Avoid the MR816X?

[texxas]

From what I've been reading and researching this is a great unit, maybe the best firewire interface out there, but it lacks the ability to use external pres unless you use the unbalanced lines on channels 1 and 2, from what I've been researching, there's hardly any solid pres that have unbalanced, I was looking into an Avalon which only has XLR, and while there are some XLR to 1/4" unbalanced plugs, I read on sweetwater that unbalanced is the most likely to lose audio quality and XLR to TRS balanced is the recommended for running pres to interfaces, am I correct in understanding this or can someone please clarify? I guess what I'm asking is, if I plan to expand to using external pres such as the Avalon eventually, should I avoid this product and go with say an RME Fireface 400? All feedback's appreciated, thanks!

[jrakarl]

Originally Posted by texxas

I guess what I'm asking is, if I plan to expand to using external pres such as the Avalon eventually, should I avoid this product and go with say an RME Fireface 400? All feedback's appreciated, thanks!

I like to keep everything balanced if at all possible, makes for easier patch bay wiring. However this is a balanced piece of kit and doesn't just feature mic pre's but also.. according to the blurb,
"What's more, each channel features an XLR/TRS combo jack, so you can easily track line-level gear alongside your microphones. "
Check this link. Looks like it would suit anyone pretty much perfectly!

[mdf25]

There is ADAT I/O on the interface which you could use to connect external preamps to the MR if your selected pres have digital and ADAT options. I've heard that the drivers aren't that rock-solid either for some users but there has also been a lot of happy customers.

If you want rock solidity and full expandability, the RME FF400/FF800 might be the way to go. Drivers have never been faulty, preamps are very good (if a little too clean) and the AD/DA is great. Steinberg supposedly does have better AD/DA but I wouldn't think it would make the biggest difference ever, I have got album-quality tracks from my FF400 and some even get it with MOTU interfaces which are another step down from the FF400. Or you could get both of them, using the MR preamps and the FF AD/DA and routing options.

If you need more expandability you can link up to 3 FF modules together (3 400s OR 3 800s) and have even more I/O. With 3 FF400s you get 6 preamps, 6 switchable instrument/line inputs, 12 line inputs, 24 line outputs, 24 ADAT I/O, 3 SPDIF I/O (carries 2 channels each) and word clock.

You can also link 3 MR units together and get 24 preamps (6 bypass preamp stages) 24 ADAT I/O, 24 line outputs, 3 SPDIF I/O (Carries 2 channels each) and word clock. Preamps are better, AD/DA is also better (So I have heard) and you get integration with Cubase and Nuendo.

All in all, it depends on what you want from your system. If you want better hardware/software interfacing which is solid, with plenty of expandability, get the FF400/800 for their solid drivers and flexible routing. If you want direct integration with Cubase and Nuendo, with nicer pres and AD/DA, get the MR816. You can also get 1 REV-X Reverb instance per unit. If you get the CSX models you also get the compressor/EQ channel strip (8 per CSX unit).

[texxas]

Thanks for the replies, as far as the Steinberg goes, on the MR816 thread, about page 3 is where users start talking about the only way to bypass the pres in the MR is to use the 2 unbalanced lines on the first 2 channels, heres a link:

Steinberg CSX mr816

As far as inputs, I record local rap and r&b artists, so no need to expand on that, just need 2 solid channels for recording vocals and possibly intruments in stereo, but the Avalon is on the top of my list for an external pre and the fact that it only has XLR out could be the dealbreaker in what interface I use.

I actually was considering a Saffire 56 because of it's liquid pres and some reviews I've read on how good the liquid emulations sound, but from all the reseach I've done, looks like the MR816X and the FF 400 are the top two contenders due to conversion, I was leaning toward the MR until I found out you're pretty much stuck with the pres even if they are good, the option of adding your own pres is pretty important I think! Anyway, thanks for the feedback, any other opinions are very much welcome!

[shanabit]

Originally Posted by texxas

I actually was considering a Saffire 56 because of it's liquid pres and some reviews I've read on how good the liquid emulations sound, but from all the reseach I've done, looks like the MR816X and the FF 400 are the top two contenders due to conversion, I was leaning toward the MR until I found out you're pretty much stuck with the pres even if they are good, the option of adding your own pres is pretty important I think! Anyway, thanks for the feedback, any other opinions are very much welcome!

Your not STUCK as you say.

Sorry, its NOT an issue, You can turn the PAD on the inputs and turn down the gain on the front and control your gain using your external pre. Yes, your still going through the circuit this way but it doesnt matter.
The pres on the MR do not and will not change/color/degrade the signal. They are really GOOD

IF not then,
I came out of my Avalon 737sp using a balanced XLR cable to TRS balanced on the 1/4" side into the insert on channel 1 or 2. You can get a TS cable on the one end if you need to.

NO ISSUES at all with that setup and NO SIGNAL degradation. Sounds great
The MR sounds better than the RME. It has better PRES, better AD and better DA period. RME has great routing though, the TotalMix is killer. Im happy with this unit, MR816X, VERY happy.

As far as the Avalon thing your Jonesin for, I would steer you towards the AD2022 versus the 737, it sounds better and would give you TWO full pres, no Comp or EQ though if you need that. If you need that then the 737 is it.
You could look at the M5 as well as its a single channel AD2022

BTW, I was freakin out when I ordered my MR when I found out about the UNBALANCED inserts, hasnt been an issue at all though. I dont give two spits about the integration with Cubase BTW and that the DAW I use right now. What happens when you switch DAWS? Well, there goes the benefit of that and the Reverb on the MR and the Comp/EQ on the CSX model. I wouldnt waste the money on that. Your better off to buy some plugins you want that work with ANY DAW

You should look at the M-Audio 2626 as well. It will allow you to bypass the pres as your wanting so direct insert, balanced. Not to mention you can run PooTools if you need to with M-Powered.
This unit is solid as far as sound goes

[texxas]

shanabit, thanks ALOT, I was hoping to hear from a user of the MR who could enlighten me on that subject, so since I know now that I can expand the pres with an Avalon in the future, and the stock pres will be more than good enough to hold it's own until then, looks like I'm going with the MR816X! And, yea, I agree, I dont need the integration as I use
Sonar, and really don't have any interest in the CSX version since I have plenty of my own plugins, not to mention I'll save 600 usd in getting it vs the FF 400 which can be spent towards the Avalon or MA-200 mic I plan on, thanks!!

[texxas]

Quick question, how do you feel about the quality of the MR's pres being used on stereo instruments like acoustic guitar and pianos? Of course I'll have to expirement when I have one, but if these pres can hold their own with maybe a matched set of NT5's then perhaps the Avalon M5 may be all I need for one channel of vocals.

[JeffE]

I don't find the unbalanced inserts to be an issue at all. I run a Great River ME-1NV into channel 1 and a Universal Audio LA-610 into channel 2...and happily use the MR816x preamps for channels 3-8.

[shanabit]

Originally Posted by texxas

Quick question, how do you feel about the quality of the MR's pres being used on stereo instruments like acoustic guitar and pianos? Of course I'll have to expirement when I have one, but if these pres can hold their own with maybe a matched set of NT5's then perhaps the Avalon M5 may be all I need for one channel of vocals.

Im using the MR's pres to record Acoustic Guitar, Vocals and Bass Guitar.
I SOLD my Avalon 737sp and have no regrets. I used that money to get my Cubase up to C5 and build up my drum library. I'll get another pre in the future.
Very nice pres. No complaints. Oh, and all my keys are going into an Ashly LX308B line mixer then directly into channel 7/8 on the MR, no problems at all here with the setup.

[redroom]

I have no issue use the Mic Pre pad when inserting external FX in Cubase with the MR816.Stabilty has been rock solid on my Mac Pro its never once crashed or got flaky on me in over a year of use.

[nms]

I'm on win 7 x64 and it's been flawless out of the box for me with the latest driver. oh and you don't lose the fx or channel strip by not using cubase. works just fine.

[shanabit]

Originally Posted by nms

I'm on win 7 x64 and it's been flawless out of the box for me with the latest driver. oh and you don't lose the fx or channel strip by not using cubase. works just fine.

OOPS your right, I forgot about that, cool