Golden Age Project Pre73

[kidvybes]

Originally Posted by API

Hi Guys.

I am not sure if you are going to believe this but I will tell you anyway.

My friend bought two of these and wanted to compare to my original Neve 1073´s.
Not surprisingly the 1073 sounded better, more and firmer bass, not as harsh in the highs etc.
The original 1073´s were fatter and smoother all around so no surprises there.

But I asked if I could pop the hood and see how it was built and I was quite surprised how good it seemed to be for the money.
Sure they had taken some cheap routes but overall pretty good.

Anyway, I asked him if I could try to do some mods to try to improve the sound, and guess what, after a few hours of work and a few tricks they sounded better than my original 1073´s!!
I know it is propably hard to believe but it is not rocket sience, I replaced some key parts in the Pre73 for better quality stuff and did some rewiring etc and I am quite pleased with the result to say the least.
It know actually sounds as good or better than my original 1073´s, the Neve character is there and they sound very similar.

We will continue tomorrow with more experimenting and with the results I am getting I am thinking about offering this as a upgrade service for this pre.

Will keep you posted.

Regards,
API

...since you are on the "other side of the pond", maybe you could offer these upgrades in the form of a schematic/step-by-step instruction for those of us here in the US...please keep us posted as to your results...

[O'Ryan]

Originally Posted by API

Hi Guys.

I am not sure if you are going to believe this but I will tell you anyway.

My friend bought two of these and wanted to compare to my original Neve 1073´s.
Not surprisingly the 1073 sounded better, more and firmer bass, not as harsh in the highs etc.
The original 1073´s were fatter and smoother all around so no surprises there.

But I asked if I could pop the hood and see how it was built and I was quite surprised how good it seemed to be for the money.
Sure they had taken some cheap routes but overall pretty good.

Anyway, I asked him if I could try to do some mods to try to improve the sound, and guess what, after a few hours of work and a few tricks they sounded better than my original 1073´s!!
I know it is propably hard to believe but it is not rocket sience, I replaced some key parts in the Pre73 for better quality stuff and did some rewiring etc and I am quite pleased with the result to say the least.
It know actually sounds as good or better than my original 1073´s, the Neve character is there and they sound very similar.

We will continue tomorrow with more experimenting and with the results I am getting I am thinking about offering this as a upgrade service for this pre.

Will keep you posted.

Regards,
API

Please make it a D.I.Y kit.......Can you feed us some side by side samples please?

Thanks

[retractablezing]

it would be really surprising (and a great sign!) if those mods didn't include a full transformer upgrade..

[API]

Originally Posted by retractablezing

it would be really surprising (and a great sign!) if those mods didn't include a full transformer upgrade..

As you say, that is no surprise!

API

[retractablezing]

Originally Posted by API

As you say, that is no surprise!

API

e, can i assume you swapped them then?

if so, the mod is probably going for half the cost of the pre by now in parts alone, no?

[API]

Yes, that is true, but only changing the output transformer and a few other key components made a huge difference.
Fully modded it would be about double the price from new, but sound wise it is up there.

API

[retractablezing]

Originally Posted by API

Yes, that is true, but only changing the output transformer and a few other key components made a huge difference.
Fully modded it would be about double the price from new, but sound wise it is up there.

API

may i ask what output trafo did you use?

i don't intend to do the mod myself, and probably will get it from you (assuming you'll commercialize it eventually) but i'm curious.

[Hotstuff]

Hi,

I was just checking the Carnhill transformers site, they sell there transformers through audiomaintenance.com.

They sell a narrow board version audio output transformer, could this be a good upgrade for the preamp?

I guess other upgrades could be better capacitors.

[retractablezing]

Originally Posted by Hotstuff

They sell a narrow board version audio output transformer, could this be a good upgrade for the preamp?

i think the narrow version is made to fit 1 rack space units, so if that's accurate, then yes, their lo1166 would be what you would have to use.

[O'Ryan]

Originally Posted by API

Yes, that is true, but only changing the output transformer and a few other key components made a huge difference.
Fully modded it would be about double the price from new, but sound wise it is up there.

API

Come on..... Give us some info.....

[Hotstuff]

I´ve been looking more into this transformer upgrade and it looks like an easy operation to perform.

The original ones are an exact looking copy of the carnhill ones, same pin layout and same same resistor and cap across the 2 input pins (5 and 8) as other neve output transformers, looks like a simple operation of swapping out the old ones for the new.

The transformers are surprisingly cheaper then I expected.

[JMc]

This is really exciting news. I'd like to know, specifically, how these mods affect the distortion that starts creeping in around 45 - 50 db. And if it smooths any of that out in the third gain stage as well. I really want to hear more about this...

Is there a source for the Carnhill vtb1148 transformers in the states?

[kidvybes]

Originally Posted by JMc

This is really exciting news. I'd like to know, specifically, how these mods affect the distortion that starts creeping in around 45 - 50 db. And if it smooths any of that out in the third gain stage as well. I really want to hear more about this...

...Bingo!...thank you

[O'Ryan]

Originally Posted by JMc

This is really exciting news. I'd like to know, specifically, how these mods affect the distortion that starts creeping in around 45 - 50 db. And if it smooths any of that out in the third gain stage as well. I really want to hear more about this...

Is there a source for the Carnhill vtb1148 transformers in the states?

I'm definitely siked to see Low end gear come to life. Now we just need to hear some samples thumbsup.

[Stiff]

Originally Posted by API

Anyway, I asked him if I could try to do some mods to try to improve the sound, and guess what, after a few hours of work and a few tricks they sounded better than my original 1073´s!!

That's it, I'm coming over to check it out! Gimme your studio address!

[aermotor]

I guess you could buy one, spend the same cost to mod it and end up with something really good for $700 or so. But I'd rather just build a Neve clone like I am now, roughly $350 per channel, nearly an exact copy of the 1290 circuit, Carnhill I/O and original style passives. Can't beat it.

[O'Ryan]

Originally Posted by aermotor

I guess you could buy one, spend the same cost to mod it and end up with something really good for $700 or so. But I'd rather just build a Neve clone like I am now, roughly $350 per channel, nearly an exact copy of the 1290 circuit, Carnhill I/O and original style passives. Can't beat it.

is that the one from seventh circle......?

[tubehead]

Originally Posted by aermotor

I guess you could buy one, spend the same cost to mod it and end up with something really good for $700 or so. But I'd rather just build a Neve clone like I am now, roughly $350 per channel, nearly an exact copy of the 1290 circuit, Carnhill I/O and original style passives. Can't beat it.

Did you complete the project? I saw the face plate mock-ups.

The project you're building does not appear to have a the line input option with carnhill trafo.

What did you do for the trim control? You want to drive those trafo into nice fun color.

[retractablezing]

the trafo itself is cheap enough to make it worthwhile. the problem is the other parts, i dunno to what extent API modified his, and i really dunno to what extent the output trafo makes that big a difference without the other parts upgraded.

but it's a thin line indeed between "totally worth it" or "i could've got something different from the start". at 700 bucks, you're looking at a used great river (by far one of the best pres i've ever used), or as someone said, 1 channel of SCA with a different PSU, etc.

if the mod exceeds 150 euros, it ain't gonna be worth it for me. plus i bet this thing is just absolutely fine stock and "should" be used for what it is (that is if the mods get into silly money).

[aermotor]

Yea I agree.

[Hotstuff]

Pardon my ignorance, but what are the "other parts" that need upgrading that are going to cost more than the trafo´s?
It´s all resistors, caps and transistors, unless the upgrade includes an elma goldplated 12 position gain switch, I cant see why it would cost more than 50/100€ to do an upgrade.

[retractablezing]

Originally Posted by Hotstuff

Pardon my ignorance, but what are the "other parts" that need upgrading that are going to cost more than the trafo´s?
It´s all resistors, caps and transistors, unless the upgrade includes an elma goldplated 12 position gain switch, I cant see why it would cost more than 50/100€ to do an upgrade.

i didn't say that the parts would cost more than the trafos.

i was talking about the total cost after all is said and done. to me, 150 is the absolute limit for this to be worth it, and that's pushing it. it's a 270 euro preamp, give or take. aproaching 50% of the initial cost in mods is just silly. may not be for others though, but this is the way i see it.

you're also forgetting labour. not everyone that gets this will be able to perform the mods themselves, and API did mention he was thinking about commercializing the mod.

[API]

Exactly, the parts are never the most expensive thing in a mod, time is though.
Time to figure out what has to be done and time doing it, that is what costs.

I have not had time to do any more testing but will try to do it over the weekend.

Anyway, I will be selling modded Pre73´s through a local store here in my hometown to start with.
Maybe will sell them myself eventually.

Anyway, I am sure that this pre will sound incredible once I will be done with it, but of course there is a price to it.
And i totally understand if people do not want to spend another $150-$300 to mod something that is new out of the box, I just do it for the fun of it!
And also, I was very surprised that I could make it sound better than my original 1073´s, but again, "better" is of course a very subjective thing.

On the matter of the switch it could be a weak part the I still have not looked at.
Since it is chinese made it is very hard to judge the quality, it could be good, it could be bad.
It could be good now and very bad in a year or two, we do not know.
But to change it for an Elma does not make sense, it would be way to expensive.

API

[O'Ryan]

Originally Posted by API

Exactly, the parts are never the most expensive thing in a mod, time is though.
Time to figure out what has to be done and time doing it, that is what costs.

I have not had time to do any more testing but will try to do it over the weekend.

Anyway, I will be selling modded Pre73´s through a local store here in my hometown to start with.
Maybe will sell them myself eventually.

Anyway, I am sure that this pre will sound incredible once I will be done with it, but of course there is a price to it.
And i totally understand if people do not want to spend another $150-$300 to mod something that is new out of the box, I just do it for the fun of it!
And also, I was very surprised that I could make it sound better than my original 1073´s, but again, "better" is of course a very subjective thing.

On the matter of the switch it could be a weak part the I still have not looked at.
Since it is chinese made it is very hard to judge the quality, it could be good, it could be bad.
It could be good now and very bad in a year or two, we do not know.
But to change it for an Elma does not make sense, it would be way to expensive.

API

What about us people over the pond.......?

[kidvybes]

Originally Posted by O'Ryan

What about us people over the pond.......?

...I've already sent Jim Williams a PM requesting his interest in possibly performing these upgrades here in the US and he was not enthusiastic...at some point, as stated earlier in this thread, you start throwing money at something in hopes of improving it, when you could have purchased something better for a bit more money from the start...that's why I'm starting to regret the decision to buy one of these when I could have gotten a pair of high-quality pres (with colour) for a bit more dough...
(such as these: Black Lion Audio Auteur Mic Preamp)

[JMc]

Well, all of this is getting a little too cryptic to hold my interest, particularly since my earlier question has not been addressed, namely whether this mod tames the distortion beyond 45db.

So, I'm not going to chase after this mod. Right now, I'm using the GAP Pre73 as a front end, feeding the line level out into my main tube pre. I have the output set to 50db and the gain just barely up. It adds a very nice, punchy, solid bottom end to the overall vibe that I like a great deal.

Game. Set. Match.

[Number 6]

Just got mine and... I'm loving it.

Despite some (obviously) expected differences, the old Neve vibe is there... even without mods.

(yes, I have used the real deal. quite a bit!).

[slaphappygarry]

Anyone know of any distributors in the UK?

Trying my hardest but can't find anyone yet... Even mailed them with no reply..

G

[gorath23]

Try these guys: Golden Age | Golden Age R1 Ribbon microphone | Pre-73 preamp

£199 +£10 postage.

JR

[Number 6]

Originally Posted by slaphappygarry

Anyone know of any distributors in the UK?

Trying my hardest but can't find anyone yet... Even mailed them with no reply..

G

Just go direct. I dealt with Bo at Golden Age Music and he was absolutely fine.

bo@goldenagemusic.se