RNP vs. Focusrite TwinTrak

[mr. moon]

Hi. I'm looking for a 2-channel preamp to complement my Groove Tubes "The Brick" and my Safe Sound Audio P1 preamps. I am looking to use this new preamp mainly for drum overheads, acoustic guitars (6 & 12 string), electric guitar cabs, and perhaps some other instruments ...but not so much for vocals. I need the 2 channel-pre to allow me to record on all 8 inputs of my soundcard concurrently for recording drum kits and such where I'd like to have some matched pres to do the overheads, or for stereo micing an acoustic guitar, where I'd also like to have matched pre's. I do not have 8 preamps at this time to fill out the inputs on my E-MU 1820M, so that's why I need to get a couple more.

I have been looking at the FMR RNP and Focusrite TwinTrak. I have searched the forums here and while there is quite a bit of information about each on its own, there's not so much info comparing these two to one another for sources other than vocals. (I already own a RNC, so I know the high quality of the FMR products). I am leaning toward the RNP, as some of the feedback I've read suggests that the pre's in the lower-end Focusrite products (i.e. the "Platinum" line) are not that great until you get into the "ISA" product line. However, I have also read that the RNP is not so great on acoustic instruments, as it has a bit of an "in your face" mid bump that doesn't really flatter them too well. I want to spend ~$500.00. That's all I can afford now, so please don't tempt me with any super-expensive alternatives!!

Any relevant comments, suggestions, personal experiences related to either of these pre's would be most appreciated, especially any information comparing and/or contrasting their performance in regards to the applications I'll be mainly using them for. Please feel free to suggest other 2-channel pre's that fit in my budget too!

Thanks!

-mr moon

[I play in a ban]

From everything I have read I would say RNP hands down..

It seems to me like an RNP has some kind of place in a pro studio..where a Twintrak does not (I've had a Presonus Eureka..which I am guessing is very similar..and it left me wishing I saved up some more money and got something good)

[DrDeltaM]

I haven't heard the RNP, but i do dislike the Focusrite Platinum series. I wouldn't choose the Focusrite myself.

Maybe a second hand SPL Goldmike?

[mr. moon]

Originally posted by DrDeltaM
I haven't heard the RNP, but i do dislike the Focusrite Platinum series. I wouldn't choose the Focusrite myself.

Maybe a second hand SPL Goldmike?

Errrr..., just a bit outside my price range (even used, unless you know of one for around $500.00 US) ...and I'll be in "big trouble" (no lovin') with "the boss" (the wife) if I go too far over budget .tutt



-mr moon

[DrDeltaM]

Then the RNP is probably your best bet

[oneass]

Originally posted by mr. moon
Errrr..., just a bit outside my price range (even used, unless you know of one for around $500.00 US) ...

In Europe a new Goldmike 9844 (so NOT the mk II) is only about 400 euro...

[Kubilay]

Most definitely the RNP.

I haven't worked with the twin Trak, but I know the Platinum pres as well as the Greens very well. The Focusrite is most certainly more colored than the FMR, so if 'clean' is what you're after, the RNP is the much better bet. (Plus, I find the RNP to be a better pre in general, clean or colored.)

[Synth80s]

I've got an RNP and a Platinum VoiceMaster Pro (very similar to TwinTrak but it's mono and has more "shaping" tools).

The RNP is clearly the better pre-amp. I know descriptions of audio can be of limited use, but I find signals sound larger and more transparent when using the RNP. The RNP makes it easier to hear the subtleties and differences between different mics and it has a more open / less constricted sound. It was the best pre I could afford and, though I'm sure more expensive pres offer more variety, the RNP will not leave you wanting for quality. The Focusrite series are attractive because they offer so many features for the money, but if all you need is a great pre, go RNP!

BTW, I know a lot of people aren't fans of the Focusrite Platinum series, but the VoiceMaster Pro makes an *excellent* character front end for recording electric guitar and other instruments (yes, even voice). The optical compressor, FET circuit and harmonic tools are very good for tone shaping. Even the voice-oriented EQ is useful in limited doses. As a clean front end, there are better options, but for sonic fun and options, the VoiceMaster offers a lot of possibilties for $600 new / ~$400 used.

For sonic variety, I sometimes use the RNP pre, then I route the RNP line out into the VoiceMaster's line in to make use of its various tools.

-Synth80s

[Synth80s]

Originally posted by I play in a ban
From everything I have read I would say RNP hands down..

It seems to me like an RNP has some kind of place in a pro studio..where a Twintrak does not (I've had a Presonus Eureka..which I am guessing is very similar..and it left me wishing I saved up some more money and got something good)

No offense, but offering advice based on what you've read is not terribly useful. To say that a TwinTrak has no place in a pro studio without having heard one is kind of strange.

We all like to argue and opine about tools until we're blue in the face, but we should all know damn well that a great engineer could record a great album using the Focusrite Platinum series (or Mackie or Presonus or whatever) if the talent and the room allow.

The quality of the pre-amps in a recording situation is rarely the limiting factor!

-Synth80s

[I play in a ban]

Originally posted by Synth80s
No offense, but offering advice based on what you've read is not terribly useful. To say that a TwinTrak has no place in a pro studio without having heard one is kind of strange.

We all like to argue and opine about tools until we're blue in the face, but we should all know damn well that a great engineer could record a great album using the Focusrite Platinum series (or Mackie or Presonus or whatever) if the talent and the room allow.

The quality of the pre-amps in a recording situation is rarely the limiting factor!

-Synth80s

Point taken - but that is the exact reason why I said "from what I've read" and the reason I did not say "GET THE RNP!" I didn't want to give the wrong impression. I just wanted to offer him some of the 'knowledge' that I have on the subject. With that said, I do agree with you. However, I would hope that he wouldn't base his purchase on one person's opinion, let alone someone who has not used the RNP.

I have read quite a bit on both pieces and 8 out of 10 times the content I have read on the Twintrak has not been positive (including people that I deeply respect and would trust to build MY studio), and I figured I would throw in my 2 cents.

And for the record, I agree that a preamp is not the deciding factor on whether or not a recording sounds 'pro' or not.

Hope I cleared everything up

- Bill

[thermos]

Doees anyone have problems with headroom on their rnps?

[thermos]

NEVERMIND! User error. Its got loads of headroom.
I used to own an old presonus mp-20 (with the jensen transformers). The rnp is clearly way better to me; smoother and less cheap sounding.
If you really want to get techy, try some Yamaha PM 1000 channel strips. You can get 2 on the bay for around $100. To rack them and such would probably leave you with some money left over. I have a full pm 1000 board (with direct outs) and I feel it to be a fair amount better than the Rnp pres. More detail on top and way more vibe. I use them all the time for drums and they work perfectly. I have been a/bing the Yamaha and some 1272s and they are similar vibewise (although the neve is of course better).

[Synth80s]

Originally posted by I play in a ban
Point taken - but that is the exact reason why I said "from what I've read" and the reason I did not say "GET THE RNP!" I didn't want to give the wrong impression. I just wanted to offer him some of the 'knowledge' that I have on the subject. With that said, I do agree with you. However, I would hope that he wouldn't base his purchase on one person's opinion, let alone someone who has not used the RNP.

I have read quite a bit on both pieces and 8 out of 10 times the content I have read on the Twintrak has not been positive (including people that I deeply respect and would trust to build MY studio), and I figured I would throw in my 2 cents.

And for the record, I agree that a preamp is not the deciding factor on whether or not a recording sounds 'pro' or not.

Hope I cleared everything up
- Bill

Yeah, that makes more sense. Again, I didn't mean to come off sounding like a d*ck. There's just a lot of negative "piling on" that happens on Gearslutz and other forums with regards to some prosumer brands and products.

It only takes one person to say "XYZ sucks" (often without any explanation) for 10 others to parrot "yeah, i heard it sucks" all over the boards. I now understand that you were saying "read other posts and you'll find people saying [blah blah] about the RNP and TwinTrak."

My favorite are posts about how a new product that no one has even heard *must* suck based on rough specs or design tidbits people have picked up about it. The new Speck line mixer and Chameleon Labs pre/EQ have fallen into this trap even though neither has hit the market!!!

Anyhow, when you use your ears, I suspect you'll find that the RNP is great!

-Synth80s

[I play in a ban]

Originally posted by Synth80s
Yeah, that makes more sense. Again, I didn't mean to come off sounding like a d*ck. There's just a lot of negative "piling on" that happens on Gearslutz and other forums with regards to some prosumer brands and products.


-Synth80s

Couldn't agree with you more. Great recordings have been tracked with a Mackie Mixer....go figure.

It's really easy to get caught up in what gear you should buy rather than making music..which I am guilty of to some extent to. I've had someone tell me that Event 20/20's are garbage ($900 for a pair of speakers..), even though Grammy Nominated albums have been mixed with them. Give me a break...I'll try to sound like less of an elitist from now on though

[mr. moon]

Thanks everyone for the input (pun intended)!

There is a new wrinkle in the fabric of this situation....

I think I may end up purchasing a new Sytek MPX-4Aii, as I can get it for a sweet price and from what I've been reading all over the place it sounds like a great piece of gear that will EASILY compete with and complement my P1 and Brick. I can get the Sytek for less cost per preamp than the RNP will cost me. I will have to unload a bit of gear to afford the Sytek, but I think it will be well worth it!!



-mr moon

[mr. moon]

Originally posted by mr. moon
Thanks everyone for the input (pun intended)!

There is a new wrinkle in the fabric of this situation....

I think I may end up purchasing a new Sytek MPX-4Aii, as I can get it for a sweet price and from what I've been reading all over the place it sounds like a great piece of gear that will EASILY compete with and complement my P1 and Brick. I can get the Sytek for less cost per preamp than the RNP will cost me. I will have to unload a bit of gear to afford the Sytek, but I think it will be well worth it!!



-mr moon

Update:

I have a new 4-channel Sytek on the way!! YES!!!

I was able to get it past "the boss" (AKA: wife) by pointing out what a deal it was ...man, whoda thunk that the "power of the bargain" was so strong?!! I will have to remember this tactic for future reference!!

....Sweet!!

Thanks for all the feedback everyone!

-mr moon

[I play in a ban]

Originally posted by mr. moon
Update:

I have a new 4-channel Sytek on the way!! YES!!!

I was able to get it past "the boss" (AKA: wife) by pointing out what a deal it was ...man, whoda thunk that the "power of the bargain" was so strong?!! I will have to remember this tactic for future reference!!

....Sweet!!

Thanks for all the feedback everyone!

-mr moon

Where can you order Syteks?

[mr. moon]

Sytek info....

Main product site page, shows sale price:
http://www.sytek-audio-systems.com/

Ordering page:
http://www.sytek-audio-systems.com/ordering.shtml

hope this helps!!

...I still can't believe I got this one past the boss!!

-mr moon