Death Metal Mixing questions

[superiorsound]

Okay so I have never recorded DEATH METAL! I have been listening to some tracks recently to get a feel for it as I have a session next week. I figured what better than to jump in the fire I guess worst case scenerio it suxs and Ill give them their money back. How the heck do they get the drums to play so fast are they sequenced? Also any other Death Metal tips? They asked me if I had drum triggers ...............what the F*ck are drum triggers? In advance thanks for your help!thumbsup

[David-Morpheus]

you gonna need drum trigers. well you don't but it saves a hell lot of time while editing. drumagog is your friend but prepare that you'll have to isolate evey hit with strip silence if you don't record the triggers.

You need to get the drums clicky - not much space for decaying in fast metal or otherwise it will just muddy up the things. gated reverb, gated tom hits are your friends there. depending on the speed of the songs you'll have to dial in the right snare & kick sound - they have to be present and punchy. be carefull to get the lowend right.

guitars need a lot of work, recommend a 5150 or rectifier with a tube screamer type pedal in front (maxon does some nice ones). the guitars are less distorted than you think. also quad track the rhytm sections (2 takes left and 2 takes on the right). If you have sans amp use it for the double takes under the tube amps.

sans amp is your friend also when it comes to bass guitar - run a clean amp, DI and distorted sansamp lines and then blend to taste. the harmonics created by the distortion will help the bass to come through the guitars.

and give a sm7 or sm57 to the vocalist and compress the crap out of the vocals.

[superiorsound]

Hey man thanks! what drum triggers do you recommend? I have a couple sm7bs and sm57s so thats cool. Also the drum software? whats that going to do?

Thanks,
Frank

[superiorsound]

im stupid!

[AnthropicRecords]

drum triggers are essentially transducers that rest against the drum head, and when the head is struck the signal "triggers" a sample from a sound module or computer. without the samples triggers are just contact mics.

i personally wouldn't worry about using them if the band doesn't already trigger. if their drummer isn't used to triggering, and he goes into the studio and there are triggers, he will A.) be thrown off by the sound coming back through his headphones, and/or B.) sound sloppy. the band might not be playing all that fast anyway if they don't already trigger.

a lot of young metal bands think they need to trigger to get the sound they want just because they heard someone say something about it.

one thing that all death metal records have in common is that the kick drum always bottoms out the mix. find the fundamental of the kick and use that as the anchor, then scoop the low mid out of the kick sound and you'll have a nice little spot for the bass guitar. you may even roll off some of the sub in the bass guitar.

when you mix you will most likely need to automate the snare at certain points, or even ride the fader manually. careful compression on the kick and snare will go a long way. gating or "strip editing" the toms may not be a bad idea, but it's not essential.

i suggest listening to samples of older death metal records, which have nice, fat drum sounds that sound natural. any Swedish record made at Sunlight Studios, i.e. Desultory, Dismember, plus Deicide's s/t or Legion records, and definitely check out Suffocation's Effigy of the Forgotten.

tell the band to make sure that when they stand in a room in front of their guitar amp, that the sound coming out sounds like what they expect to hear on the recording. in my opinion, the number one snag in recording metal bands is a guitarist who's guitar sound is terrible, but who expects to hear something totally different coming through the microphone and out of the monitors.

i hope some of this is helpful!

[sevendaysoff]

forget the triggers. strip silence takes about 2 minutes per track if that.

drumagog and a few good samples and the drums are a wrap. bass drum is key here. get that clicky sound from the sample then side chain a signal generator to the BD to get some extra thump.

double track guitars (wide panning and double track each take) I'll usually keep the leads right up the middle unless there are 2 parts playing off each other.

a little distortion on the bass guitar can help it cut through the mix. if the player is good enough i will double track the bass w/ pick & finger for more tight low end.

sidechain kick & bass so that kick can cut through everything else.

touch of distortion on vox as well. i sometimes like to use a dynamic mic for this genre if the singer has good enough mic technique. (to stand still)

[David-Morpheus]

Originally Posted by sevendaysoff

forget the triggers. strip silence takes about 2 minutes per track if that.

Not really when you are dealing with fast double kick riffs, blast beats, fills and so on.

One of the big problems with death metal drummers is dynamics and consistency. When they play a quick tom fill they hit the first toms like orangutans and the last tom hit is sometimes barely recognizable with tab to transient - it's so week. you'll have to automate drumagog and edit like crazy to get a even and natural performance from that.

On the other hand when you record the trigger hits (i record them on another audio track, don't use any drum brains or anything like that) - simply treat the trigger as another mic you'll immediatly see the hists without any bleed. Saves a lot of time during editing.

It can be done without the triggers but it's a huge timesaver.

[Sacha]

Agree about the triggers, they are a must for modern hyper blast stuff. DDrum are the industry standard and work pretty well. You will most likely use 100% samples on at least the kick drum. Another thing I didn't see mentioned is recording to a click if that isn't obvious.

There are lots of good tips on the Ultimate Metal forum - Andy Sneap and Neil Kernon both post there and they are excellent producers in this style.

[cavern]

E.Q. between 200 and 1k is gonna be essential as this genre crowds the center like crazy. the mud builds quickly in the middle.

[James Meeker]

Some tips about metal recording:

1.) Your main concern for the drums is getting a good stereo image of the cymbals for the overheads, and good clean close mic sounds for sample replacing. Almost everything else is going to be sample replaced to some degree. When placing mics ask yourself--"is this an AUDIO mic, or a TRIGGER mic?" If it's both, make sure it sounds good and delivers a clean signal for triggering.

2.) Track drums first, rhythm guitar second, bass guitar third, vocals fourth and lead guitars last. Any synth/keyboard or other overdubs save until last.

3.) Take the song one section at a time to a click track. Due to the shifting time signatures and tempos, this can be a pain in the butt. Leave about 8 measures between each section and assemble it at the end--right before doing solos and vocals.

4.) Drums should be "snapped to grid" using Beat Detective before laying down guitars or anything else.

5.) Sample replace kick, snare and toms. Chances are you're going to use none of the original kick drum, mix the sample with the snare, and use most of the toms. Choose samples wisely--for the kick you obviously want clicky and deep, for snare it should sound full for the blast beats, and for the toms it should have a lot of attack/definition.

6.) Get your guitar sounds and tracks before bass. The bass guitar sound should be built around their guitar sound--not the other way around. Guitar sound is THE most critical thing for this genre.

7.) Make sure to get a clean DI of the guitars and bass guitar that is IN PHASE. You may need this later down the line for additional clarity/thickness when you are mixing. Run it to an amp simulator and mix it with the original signal. Many times, you are going to need a clearer, less distorted sound to mix with the real guitar for definition. Either way, this greatly expands your mix options.

8.) If the guitarists are good I'd quadruple track the guitars. Two hard L and two hard R.

9.) Pick the best guitarist to track all the rhythms for maximum tightness. (This can cause "issues" within the band and towards you.)

10.) If the bassist is weak (very common in death metal), have the best rhythm guitar play these parts. This can also cause some problems with fragile egos as well.

Myself, I won't track a metal band unless they are committed to doing things right from the beginning, and have a pile of money to do things correctly. I don't think I'd touch a metal record for under 8K these days because the "production end" on my behalf is so critical, and such a burden to ME.

[lionaudio]

Death metal drummers, for the most part, actually play that fast.. If you are recording a band that is great, you shouldn't need to use beat detective on their drums. Many engineers are into sound replacement software when it comes to death metal, but you can seriously make a great death metal recording without it if you plan ahead. First, the overheads are for cymbals only in death metal.. So high pass the shit out of them. Each piece of the kit should have it's own mic. A sennheiser e602 on the kick is great. 421's on the toms are great. a 57 on the snare is great. Gating, compression and eq are key for death metal drums.. the idea is to set each to make each piece of the kit sound like it is as clean and isolated as possible. I would also suggest a mono room mic that you will use to mix behind the spot mic's in order to glue the drum sound together.. Death metal drums, for the most part, are all lows and highs, with very little mid. Guitars.. A good dynamic mic on the speaker.. A decent ribbon at least 6 inches back and in phase with the dynamic.. you can exploit the proximity effect of the dynamic to give the low mid chunk, and blend the smoothed out ribbon for size and a tone that is heavy but not so abrasive that no one will listen to it twice.. yes, 2 passes on each side seems to be the magic number.. bass.. SansAmp bass driver as a DI and also mic a 15 or a 10 in. speaker. If you have a Yamaha subkick or something like it, use it on the speaker.. if not, use the 602 or a beta 52 or whatever you normally use for recording low end.. re-amping the DI to some sort of distortion effect box really adds some evil to the mix. Vocals.. Dynamic mic hand held and also a LDC at the same time. Blend these.. then do it again if the screamer is good enough to match his vocals and stay articulate.. Tons of great death metal albums have been made without triggers or sound replacement software.. It's totally possible to still make them that way if you want to really learn it rather than letting the computer do all of the work for you.

[superiorsound]

Originally Posted by James Meeker

Some tips about metal recording:

1.) Your main concern for the drums is getting a good stereo image of the cymbals for the overheads, and good clean close mic sounds for sample replacing. Almost everything else is going to be sample replaced to some degree. When placing mics ask yourself--"is this an AUDIO mic, or a TRIGGER mic?" If it's both, make sure it sounds good and delivers a clean signal for triggering.

2.) Track drums first, rhythm guitar second, bass guitar third, vocals fourth and lead guitars last. Any synth/keyboard or other overdubs save until last.

3.) Take the song one section at a time to a click track. Due to the shifting time signatures and tempos, this can be a pain in the butt. Leave about 8 measures between each section and assemble it at the end--right before doing solos and vocals.

4.) Drums should be "snapped to grid" using Beat Detective before laying down guitars or anything else.

5.) Sample replace kick, snare and toms. Chances are you're going to use none of the original kick drum, mix the sample with the snare, and use most of the toms. Choose samples wisely--for the kick you obviously want clicky and deep, for snare it should sound full for the blast beats, and for the toms it should have a lot of attack/definition.

6.) Get your guitar sounds and tracks before bass. The bass guitar sound should be built around their guitar sound--not the other way around. Guitar sound is THE most critical thing for this genre.

7.) Make sure to get a clean DI of the guitars and bass guitar that is IN PHASE. You may need this later down the line for additional clarity/thickness when you are mixing. Run it to an amp simulator and mix it with the original signal. Many times, you are going to need a clearer, less distorted sound to mix with the real guitar for definition. Either way, this greatly expands your mix options.

8.) If the guitarists are good I'd quadruple track the guitars. Two hard L and two hard R.

9.) Pick the best guitarist to track all the rhythms for maximum tightness. (This can cause "issues" within the band and towards you.)

10.) If the bassist is weak (very common in death metal), have the best rhythm guitar play these parts. This can also cause some problems with fragile egos as well.

Myself, I won't track a metal band unless they are committed to doing things right from the beginning, and have a pile of money to do things correctly. I don't think I'd touch a metal record for under 8K these days because the "production end" on my behalf is so critical, and such a burden to ME.

I would love to make 8 grand a month at my studio! lol Thanks for the valuable input.

[James Meeker]

Originally Posted by lionaudio

Death metal drummers, for the most part, actually play that fast.. If you are recording a band that is great, you shouldn't need to use beat detective on their drums.

*IF* the drummer is great.

Generally speaking, most drummers you find playing death metal are pretty good--but not great. My experience is they need help.

Heavy metal, especially in the modern context, is *ALL* about perfect time. When a band is jamming a tune at 220 bpm, a few milliseconds is OFF TIME.

Also, I'm not suggesting modifying the tempo or speeding up the recording. Most death metal drummers play fast... it's their timing, control and intensity that they can have problems with.

Originally Posted by lionaudio

Many engineers are into sound replacement software when it comes to death metal, but you can seriously make a great death metal recording without it if you plan ahead.

If you like the snare disappearing during blast beats, or like the volume of the kicks wavering depending on if they are playing 16th notes or 32nd notes double kick.

Originally Posted by lionaudio

It's totally possible to still make them that way if you want to really learn it rather than letting the computer do all of the work for you.

Sorry, but claiming that using technology like triggers/sample replacement is due to engineer incompetence is just WRONG. If you've listened to any modern death metal records you'd realize that these techniques are the NORM for a properly produced death metal record.

Honestly, for that genre of music, I think NOT using that stuff would end up sounding more like a demo and not pleasing the clients. It may stroke the engineer's ego to not have to rely on those tools as a "crutch", but if the result is a mediocre record that the clients don't want--what was the point? All the big producers in this genre seem to use these a lot as well, this is the standard production toolkit for the music it seems.

[Bierce85]

I've got one little tip someone might find useful if using the steven slate sample library or another library that lets you choose between rim shots and head-only snare hits.

Use the head-only ones, especially if the drumming style is fast and hard hitting. I find that when combining the original snare with a sample, the head-only samples posses a fullness that the rimshots don't, and also sound less sampled in the mix due to the slightly more blurry attack which doesn't conflict with the original sound as much. The rim part of the overall sound can also sometimes be a little harsh if you use a rim-shotted sample, especially if you keep the original snare. They seem sometimes add to each other creating a sound with too much rim attack at between 3-6 khz or so. You'd think for maximum punchiness a rimshot sample would be the best option, but I find the original snare sound (even if it's just from the OHs) is usually lacking that fatness that comes from a well-struck drum resonating at about 150-250 hz more than it's lacking attack. That fullness is more present in a head-only snare hit. Using the original sound for it's attack and a nice fat head only sample for the body seems to create something better than both sounds on their own.. sort of a "sum greater than the parts" effect.

[lionaudio]

Sorry, but claiming that using technology like triggers/sample replacement is due to engineer incompetence is just WRONG. If you've listened to any modern death metal records you'd realize that these techniques are the NORM for a properly produced death metal record.

Honestly, for that genre of music, I think NOT using that stuff would end up sounding more like a demo and not pleasing the clients. It may stroke the engineer's ego to not have to rely on those tools as a "crutch", but if the result is a mediocre record that the clients don't want--what was the point? All the big producers in this genre seem to use these a lot as well, this is the standard production toolkit for the music it seems.[/QUOTE]
In no way do I think that using triggers is a sign of incompetence.. I have used triggers before not just in engineering but in my band as well.. What I was trying to get across is that alot of engineers are coming up and never learning how to make records that involve careful mic placement, gating, compression, and EQ. He said he was unfamiliar with recording and mixing death metal, so I think that learning how to do it without replacing the sounds right off the bat would be beneficial to him. As far as needing to sound replace so that snares don't get lost, this is why I said to properly gate, compress, and EQ. It is NOT impossible to make a great sounding death metal album without sound replacing.. I do agree that many death metal drummers do lack the ability to be consistent. Many have a weaker left foot on their hyper-speed double bass parts. Many focus simply on speed rather than maintaining the correct tempo throughout the song. And if sound replacing is needed AFTER the fact because the drummer sucks, cool. But planning the recording around sound replacing isn't learning how to record death metal drums. It's learning how to throw up some mics and not really put any work into pre-production. And as far as the "standard production toolkit" for big producers, I am not concerned with what they do. Some death metal albums suck. Some are great. Most all of them sound exactly the same. I would rather listen to "Obscura" by Gorguts than most of the shit that is out there right now. Not because it's the best death metal album of all time, but because it's exciting to hear people take a chance and go against the norm, not only in their song writing, but in the production as well. And if they used sound replacing on that album, more power to 'em. But it is UNIQUE.

[Ihsahn1981]

If you decide to use Drumagog there is a very usefull feature. Drumagog can actually write to midi. You just set Drumagog to send midi and then create a midi track with Drumagog set as input. Arm the midi track and record.

Then you set up Drumagog to receive midi and select the output on your miditrack to the Drumagog instance.

This way you can edit the drums in midi with all the flexibility that comes with it.

Maybe this was mentioned in some of the posts earlier but I didnt have time to read them all.

Anyway, this is a real timesaver.

[James Meeker]

Originally Posted by lionaudio

He said he was unfamiliar with recording and mixing death metal, so I think that learning how to do it without replacing the sounds right off the bat would be beneficial to him.

Agreed. But he was asking how to make the record right for the genre, not improve as an engineer. Generally speaking, sample replacement never helps people that don't know what they are doing very much. Sure, at least the drums don't sound like wet cardboard, but usually there will be even worse things going on in the production.

I agree that "straight up" (or mildly augmented with samples) drums are the way to go.

However, once again, it's not whether or not the engineer feels like they "cheated" or whatever--it's about the sound the clients want on the record. Chances are 99 out of 100 that the sound they are going for is heavily sampled sounding.

[Ironklad Audio]

good luck to ya, superior...mixing/producing metal is an entirely different beast than anything else, and it sounds like you've got your work cut out for you

let us know how things go...

[stayouttamalibu]

if you want examples of some amazingly well produced modern metal stuff that usually doesnt have completely replaced drums, check out most of the stuff done by fredrik nordstrom at studio fredman in sweden. some specific examples would be my personal favorite, soilwork - natural born chaos, but also in flames - clayman, the haunted - revolver, nightrage - sweet vengeance, and dimmu borgir - puritanical euphoric misanthropia (although the dimmu record definitely is extremely triggered/sampled, but a great example of it done well).

[psycho_monkey]

Originally Posted by lionaudio

In no way do I think that using triggers is a sign of incompetence.. I have used triggers before not just in engineering but in my band as well.. What I was trying to get across is that alot of engineers are coming up and never learning how to make records that involve careful mic placement, gating, compression, and EQ. He said he was unfamiliar with recording and mixing death metal, so I think that learning how to do it without replacing the sounds right off the bat would be beneficial to him. As far as needing to sound replace so that snares don't get lost, this is why I said to properly gate, compress, and EQ. It is NOT impossible to make a great sounding death metal album without sound replacing.. I do agree that many death metal drummers do lack the ability to be consistent. Many have a weaker left foot on their hyper-speed double bass parts. Many focus simply on speed rather than maintaining the correct tempo throughout the song. And if sound replacing is needed AFTER the fact because the drummer sucks, cool. But planning the recording around sound replacing isn't learning how to record death metal drums. It's learning how to throw up some mics and not really put any work into pre-production. And as far as the "standard production toolkit" for big producers, I am not concerned with what they do. Some death metal albums suck. Some are great. Most all of them sound exactly the same. I would rather listen to "Obscura" by Gorguts than most of the shit that is out there right now. Not because it's the best death metal album of all time, but because it's exciting to hear people take a chance and go against the norm, not only in their song writing, but in the production as well. And if they used sound replacing on that album, more power to 'em. But it is UNIQUE.

The sound of modern metal, death or otherwise, is triggered drums. I've worked on a mix session with a relatively well known death metal band who didn't even record a kick - just a trigger, which was hard quantised (no live audio = no phasing issues).

turn in a record that sounds like a metal record done in the past WITHOUT sound replacing etc and the band won't be happy - it won't sound like their contemporaries, regardless of if it's technically "better" or not.

[TheHatGuy]

I have to agree with James here. I have tried to go the all natural route with metal drummers, but could never get consistent tones I liked. I was able to make it work once by gating, conpressing, and explanding alot and automating a lot, but that is way too much freakin work and it really wasnt worth the meager outcome (the band was terrible, but hey, they were paying clients). After using good samples (Steven Slate Drums) and comparing the sessions to the aforementioned "all natural" sessions, the difference was very noticeable, and the time spent was significantly less for a project of comparable caliber.

Now, when tracking metal drums, I don't even bother to worry about the tone of the kick or the snare when I mic them. I just make sure I get a good, strong signal that I use that as a basis to sample over. I try to avoid replacing toms (I am just a sucker for some good dynamics), but I find myself doing it more and more as the quality of drummers I work with seems to be steadily dropping. Many drummers just want their drums to sound fast and sick, they don't care about havng something with some character to it.

IMHO, your best bet when tracking heavy drums would be to really listen to the drumming style first before you decide what to replace and what not to replace. Now, I almost always replace the kick, but if I can avoid replacing the snare and toms, I will.

[Sptz]

You don't know what drum triggers are? :O

Get ddrum triggers, place them on the Kick, snare and toms. or just the Kick and Snare, or just the Snare, whatever.

Have the drummer before recording a song, hit 6 to 8 velocities of the Snare, kick, tom1, etc...

Then replace with the hardest one, you have the "clicks" of the triggers, so it's DEAD easy! Death Metal needs ALOT of consistency in drumming to keep it all together, if you have a snare bouncing up and down it will sound like shite

[James Meeker]

Originally Posted by Sptz

Then replace with the hardest one, you have the "clicks" of the triggers, so it's DEAD easy! Death Metal needs ALOT of consistency in drumming to keep it all together, if you have a snare bouncing up and down it will sound like shite

It will sound like shite anyways because it's death metal! HAHAH!

Just kidding guys, lighten up! I admit it--I bought the first Obituary record back in 1989.

[liquidtension47]

my favorite part of tracking is getting the drums to sound right under the mics... its a good thing i dont do metal

give a listen to Dream Theater's Images and Words album. all the cracks of the snare are the exact same, taking away all the dynamics and anything else exciting. that entire album was triggered

[TheHatGuy]

Originally Posted by liquidtension47

my favorite part of tracking is getting the drums to sound right under the mics... its a good thing i dont do metal

give a listen to Dream Theater's Images and Words album. all the cracks of the snare are the exact same, taking away all the dynamics and anything else exciting. that entire album was triggered

You know, I never paid attention to that but I just listened to the album after reading your post and you're right! I used to be a huge DT fan back in the day (before they started putting out 1 album each year and regurgitating the same crap over and over) and I would never expect them to do that with a drummer like Mike Portnoy. He is really solid and consistent. Maybe someone screwed something up during the sessions?

[James Meeker]

Originally Posted by TheHatGuy

I would never expect them to do that with a drummer like Mike Portnoy. He is really solid and consistent. Maybe someone screwed something up during the sessions?

You have to remember that in the late 80's triggering would be seen as a very high-tech, advanced production style. That attitude continued into the 90's. It was also a technique that was a little bit secret and unknown to the general public.

Now that "triggering" type of technology is commonplace, and used in so many less-than-professional settings it has acquired a bit of an undeserved bad reputation. A technique or medium is NEVER something that is "evil" (so to say). It is either used poorly or to good effect.

In my opinion, the two bands that have really set the standards for what a metal record should sound like are Metallica and Pantera. When speaking to bands--even today, years after either band are particularly relevant--the most referenced records that people want to sound like are among these two bands, or bands that were directly influenced by the sounds they popularized. Both bands used triggering as a central part of their drum sounds in their influential records.

Just my opinion.

[lionaudio]

Originally Posted by TheHatGuy

You know, I never paid attention to that but I just listened to the album after reading your post and you're right! I used to be a huge DT fan back in the day (before they started putting out 1 album each year and regurgitating the same crap over and over) and I would never expect them to do that with a drummer like Mike Portnoy. He is really solid and consistent. Maybe someone screwed something up during the sessions?

The thing is, total triggering that album sounded so ****ed up because they actually use dynamics. In death metal, there are no dynamics, which is why it doesn't sound bad. Also, to add to what James said, yes the early days of triggering were somewhat ridiculous because there were few people who even knew much about it. So everyone got the Cinderella "Nobody's Fool" snare drum no matter if the song called for something different. Now triggering drums doesn't necessarily remove dynamics unless we want it to. I got into triggering drums in a live setting way before I began recording with a DAW, and using actual triggers, rather than software is a hellish experience at first. Setting the sensitivity, avoiding cross-triggering, etc.. I understand why back then it was so monotone and lifeless. they gave up!!

[lionaudio]

Originally Posted by James Meeker

In my opinion, the two bands that have really set the standards for what a metal record should sound like are Metallica and Pantera. When speaking to bands--even today, years after either band are particularly relevant--the most referenced records that people want to sound like are among these two bands, or bands that were directly influenced by the sounds they popularized. Both bands used triggering as a central part of their drum sounds in their influential records.

Just my opinion.

I would definitely agree that Pantera had a major influence on modern metal sounds. They definitely win the award for "most sampled bass drum in metal". As far as Metallica, it depends on which album you are referring to. I think the Black Album had more of an impact on modern MUSIC in general. The size of the drums, and the overall tone of the album, I can hear most bands on the radio striving for. I have always been under the impression that the drums on the Black Album were so large because of a ton of rooms mics, but I may be wrong. I do find it funny that no one will ever want to sound like Metallica ever again since St. Anger caught so much shit for that snare sound from hell.

[TheHatGuy]

James and Lion, I hear you both. I personally think that when you trigger that much though (well, maybe not as much nowadays with how far the technology has progressed) it really does remove something special from the drum sound, this imperfect human element. Now, when talking about Death Metal, that something special isnt even really heard from the get-go because of the nature of the music. Plus, the speed at which a lot of these drummers play makes many of them too inconsistent. They just simply havent developed themselves enough to play 64th notes at 220 BPM with clarity and precision (I know, shouldnt that be super easy?) I dunno, I like to avoid triggering if necessary (I am sort of a purist at heart who engineers and produces mostly metal, so I end up sampling a lot anyway).

Oh, and yeah, I have to agree about Metallica and Pantera. The Black Album and Far Beyond Driven were 2 huge influences on me growing up. Hell, they still are. I love to throw on either of those and just rock out.

[TheHatGuy]

Originally Posted by lionaudio

I do find it funny that no one will ever want to sound like Metallica ever again since St. Anger caught so much shit for that snare sound from hell.

lol, I was just about to graduate from recording school when that song came out. We all cringed when we listened to it... "ok, lets mic the edge of the snare, and EQ it so we isolate that ringing sound...that's what I want!" I read an interview that said they were trying to go for a more "garage band" type feel. I think they should have thrown up a few 58s, ran it through a behrigher board and tracked it all down to a tascam 4 track cassette recorder. That would be the way to go.