, but good!

[mhartman]

You could also try putting it on a Stereo VHS tape (if you still have a VCR). You will have to experiment with the different recording speeds.

Mike

[hemmick reef]

Yes I was wondering about using a little Tascam tape 4-track. I have an old Fostex 4-track but it's not very reliable.
Any suggestions on hardware - SPL Charisma or tube compressor (not too expensive though).

[Tubefreak]

I really like how the Peavey VMP-2 adds a some 3D tube like character to the sound. Yes I even pull complete mixes through them. The EQ is very helpfull too to add some sonic character.

My Sebatron VEQC-2000 compressor with Mullard tubes certainly adds smooth character to the mix, imo. A stock Art Pro VLA compressor may be seen as warm, to me it's just cutting highs, at least the one I have. Changed the ICs and tube and it's more transparant now.

I've added a variable tube gain boost to it so I can dail in the amount of tube drive without changing the amount of compression. Very nice if you want it to go close or over the edge.

Behringer tube products aren't worth the shot, at least I haven't found any adding warmth in their retro tube EQ.

BTW I'm gonna try out some 70's Siemens/Telefunken solid state preamps to see what they add to the sound. As soon as they're hooked up, I'll let you know.

Maarten

[blayz2002]

Trust me if you want warmer feels to your synths and stuff then get a front end box, I use a TLA Fat Man FAT 1, (not high end I know) a lot of the time I don't even compress the sounds I send through it but simply send them in with a high gain to drive the valves. It just makes everything sound fatter warmer and smoother. I still then use UAD and Waves plugs for controlled compression and eq in the mix, comes outsounding a lot warmer and thicker.

This is one of those things that makes itb mixes sound more analouge...rather than trying to do it all with one box at the end of the mix.

[David@MVS]

Originally Posted by hemmick reef

I use a UAD-1 card but I would like to use some external processing to really get that smoothness/warmth in a sound. Digital is ok but I don't believe from what I have read it can sound like good hardware?


Any suggestions thumbsup

Well the obvious choices are the EL Fatso Jr., the Neve Portico Tape FX and the Crane Song HEDD (to quote someone on this or another forum, "who wouldnt want some HEDD?")

I only have experience with the Fasto Jr. I love the thing. Very versatile. Fun box.
I have access to the Tape DSP (similar to the HEDD) on a Crane Song Spider and it is very subtle. But that goes thru another ADA in my particular setup so I usually use it only while tracking.

Good luck,
David

[krs]

Dear Sir, if you in fact have a Cranesong Spider, *clearly* you have no business posting in the Low End.

Get back to where you belong!

[RainbowStorm]

You can warm up a mix in many different ways. I recommend that you look for a nice hardware reverb unit. A really good reverb unit will breath life into your mixes because it creates something called "reverb resonance". Reverb resonance makes a mix reverberating smoothly in a way that feels very pleasant for the body and ears. You can find a lot of reverb resonance on vocal tracks on popular CD albums. On a 5.1. surround system it feels like the singer is really present and close to you. Listen to "Sad Eyes" with Trisha Yearwood, that song has a lot of reverb resonance on the vocals. If reverb resonance is on the whole mix it creates a very pleasant listening experience. Reverb resonance can be increased by using the correct compressors and compressor settings on top of it, which then both makes the song smoother but also softer, something almost every contemporary country album has today. Listen to Vince Gill's album "Let's make sure we kiss goodbye", that album has a lot of reverb resonance.

[djui5]

Run it through a bunch of V78's...that'll warm shit up for ya.



If your tracks really sound that "digital", you can either slap Phoenix and waves ren plugs on everything, or run it through a console....whatever works.

[moon_unit]

Warmth doesn't come from any sort of device that you run your audio through. And it certainly doesn't come from a plugin. If you like degrading your audio by running it through additional a/d and d/a conversions, along with whatever other artifacts (hiss, wow, flutter, etc) you might get from analog tape ... then by all means, try running it out to tape if it makes you feel fuzzy inside.

Warmth is more a philosophy and a frame of mind that is present when you track. It's about what kind of mics you use ... how you position them ... the type of room you're in, and right down to how you play or perform. For example: with guitar tracks, the kind of strings you use and how the player picks will effect how 'warm' a track will sound in the end. What kind of cymbals a drummer uses, how he hits them, and the type of mics used and how they're positioned ... will all effect how 'warm' you perceive your track (and ultimately, your mix) to be in the end.

Even with samples ... if it's a sample, and it sounds "too digital" or sterile for you, then don't use it. Use something that sounds closer to what you have in mind and that fits your vision of what you consider to be "warm."

[Cojo]

Originally Posted by max cooper

I'm with you, but heck, try dropping some drum tracks onto cassette tape and back into the DAW.

It doesn't hash things up as much as you'd think (depending on the cassette machine and the tape) but it is tape!

Really, try it!

William Wittman mentioned here somewhere that one of the songs on a Joan Osborne CD was mastered from a mix that Joan had on cassette. It does sound different, but good!

Wow... I havn't thought of this! I have a great stereo tape recorder that costed me nearly $600 when I bought it in the eighties. Now it just lay in the closet gathering dust. It has dolby A, B and DBX. I'm definitly gonna test this on my next mix!

Thanks for this advice!

/Cojo

[ILL]

Push it in the red with the dbx on and watch them lo fi drums pop! I used to play with that A LOT. Peace!

[cdog]

I'm going to come from the other side of the tracks here....

Why do your tracks/mixes "need warming"?

Do they sound bad? Too much high end? How were they tracked? What mic/pres?

This whole "my digital needs warming" trend is absurd.

If the vocal is bright to the point of harshness... retrack it with another mic.

This goes for every track in the mix.... if you track everyting properly, nothing will ever need "warming" to sound "better."

If you can't mentally "get over" digital recording, then just go back to analog.

Its like an old teddy bear, squeeze it and you'll feel better, or "warmer."

[hemmick reef]

I have gone from 4-track tape to purely digital in the past few years. I have found quite a noticable change in the quality of sound: from musical to sterile. I can never get the smoothness from digital even when taking out some of the high frequencies. Admitedly I am not an expert but 4 track was simple and the sound was always natural.

Don't get me wrong I'm not complaining or entering the analogue/digital argument bla bla... as I believe both are excellent means of recording.

My post was regarding combining hardware with DAWs to add an alternative flavour (smoother hopefully) to digital processing. I have not used any hardware to process my music before and wondered if it gives a more natural sound to recordings?

I am waiting at the moment for a new preamp 'Groove Tubes The Brick' to arrive which I hope will beef things up a bit over my soundcard pres. Maybe that will do the trick, as it has been suggested that I need to add a descent preamp to my gear list?

Combining a tape recorder with recording also sounds like a great idea for vocals!

[kingofswing]

I love the warm sound on alot of my favourite songs, and i like to try and recreated that warmth with the tools i have available.

Now i dont have any highend gear, not at all.

I tend to use the UAD-1 plugs like the Pultec EQ and use it to shelf some high end, which makes things sound slighty less forward but gives a more natural sound, perceived as more analouge like.

I also use my TL Audio Fat1, which i think is pretty good for sweetening things up and adds a slight open sound to mixes with very gentle settings.

Another great trick is to add some subtle harmonic distortion with use of a basic distortion plugin. But you have to be very subtle.

Choosing warmer samples and sounds as you go in, can result in a warm sound output too (as already mentioned)

I also like to apply some of the above basics to individual tracks (rather than the final mix), which gives a much fuller and rounded mix as a result.

There are so many other techniques to achieve warmer sounding mixes without the expense, but you just have to experiment and learn the inside outs and break the rules too.