Getting a proper ambience with PODs, drum dims, etc, and no proper room

mjw63 · 15th December 2009

I do all of my recordings with line 6 pod sims, then use superior drummer or ezdrummer for the drums, and obviously there is no sense that anything occurred in the same space. My question is to how to get things to sound cohesive and in the same space?

To get that, I've been using a reverb bus with, say, a tight studio preset or some kind of natural room, then putting different amounts one each track (none or nearly none on bass, more on vocals and guitar). I'm never quite convinced though- is there something more to do? Should I for example remove the room sound from the drum program entirely and try and recreate a room sound using the same reverb? Should I try and make sure that no ambience is being applied to the guitars by the POD?

Horking My Lunch · 15th December 2009

Well, you may have to make a narrow carve where you see fit. As far as EZdrummer goes, you could EQ the separate tracks, but for the most part it's going to sound the same. Just try working with the velocity for a while.

I also don't use much of the EZdrummer room.

JCRockit · 15th December 2009

Go for Steve Slate drums BEST virtual room sound in any drum program Ive heard. I usually use the Eventide and apply varying amounts of ambience from different tracks to stereo buss for glue. Also using stereo mic techniques can create real room ambience on things.

mjw63 · 16th December 2009

Cool, cheers. It sounds vaguely like what I'm doing JCRockit. THe room sound is pretty on on SD2, but I guess my problem is trying to get whatever reverb patch I used on everything else to sound the same. I guess I'll solo the SD2 room, then play with the reverb til I mimic it.

I checked out the Steve Slate website and they sound amazing but I can't justify buying another drum package!

Horking my Lunch- I'm not sure I understand you completely. Do you mean EQ the room sound?

ljefe · 16th December 2009

I've been unable to dial in a close approximation of the Avatar room. I've tried using Wave Arts Masterverb, Sanford Reverb, and IRs in Pristine Space, but I just can't nail it.

I really wish Toontrack had thought to capture impulses of these great, vanishing drum tracking rooms. IRs of the ambient mics would have been a nice touch. Then we could get the X drums, as well as other tracks, to share the same space.

Big missed opportunity.

mjw63 · 16th December 2009

So is taking the SD2 output dry and faking a room sound better? It seems a waste of the excellent room sound provided but may get things to sit together.

I suspect I'm just not clever enough to make it sound good,

Bounce · 16th December 2009

If you like the room sound of the virtual drums, one thought is to duplicate the drum track(s) dry, without the room mics. Run the dry drums out to a reverb (maybe try an IR based verb). Then while A/B'ing the wet drums track to the newly bussed reverbed drums, try to match the reverb on the new drum track to the track with the original room mics on. This way you can really hear what you are emulating A to B :-) This could get you in the ballpark.

One option here would be to solo the room mic channels on the original tracks then A/B against the new drums with all the new drums running at fully wet (100%) into the new reverb (you could try the reverb as an insert instead of bussing). This way you are emulating what the room mics on the original are hearing, depending on your bleed adjustments on the original in your drum software. You will probably need to eq your new reverb to try to match tonality of the reverb.

Once you get a verb that is similar to your drums, you can use that as your initial soundstage for the "band" including your PODs and whatnot.

mjw63 · 17th December 2009

Bounce- that's a really excellent suggestion and I can't believe I hadn't thought of it before!

Horking My Lunch · 17th December 2009

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjw63

Horking my Lunch- I'm not sure I understand you completely. Do you mean EQ the room sound?

Partly, but mostly the single drums (snare, toms, etc.). It's weird, I don't know if it's just me, but there's something in the EZdrummer room sound that doesn't sit right with me.

mjw63 · 17th December 2009

Ah ok then I get you. I find the same thing, which is why SD2 was such a nice surprise.

I think the Nashville kit is very good, but I would normally substitute the kick for something else, and I usually EQ the snare and compress it heavily to make it a bit more snappy. The Nashville kit can be too bright and flimsy.

15th December 2009	#1
mjw63 Gear Head Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 52 Thread Starter	Getting a proper ambience with PODs, drum dims, etc, and no proper room I do all of my recordings with line 6 pod sims, then use superior drummer or ezdrummer for the drums, and obviously there is no sense that anything occurred in the same space. My question is to how to get things to sound cohesive and in the same space? To get that, I've been using a reverb bus with, say, a tight studio preset or some kind of natural room, then putting different amounts one each track (none or nearly none on bass, more on vocals and guitar). I'm never quite convinced though- is there something more to do? Should I for example remove the room sound from the drum program entirely and try and recreate a room sound using the same reverb? Should I try and make sure that no ambience is being applied to the guitars by the POD?

16th December 2009	#7
Bounce Lives for gear Join Date: May 2005 Location: Caleefornya Posts: 837	If you like the room sound of the virtual drums, one thought is to duplicate the drum track(s) dry, without the room mics. Run the dry drums out to a reverb (maybe try an IR based verb). Then while A/B'ing the wet drums track to the newly bussed reverbed drums, try to match the reverb on the new drum track to the track with the original room mics on. This way you can really hear what you are emulating A to B :-) This could get you in the ballpark. One option here would be to solo the room mic channels on the original tracks then A/B against the new drums with all the new drums running at fully wet (100%) into the new reverb (you could try the reverb as an insert instead of bussing). This way you are emulating what the room mics on the original are hearing, depending on your bleed adjustments on the original in your drum software. You will probably need to eq your new reverb to try to match tonality of the reverb. Once you get a verb that is similar to your drums, you can use that as your initial soundstage for the "band" including your PODs and whatnot. __________________ McKay Garner Production-Mixing-Composition San Francisco-Los Angeles-Anywhere http://www.mckaygarner.com

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15th December 2009	#2
Horking My Lunch Gear nut Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: SF Bay Area, CA Posts: 103	Well, you may have to make a narrow carve where you see fit. As far as EZdrummer goes, you could EQ the separate tracks, but for the most part it's going to sound the same. Just try working with the velocity for a while. I also don't use much of the EZdrummer room.

15th December 2009	#3
JCRockit Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: NYC Posts: 986	Go for Steve Slate drums BEST virtual room sound in any drum program Ive heard. I usually use the Eventide and apply varying amounts of ambience from different tracks to stereo buss for glue. Also using stereo mic techniques can create real room ambience on things.

16th December 2009	#5
ljefe Gear nut Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 131	I've been unable to dial in a close approximation of the Avatar room. I've tried using Wave Arts Masterverb, Sanford Reverb, and IRs in Pristine Space, but I just can't nail it. I really wish Toontrack had thought to capture impulses of these great, vanishing drum tracking rooms. IRs of the ambient mics would have been a nice touch. Then we could get the X drums, as well as other tracks, to share the same space. Big missed opportunity.

17th December 2009	#8
mjw63 Gear Head Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 52 Thread Starter	Bounce- that's a really excellent suggestion and I can't believe I hadn't thought of it before!