mic Pre's Robbie with cheap mic or Duet with better Mic

[univ28]

Ok im on a limited budget here. I have a Blue Robbie Mic pre and an Apogee Duet. I need a mic for vocals(Rap and r&b) but i was wondering if i should 1. Sell the Robbie and buy a Better Mic($500-$800) to use with the Duet mic preamps Or 2. Keep the Robbie and buy a cheaper Mic (under $300) Which one of these options would sound better?

[KeithMoonwannabe]

Rather than focusing on price why don't you pick a mic that flatters the source.

Focus on your recording and performing talents. you don't need to have expensive gear to get great results. at the end of the day people listen to your music not what gear you used.

Just buy whatever you can afford and learn to use it with what you have.

I mean if you want a specific answer give me specific info rap/r n b vocals is the most vague statement ever. That's not telling me male or female, the type of range or timbre of the voice(s) being recorded.

[univ28]

sorry male voice. I really liked the way the Blue Kiwi sounded with my voice but its out of my price range. Ive used Studio projects c3 , akg c3000b and the neumann tlm103 bu none of thise mics did much for me. Here is a sample of some vocals i recorded the other day as a rough reference . They are unmixed and untouched just really raw , This was done in my friends studio with the Kiwi

http://www.zshare.net/download/785175040929ca6b/

[KeithMoonwannabe]

Blue Kiwi is a great mic but like I said ultimately whatever you get is what you'll have so you'll have to learn to use it. The kiwi is a very specific mic and you will probably not find anything else like it esp in the $800 and under category. Best thing to do would be to learn to work with EQ and such to get a similar tone out of something else.

I think for around $300 there are a lot of good mics
MXL V67G with oktavamod
AT3035
AT4040
AT4047 (used)
AT4050 (used)
KSM32 (used)
C214 (used)
M179
APEX 460 with oktavamod (that actually might be more than $300 with the mod but nonetheless a good place to go)
KEL HM7u
SM7b
PR30
RE20
Hamburg Edition

There are some good ribbons in your price range but they wouldn't be my go-to or only mic to have in the collection. I love the Cascade Fatheads and the Shinybox 46 as well as the Beyerdynamics.

I think for around $800 your best bet would be the Mojave Audio MA200

There are a lot of mics I'd rather just pick something decent and get to work. I've spent too much time being compulsive about gear in my life and I've learned that you need to free yourself from your gear. It doesn't matter what you use it's what you do with it that counts. You have a good enough pre and interface to where the only things that will really matter (assuming you buy a decent enough mic which is definitely possible for the amount your spending) to where if you can perform and engineer decently the result will be good.

Focus on creating a great sound on the room then focus on capturing that performance and flattering it with what you have. There are timeless recordings using $100 Shure SM58's on vocals and there are timeless recordings using the most esoteric/prized/expensive mics you can name.

I'm not going to turn on the radio to hear an AKG C12 running through a NEVE in action I'm going to turn on the radio to hear music.

[uncle duncan]

Blue makes a couple of under $400 mics. Check them out. The Robbie is a great pre. You might compare it with the duet, just to see if the difference in how it handles the S's is worth keeping.

[fuzzworks]

If you sell the Duet will you still have a good interface?

[univ28]

You mention Oktavamod? Is this an actual hardware mod to the mic?

[univ28]

Originally Posted by fuzzworks

If you sell the Duet will you still have a good interface?

No the duet is my only interface. I had a focusrite Saffire and sold it for the Duet

[CrankyRayHanky]

Originally Posted by univ28

You mention Oktavamod? Is this an actual hardware mod to the mic?

OktavaMod - Affordable Boutique Microphones

[xj32]

Get a Bluebird, its a great mic and will sound awesome with the Robbie.

[KeithMoonwannabe]

I like both the Bluebird and the Baby Bottle.

The new Rocket Stage 1 is pretty cool too. One positive about that is the interchangeable capsules.

[uncle duncan]

Originally Posted by univ28

... Sell the Robbie and buy a Better Mic($500-$800) to use with the Duet mic preamps...

If you do decide to sell the Robbie, PM me. I wouldn't mind having another one so I could pair them up for OH mics.

But seriously, compare the Robbie with the Duet. You may find that the rich low end and smoothing affect of the Robbie give you a nice contrast from the clinical sound of the Duet. I don't have a Duet, so I have no idea what they sound like, but the Robbie is definitely a keeper for me.

[fuzzworks]

Originally Posted by univ28

No the duet is my only interface. I had a focusrite Saffire and sold it for the Duet

Will you be recording analog now?

I realize I may be stating the obvious here, but no matter how good the Robbie sounds, if you sell your only interface the overall quality of your digital recordings may be reduced significantly.

I love the Duet's preamps. I want color, I use Redline Preamp.

[kesslerjesus]

I use my robbie with an Sm7B and an aphex 651 compressor, and the results are amazing, so I wouldn't hesitate to try out the combination. On the other hand, I've hear that the robbie loves FET mics.

[BOWIE]

Originally Posted by fuzzworks

I realize I may be stating the obvious here, but no matter how good the Robbie sounds, if you sell your only interface the overall quality of your digital recordings may be reduced significantly.

That's what I'm wondering as well. How are you going to get your audio converted and onto some kind of storage?
That aside, I sold my Robbie and regret it. Its extremely versatile. You will outgrow your Duet but the Robbie will always be useful.

[KeithMoonwannabe]

Originally Posted by BOWIE

That's what I'm wondering as well. How are you going to get your audio converted and onto some kind of storage?
That aside, I sold my Robbie and regret it. Its extremely versatile. You will outgrow your Duet but the Robbie will always be useful.

agreed DON'T SELL ANYTHING you never make back what you put in and you almost always regret it take it from one that goes through gear like water (or at least used to, I'm trying to break that habit).

Perhaps a better way to go might be to just get a mic you can afford and keep both your Robbie and the Duet. If you are simply tracking vocals I think the Robbie would be wise to keep around.

I know a lot of people myself included like having options when it comes to mics so my best advice is to find a mic that you enjoy using that you also find flattering. Get it get used to it and learn to use it.

Then as money allows you can add other colors to the collection. But at this point not knowing your specific goals I'd say something neutral would be the best starting point.

mics like the Shure KSM32, AKG C214, AT4050, AT4047 are perfect for this and are pretty common on the used market.

On a budget the AT3035, M179, and V67G provide great bang for the buck and in the case of the V67G you can get it modded later and really do some great things with it.

[jslevin]

I'd sell the Robbie and put it all into a mic. AT4060 seems like maybe the right fit for your needs and price range.

The Duet's preamps aren't great but they're okay, and the Robbie really isn't a difference-maker of a preamp.

Just a shot in the dark here, but you really need to stop buying gear on the basis of what looks cool. The more cool and stylish and "Apple" pro audio gear looks, the more it's being aimed at the trust fund or Guitar Center crowd that doesn't have the experience or ears to tell what actually SOUNDS good.

As a counter-example, API makes fantastic preamps, but they look like boring industrial equipment. Same with John Hardy, Daking, etc. Think about it.

JSL

[jslevin]

Originally Posted by KeithMoonwannabe

agreed DON'T SELL ANYTHING you never make back what you put in and you almost always regret it take it from one that goes through gear like water (or at least used to, I'm trying to break that habit).

This is incredibly bad advice.

Gear is not precious. It's an asset with a value attached. In your mind, you should think of every piece of gear your own as having a price tag attached to it. That price tag is not what you paid for it, it's what you could sell it for.

If, at any time, you think you could spend the money on that price tag on something more useful to you than that piece of gear, you should do it without hesitation.

"What you put into it" is also called "sunk cost." Focusing on sunk cost is basically page one of the "how to make bad decisions" handbook.

JSL

[KeithMoonwannabe]

Originally Posted by jslevin

This is incredibly bad advice.

Gear is not precious. It's an asset with a value attached. In your mind, you should think of every piece of gear your own as having a price tag attached to it. That price tag is not what you paid for it, it's what you could sell it for.

If, at any time, you think you could spend the money on that price tag on something more useful to you than that piece of gear, you should do it without hesitation.

"What you put into it" is also called "sunk cost." Focusing on sunk cost is basically page one of the "how to make bad decisions" handbook.

JSL

so basically you are saying it's a good idea to sell a $900 preamp to get enough money to buy a mic that's marginally better when the actual problem is likely the performer and the engineer talent. You are assuming that a better mic is his need. I'm saying the OP needs to sit back and think objectively before taking any action at all.

Do you want to talk about sunk costs now you've lost half the money you've put into something that you sold to get no noticeable improvement on end result. Did you sit and think of that possibility. But cool now you have a more expensive mic.

I'm saying since he already has a Duet and he already has a Robbie hold onto them get their useful life out of them. Selling something like the Robbie will only get about half of what he paid new for it realistically.

Do you honestly think that the difference between a good and bad recording is really going to be buying a well selected $300 mic to a mic like an AT4060 or a Mojave MA200? Because I don't. Reasons being the guy probably doesn't have the recording environment to make the most of that investement nor does he/she have the engineering or performing talent to pull out the add'l flattery that more expensive mic offers.

Do you want to buy gear based on lust or do you want to buy gear for practicality. Because I can honestly tell you from experience it'd be bad advice to just tell this guy to go buy shit and sell shit just for the sake of doing it.

You want a decent mic look for a used C214, used KSM32, used AT4050 or AR4047. There ya go any of those can be had for $300-$400 used just about any day of the week.

Honestly a mic like a Shure SM7b wouldn't be a bad choice either considering his rig and the style he wants to do.

Sure there are preamps I prefer to the Robbie Great River, Daking, API, John Hardy, etc. But the bottom line is the Robbie is a good pre and it's usable for a variety of things. Would it be my first choice as a standalone no. But hey different strokes for different folks. Personally I'd get a Great River if I had the money, I'd buy a better recording environment, and I'd probably get a couple higher quality mics that offered different flavors.

But I'm broke so I buy what I can afford and what I'm familiar with it. I work with the tools and environment I have and I enjoy what I do. I'm not doing it to make money or to make a name in the industry. I have a day job and I'm not in a situation where I can afford to take the risk on becoming a successful musician right now. Maybe in a couple years that will be different. But right now I need guaranteed income to pay my credit cards, pay for my student loans/books/supplies, pay my rent, pay my utilities, pay my cell phone and internet bill, pay for food and gas, etc.

Obviously I have no problem selling the gear I own but it does suck when you spend money on something and it depreciates before you really get to use it because you had a shitty day and had an extra expense come up.

I'm a college student paying his way through school on his own measily income. Music is my hobby not my career.

It's fine to disagree with my opinion and you are entitled to your own but don't discredit mine as bad advice when I can easily say the same about yours.

I mean honestly for an amateur recording environment do you really think selling a mid grade pre to get an $800 mic is really going to be a noticeable improvement over a mic like what I mentioned before? and please be realistic.

and heck if he knows what he's doing he can get a good result using a duet and an SM57.

the only person in this thread that will know the right answer is the OP himself. So let him take the info we've presented and make his own decision. Don't argue with me or try to convince me why you are so awesome and so right in your ways. And last I checked in the business world it's very important to know what your costs are because that is the difference between making good and bad decisions. It'd be stupid of me to spend 500k on a business venture if it takes me 10 years to break even vs another business venture that costs me 450k and breaks even in 2 years with less risk involved.

I think a bad decision is the decision you don't think about. So sit down think about what the best decision would be. Maybe buy the $300 mic at a place with a 30 day return/exchange policy. If the $300 mic isn't it and you think the more expensive one is sell your Robbie and buy the better mic.

[Bob Vinsick]

I have to say that all my mics are sound better through my Robbie than my other pres for recording my vocals. Makes everything sound big. I own some top pres and have owned many other top pres in the past. I like the Robbie as well as the Kiwi.

[KeithMoonwannabe]

Originally Posted by jslevin

I'd sell the Robbie and put it all into a mic. AT4060 seems like maybe the right fit for your needs and price range.

The Duet's preamps aren't great but they're okay, and the Robbie really isn't a difference-maker of a preamp.

Just a shot in the dark here, but you really need to stop buying gear on the basis of what looks cool. The more cool and stylish and "Apple" pro audio gear looks, the more it's being aimed at the trust fund or Guitar Center crowd that doesn't have the experience or ears to tell what actually SOUNDS good.

As a counter-example, API makes fantastic preamps, but they look like boring industrial equipment. Same with John Hardy, Daking, etc. Think about it.

JSL

preamps are never difference makers in recordings like the way you think they are. they make subtle changes.

Difference makers are rooms, singers, sound engineers, mic selection, mic placement, talent, etc.

In the right hands a great recording can be made using a Tascam 4 track portastudio using a Shure SM57.

While in the wrong hands the nicest studio running PTHD, SSL, Neve, prized 10k+ mics, etc can make a bad recording.

Gear doesn't make recordings good PEOPLE do. It's obvious you have limited experience with the equipment being discussed. It's a case of the blind leading the blind here imho.

[Stepwise Sound]

Keep the Robbie. I have it. I think it works great, particularly on vocals. Realize it doesn't have a HPF filter though -- brilliant really that BLUE makes mics AND a pre, none of which have a Low cut filter.

Pair it with either (or both):

1. an Sm7B
or
2. Audio Technica 4040 or 4050.

These mics have HPF. They work brilliantly with the Robbie. They sound great and give two different flavors.

Sm7B will work better with a untreated / poorly treated room.

Or hey, if $300 needs to be stretched, get a used AT4040 and a SM-58 You will have the airy condenser sound and the dynamic sound.

Simple really -- and don't let anyone make you feel bad about your setup because you will have all the tools you need to make a great recording if you know what you're doing.

Take the pledge: "I have actually used all the gear discussed above."

Yeah, I own all these mics and the preamp.

[jslevin]

Originally Posted by KeithMoonwannabe

so basically you are saying it's a good idea to sell a $900 preamp to get enough money to buy a mic that's marginally better when the actual problem is likely the performer and the engineer talent. You are assuming that a better mic is his need. I'm saying the OP needs to sit back and think objectively before taking any action at all.

Regardless of what his talent issues may be, I simply think his money could be better invested than it is at the moment. He asked, and I answered. Yes, I think he should have more money invested in his mic than in his preamp!

Do you want to talk about sunk costs now you've lost half the money you've put into something that you sold to get no noticeable improvement on end result. Did you sit and think of that possibility. But cool now you have a more expensive mic.

If you can't grasp the "sunk cost" concept then there's no point trying to have an intelligent conversation with you.

Just to help you along: The money you're saying he's "lost," he's already lost it. The Robbie is worth whatever it's worth. If that's less than what he paid for it, then the difference is already lost, i.e., "sunk."

It's not worth worrying about what's already been lost, only what you've still got and what you could have instead.

I'm saying since he already has a Duet and he already has a Robbie hold onto them get their useful life out of them. Selling something like the Robbie will only get about half of what he paid new for it realistically.

Again, you don't understand sunk cost and possibly should never make any decisions involving money, ever again. (Somebody get this guy a blind trust!)

It isn't his goal in life to get the "useful life" out of his gear. That is not a virtue; it's just an idea on which you fixate. It's his goal at the moment to make the best recordings he can.

Do you honestly think that the difference between a good and bad recording is really going to be buying a well selected $300 mic to a mic like an AT4060 or a Mojave MA200? Because I don't.

Do YOU honestly think the difference will be keeping the BLUE Robbie?

Again, my concept here is very simple. He's better off putting more of his money into the mic and less into the preamp. It's silly to have an $800 preamp when your best mic is $300. That is my informed opinion.

Do you want to buy gear based on lust or do you want to buy gear for practicality.

Practicality. 100%.

Because I can honestly tell you from experience it'd be bad advice to just tell this guy to go buy shit and sell shit just for the sake of doing it.

Well, first, this guy is probably smarter than you are. Second, I'm not telling him to buy and sell anything just for the hell of it. I'm advising him that he probably should allocate his resources slightly differently to get better results -- as he himself suggested maybe he should.

You want a decent mic look for a used C214, used KSM32, used AT4050 or AR4047. There ya go any of those can be had for $300-$400 used just about any day of the week. Honestly a mic like a Shure SM7b wouldn't be a bad choice either considering his rig and the style he wants to do.

I'm familiar with most of those, and I would agree that they're fine values. I just think he gains more by doubling his mic budget than he does by keeping the Robbie.

But the bottom line is the Robbie is a good pre and it's usable for a variety of things.

And the other bottom line is that the Duet has a decent pre and it's usable for a variety of things, too. Why you decided to start babbling about other preamps that are $1000 or more, I have no idea. Totally off-topic.

I'm a college student paying his way through school on his own measily income. Music is my hobby not my career.

Whatever, take some accounting and business classes. Hell, take a class on logic theory. Seriously, it will help you.

It's fine to disagree with my opinion and you are entitled to your own but don't discredit mine as bad advice when I can easily say the same about yours.

Despite the egalitarian nature of web forums, not all opinions are created equal -- not all opinions are equally well informed or equally well thought out. This is an example of that. We can have different opinions on equipment all day long, "YMMV," but when you tell people to base their decisions on sunk cost, you are just plain giving bad advice, period.

On sunk cost, there is no "YMMV." It's just foolish to consider it, ever.

and heck if he knows what he's doing he can get a good result using a duet and an SM57.

Exactly. So he doesn't need the Robbie. You agree with me!

And last I checked in the business world it's very important to know what your costs are because that is the difference between making good and bad decisions.

And now you are giving business advice! Priceless!

I've been running my own business for almost ten years. My studio is thriving and in fact about to expand. Maybe -- just maybe -- you actually should pipe down and pay attention to what I'm saying here.

I think a bad decision is the decision you don't think about.

I try to think a lot about every decision. Still, this axiom also is often true: "More is lost by indecision than by wrong decision." People should be thoughtful, but they also shouldn't be afraid to pull the trigger.

preamps are never difference makers in recordings like the way you think they are. they make subtle changes.

You clearly have no idea what I think. I agree that preamps generally aren't big difference makers. I'm saying that the Duet preamp isn't bad enough, and the Robbie isn't great enough, that it makes a huge difference, since after all, it's only a preamp anyway, and preamps aren't the real difference-makers.

I think having a nicer mic will make more of a difference. This is the entire basis of my recommendation. If you could let go of your obsession with "losing money" by selling something, you'd actually be on my side of this.

Difference makers are rooms, singers, sound engineers, mic selection, mic placement, talent, etc.

Of course.

In the right hands a great recording can be made using a Tascam 4 track portastudio using a Shure SM57.

A "great" recording on a cassette? Probably not. But a nice recording, sure.

I say something very similar this all the time, that I will only hire engineers who can make a nice recording with a 4-track, a 57, and one very talented musician.

While in the wrong hands the nicest studio running PTHD, SSL, Neve, prized 10k+ mics, etc can make a bad recording.

In the wrong hands, any gear can and almost certainly will make a bad recording.

Gear doesn't make recordings good PEOPLE do. It's obvious you have limited experience with the equipment being discussed. It's a case of the blind leading the blind here imho.

Your "o" isn't nearly "h" enough. I'm qualified to teach a class in this stuff, and it's not at all clear that you'd be able to pass it.

You need to spend more time reading and less time posting.

JSL

[Stepwise Sound]

Horray!
Different people have different opinions!
Everyone's right and everyone's wrong.
Let's hold hands and sing this song.


(just trying to lighten the mood)

[KeithMoonwannabe]

I'm not trying to have a battle I'm just showing another side.

Personally I don't see why the Robbie was purchased before the mic in all honesty. But none the less the OP has what he has. If it were me I'd pick my mic and then pick a pre to pair with it.

It's obvious we both have different trains of thought as stepwise studios has said neither of us is right and neither of us is wrong we have different outlooks and we both have strong opinions. How about instead of arguing with each other we try to use our differing opinions to better guide him to make a more solid decision.

I've purchased and sold countless gear in my life as I'm sure you have. I'm just saying a mic and a preamp like those being discussed really aren't prize items. I don't think a well picked $300-$500 mic (which he can afford without selling a thing) is going to be that much worse than a mic like the Mojave or the 4060. I also don't think getting rid of the Robbie and getting one of those better league mics is going to make the night and day difference either.

Personally I don't think either decision will be better or worse mainly because there are probably other factors and issues that need to be addressed to achieve a great recording. I think the result of either decision will likely yield the same outcome.

I'm really not trying to start a pissing contest with you. And I used to be more liberal about pulling the trigger on things like this but it landed me in a crappy financial situation when things didn't go my way because I overextended myself and spent too much had a failed business due to the economy not as many people came because it's more of a luxury. So I'm more cautious about spending and pulling the trigger now because I've tried to learn from my mistakes. Congratulations on your successful business venture that's awesome to hear people are doing well and expanding during these tough times. I'm definitely not afraid to take risks give me half a million dollars and I will start opening my restaurant tomorrow.

I simply think we'd be better off agreeing to disagree and not even that because I really wasn't disagreeing with you I was just showing an alternative point of view.

And I do understand how sunk costs work in the regards you've so kindly illustrated. My point is it is money wasted if it's something that never got used. And it would be money wasted if the gear he replaces with doesn't really make a difference either. I think it would get more use and possibly make more return on investment should it be kept longer. It's really more of a buyers market than a sellers market and I hate seeing people lose nice gear like that for pennies on the dollar. And since it's a less well known preamp people aren't going to pay top dollar for it. It's a very specialized piece and it's pretty new to the market I'd imagine $400-$500 takes it realistically. I do understand the concepts of accounting/financing/business management I go to college for that.

But bringing that all up is kind of irrelevant for the scale of decision we are talking about especially since it's not a commercial studio where this gear is paying for itself, etc.

I think searching for a mic like an AT4050/AT4047 or a KSM32 and pairing it with the Robbie would make a pretty nice low end vocal chain. But that's my personal opinion.

I also agree that simply pairing the pres in the Duet with a nicer mic such as an AT4060 (one of my favorite mics btw) or a Mojave MA200 would also be a pretty nice low end vocal chain. Which is a shared opinion.

But we are overlooking the room, the source and how he/she/they work with recording equipment, the material, how well the OP works from a sound engineering perspective to know how each of these pieces will indeed impact the final product.

And without knowing that type of info it's really not up to either of us to say what to do we can just provide our opinions.

Whose to say the OP will have any better of a final product using a $100-$200 vs a $300-$500 vs a $800 mic? And whose to say the OP will have a better product using the Duet's pres or the Robbie or any other pre for that matter?

This is gonna have to be stuff that is tested and determined by the OP.

I've always just used the pres I've had built into consoles or interfaces personally and tried to invest in the best mics possible. But I've never had an exuberant budget for that stuff. The nicest mics I've ever owned for my project studio have been about $600 a piece (I had a pair of AT4050 at one time and a Sterling Audio ST79).

Aside from that my mics are typically in the $100-$500 range a piece. Mainly because I've never had the money to allocate to better stuff and I know that with the pres and environments I've had to work with from home/apts I really wouldn't maximize return on investment either in the listening or financial dept.

That's why in a way I think it'd be silly to spend close to a thousand dollars on a mic when the environment and engineer may not even be able to pull that extra something out of the mic. To me the jump from a $500 mic to a $1k mic has never been that enormous. Yes I can hear a difference don't get me wrong. But in the right hands neither will do you wrong or hinder your performance. And at the end of the day you are giving your music to average joes not to people that are trained musicians with good ears. How many people do you honestly think are going to notice the difference between a recording featuring one mic vs another?

That is all I'm trying to say is that perhaps forget about spending this entire budget or selling the Robbie to double your budget is necessary to get the result you are looking for. Perhaps you could get a middle ground condenser like one I mentioned, sell the Robbie (if you don't need it) and keep the extra cash and use it for something else like room treatment or something non music related. Just because you have money to spend doesn't mean it needs to be spent.

[uncle duncan]

Originally Posted by univ28

s I really liked the way the Blue Kiwi sounded with my voice but its out of my price range. Ive used Studio projects c3 , akg c3000b and the neumann tlm103 bu none of thise mics did much for me. ....

Working backwards, the c300b is bright on top with a scooped midrange. The TLM 103 is really bright on top. So is the SP C3. If you don't like the sound of these three mics, what do they have in common? They're all really bright on top, which could have the affect of thinning out the voice. The Kiwi appears to be virtually flat, with less of a HF peak than the other mics you've tried. If this is the sound you like, look for a mic with that type of response.

The MXL V67g would be a good candidate, but you'd want to get it modded to get rid of the hashy high end. I just got a modded V67g (with the stock capsule intact) and it sounds virtually identical to a U87ai, which sounds very similar to a Kiwi. (Changing the capsule during the mod would totally defeat the purpose - at least if you're going for the U87/Kiwi sound.)

The AT4050 might be worth a try. It's fairly neutral with a respectable high end, although there is a little bit of a 6k peak going on that doesn't show up in the Kiwi. The new Neumann TLM 102 might also work, but they're going for $699 right now. It would be much warmer/less harsh than the TLM 103, so don't let the model # scare you off.

Another mystery mic getting some buzz lately is made by Miktek in Nashville, but they seem to want to keep their response curves a secret, so the only way to find out what they sound like is to actually get your hands on one. They do get rave reviews.

If the right mic for you is over your budget, it might be worth letting the Robbie go to achieve that perfect match, since the right mic is going to have much more of a dramatic affect on your sound than the choice of preamp you run it through.

[Chris Lago]

I'd say duet with a better mic. But in all honestly, you will end up buying the Robbie in the long run. It's a great mic pre for vocals, better than the 737 pre-wise in my books.

[KeithMoonwannabe]

I should also add that if the Kiwi really is THE MIC the OP wants I don't think it'd really be worth while to sell the Robbie or to spend a huge budget on a mic that he really doesn't want.

I'd say take the conservative route buy something decent that will get you by that has less of the harsh high end I think an AT4047 or KSM32 would probably fit the bill perfectly and be in your price range used. A modded V67G could also fit the bill perfectly.

Then save up til you can get a Kiwi then you'll have the mic you wanted and you have a nice pre to run through.

Honestly though just go find a music store with all these mics and try em all out. I'd probably say take your duet and robbie with you to really compare results also.

[jslevin]

He didn't say his goal was to buy the Kiwi. He said his voice sounded great through it, but obviously there are other mics he hasn't heard that might be as good, or better, even for less money.

What you are doing is just twisting every possible argument around to the conclusion you made at the start: Keep what you already bought.

This is the opposite of rational analysis and good decision-making. It's obsessive-compulsive rationalization. Paragraph after paragraph after paragraph of it.

And I used to be more liberal about pulling the trigger on things like this but it landed me in a crappy financial situation when things didn't go my way because I overextended myself and spent too much had a failed business due to the economy not as many people came because it's more of a luxury.

What we're talking about has NOTHING TO DO with overextending. He has a set budget and some current assets, and he's trying to figure out what to spend, buy and sell.

He's working within his means here. The fact that you didn't is irrelevant.

You are, again, taking every angle and situation and twisting it around to fit your limited experience and understanding. He is not you, and his situation is not yours.

I'm definitely not afraid to take risks give me half a million dollars and I will start opening my restaurant tomorrow.

If someone is giving you the half a million, then you're not really taking a risk. Nobody gave me jack shit -- no trust fund, no drug money, no sugar-mama. I took a little money I made in another business and invested in opening my studio -- lean and mean, for the most part.

The economy has hit everybody hard, definitely including me and my family. It is possible, however, that both the economy was bad and your business decisions were bad.

And I do understand how sunk costs work in the regards you've so kindly illustrated. My point is it is money wasted if it's something that never got used.

The second sentence proves that the first sentence isn't true.

I'm done with this part of the thread. We're not helping the OP, and unless you're prepared to step back from your obsessive thought processes, nobody is going to be able to help you, either. The most powerful argument you're making here is that we should stop funding colleges with taxpayer money, because obviously, your business and accounting classes are going totally to waste.

JSL

[Critique]

Wow, this thread is making me go insane!!

The OP has a pre that is probably worth about $600. The ~$300 sunk cost from the original purchase price is indeed irrelevant, even if the OP bought his robbie used at the "market price." If we are thinking purely in the present, then I believe it would be a much better decision to put that $600 into a mid-range mic, and record out of the duet.

However, as I am sure we all know, eventually he is going to want the mid-range mic AND a better pre (at least this is what happened to me). If the OP wants to buy back the old pre, it is going to cost more than $600. Even if the market value is the same, there are going to be transaction costs associated with buying the pre again for $600. And since everyone has decided that this is somehow a lesson in microeconomics, there will be opportunity costs associated with the transaction as well, because the OP will have to spend time and effort reacquiring the pre. Time which could have been spend in money-earning endeavors (potentially). There is also a risk that the market price of this preamp will have changed during this period. And how liquid is the Blue Robbie preamp market anyways?

See how annoying it is when I try to incorporate an economics lesson into my post?

The bottom line is, if time stands still, selling the pre is a better bet. However, if the OP wants to think about investing in the future, there will be less cost associated with keeping the preamp now.

This is of course sacrificing the quality of the OP's recording in the present. So one could think of the time and money associated with selling and then re-buying the pre as interest, which allows the OP to have better recordings now AND in the future.

Hey look, I'm doing it again. The annoying irrelevant business lecture thing.

The truth is, buying recording equipment is always going to involve lots of extra costs and bad decisions. This is because we are trying to analyze a very subjective thing. It is the painful truth about being in such an industry.