Looking for a crappy mic pre...

A LaMere · 16th November 2007, 08:05 AM

Yep. I said it...

I've been accumulating gear for an upcoming solo project and I've decided that one piece of gear I'm surpisingly lacking right now is a really crappy sounding mic pre.
I've got the Bla-modded pre's in my digi-002 rig...
and now I've got my Great River mpnv pair of pre's in a lunchbox that I just picked up.

I'm now lacking a really crap sounding mic pre.
Now I realize that I could get lo-fi in other ways... record my acoustic with my sm57 for lo-fi acoustics, etc.. What I'm thinking is... If I could pick up a lo-fi pre for around $1-$200 it might be a good idea?? I need some different soundscapes...

No need for two channel jobs either... One channel of ultra lo-fi should be decent I think. Any ideas? What about the original Presonus "bluetube" pre's? I heard those were really super lo-fi, even compared to their newer tube dp thing.
What about those old "aphex" model pre's?? those were pretty grainy if I recall correctly...

I'd love to pick up a less modern, crap sounding, two rack space, "what the hell is that thing?" if anybody has any ideas... I just can't think of any off the top of my head...

joeq · 16th November 2007, 08:35 AM

IMHO you are looking in the wrong place.

investigate this:

Placid Audio - Home of The Copperphone™

The Copperphone mic will give you GOOD low-fi as opposed to crappy attempted hi-fi.

a modern, inexpensive, store - bought mic pre such as the ones you listed is simply not low-fi enough. They merely fail at being hi-fi. They will not move anyone to shout: "what the hell is that thing?"

The Copperphone will. Check out the samples on the website. The first half of each clip is an SM 57, then the Copperphone. Instant 1932!

A LaMere · 16th November 2007, 09:06 AM

Yep... I've seen the copperphone also. :)

Thanks for the tip!

Agreed, I listed the pre's as the only that I could possible think of and my thought on them is that generally they are close to what I'm looking for, but not quite "it".

I'm not sure there is a difference in my mind between "good lo-fi" and crappy attempted lo-fi to be completely honest... It's all textures to me. Some are used well, and some are used poorly.

I'm not necassarily moving anyone to shout "what the hell is that" when listening to the track I guess... It's nice to have a big, old, two rackspace, essentially worthless piece of gear in the studio for people to come in and look at the normal gear and then ask "what the hell is that piece of crap sitting in the corner". Also.. .sometimes you get lucky with pieces like this....

The first time I ever saw an old Gates Sta-Level I thought.. "what the...."
Then we used it for the next 30 or so straight days in the studio...

Now they're selling re-issues for $2000+

FossilTooth · 16th November 2007, 09:11 AM

Want a preamp that sounds like crap?

Try overdriving a transformer-based solid state preamp.

Your Great River should beable to do the trick. I remember a session where I had to get a Guitar Wolf kinda tone. Hitting the input of my Vintech 273 really hard and pulling back the output sure did the trick.

But sure, you could get a dedicated one-trick pony for fun. I have a ton of one trick pony mics I rarely use... but sometimes they're perfect. I agree with "joeq": you're probably better off digging up a wacky old fossil than buying a thoroughly mediocre modern preamp.

A LaMere · 16th November 2007, 09:16 AM

Exactly!

I'm totally looking for a one-trick pony here!! :)

Thanks for chiming in!

SebCarr · 16th November 2007, 10:33 AM

Behringer Mic200. It has a knob that switches between various limiter and non limiter modes with different voicings, which as far as i can tell just seems to change the volume of the background hiss, and the amount of audible distortion. You can use it as a DI too, and it has a pair of outs so you can split the signal and send half for even more butchery. Mine cost £25, and it really is crappy.

frans · 16th November 2007, 10:46 AM

The stock pre's of my MOTU 828 sucked like a hoover, but that's not enough. Overdriving my Telefunken V672 (solidstate 70's with trannies way in and out) gets quite raunchy. But what do you want from your one-trick-pony? What kind of suck? Slow-no-transients? Distortion? Smear? Noise and intermodulation? After all, this is Gearslutz and what about that: send the signal through a tube guitar pre or better through a 1-watt tube amp (Dr. Z or the like), into a ringmodulator. Really, a good solidstate ringmodulator is the bomb for trashing in nice doses. A sherman filterbank could be your ticket, too. All these gear looks nice and is guaranteed to get attention in your rack. don't waste your time on bad "bad", waste it on good bad.
Or into a modular synth.. now we really get on a spending spree...

manning1 · 16th November 2007, 06:26 PM

try a cassette dek mic pre mate.
actually some are pretty ok....if u do some post recording clean up.
try a shuremic>>>impedence convertor>>>dek mic in.
go dumpster diving...lol.....or used hi fi stores for free old cassette decks...
i got about ten here i paid all of 5 buks for.
if u wanna hear what one sounds like....
check out the rough song muckabout called jumbo pillows on my motagator site. now compare to the "her lady" song on same site that used a hi end big buks mic thru a hi end pre.
peace.

Jayro_Rockola · 16th November 2007, 06:26 PM

I've been wanting to rack up a pair of crappy portastudio pres for awhile now. There are totally situations where you want that mystical tascam sound.

A LaMere · 16th November 2007, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayro_Rockola

I've been wanting to rack up a pair of crappy portastudio pres for awhile now. There are totally situations where you want that mystical tascam sound.

Well,... you don't hear that too often!
Awesome ideas guys... Loving it!

GravityRobert · 16th November 2007, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manning1

check out the rough song muckabout called jumbo pillows on my motagator site. now compare to the "her lady" song on same site that used a hi end big buks mic thru a hi end pre.
peace.

Dude your jumbo pillows song sounds like chipmunks here

John Suitcase · 16th November 2007, 07:25 PM

When I think of a crappy pre, I think of a pre that adds some haze over the sound. Not something you want, under any circumstances, unless you're trying to emulate bad home recordings (not cool ones.)

Recording some tracks to a portastudio, then flying them into the DAW gets some cool sounds, but sync can be an issue. Old home stereos often had mic inputs, those pre's can be interesting for some things. And running anything through guitar pedals always opens a whole pallet of lo-fi goodness!

If you want a good, if somewhat obvious lo-fi sound, try a Shure Green Bullet mic, into a small guitar amp with some drive. Always a cool vibe for garage bands, etc.

manning1 · 16th November 2007, 09:27 PM

gravity.
re chipmunks.....hope your kidding.
sounds normal here..last time i checked.
hmm..will check the site out.
mebe the host site has done something. weird...thanks.

Acoustic Cloud · 16th November 2007, 09:43 PM

Chipmunks here also.

Stevil · 16th November 2007, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayro_Rockola

I've been wanting to rack up a pair of crappy portastudio pres for awhile now. There are totally situations where you want that mystical tascam sound.

a few hundred more posts like this & i can sell my 644 for what i paid for it. keep em coming folks

manning1 · 16th November 2007, 10:05 PM

re jumbo pillows song.

the chipmunks problem is solved.
the song now plays normally.
thanks chaps for pointing this out to me.
(host site musta done something.)
the songs just a giggle/comedy song i did useing english cockney
lead vocals.
it was an experiment to see how far i could push cassette deck mic pre's for a giggle.

please tell me if it plays ok now.
cheers to all.

tINY · 16th November 2007, 10:26 PM

How about a 70's era Bogen or Realistic MPA small PA mixer?

-tINY

naked-puritan · 16th November 2007, 10:48 PM

How about using an old Realistic (Radio Shack) mic instead of a crappy pre-amp? Costs less and may suit your needs better.

AndrewsLaneRec. · 16th November 2007, 11:16 PM

i've got this old tube 1/4" tape preamp by a company called Ampligraph. i've got the deck too. i've used it as a DI before, but haven't really gotten the chance to put any mics through it. this post makes me want to try it out. i'll post a picture up here sometime.

AnAverageJoe · 16th November 2007, 11:28 PM

Good choices everyone, I would look maybe into ART and or an Alto or somethin from radioshack should be fine

Keldog · 16th November 2007, 11:57 PM

I'm just checking in to see if any of my pre's are on the list....

OK, move on...nothing to see here.

scrubs · 17th November 2007, 12:40 AM

Worst pre I've used: Alto Alpha Mictube. Close 2nd: Behringer MX802A mixer pres

ART Tube MP is always a solid crap choice. Engage the limiter and crank the input gain = instant poo.

spazticstar · 17th November 2007, 03:50 PM

+1 on the art
We have the old silver rackmount version, with the power supply mounted right next to the pcb.

squeegybug · 17th November 2007, 07:35 PM

No need to buy another preamp or mic if you have an SM57. Painters tape around the vents makes for a ... different sound:

Anyone taping up the side vents on your small condenser cardioid mics?

Scroll down for a sample clip.

Steve

Tibbon · 17th November 2007, 08:57 PM

PZM mics can be all sorts of fun.

asagaai · 18th November 2007, 02:27 AM

[quote=A LaMere;1632806]
I'm now lacking a really crap sounding mic pre.

Well-really crap sounding= Berenger single channel "tube" desk top silver thingy. Got it to power a rode S1 vocal mike for 48V through Yamaha mixer - sounded so shitty vocalist went on strike.

Relegated it to power talkback mike in my control room-hats off to berenger-perfect-nice thin brittly edge with a shimmery echo effect-incredible designed tube with inbuilt dsp plate 140 style effect.

How do they do it-brilliant-also the inbuilt dsp designed buzz designed to gradually increase over time as your ears become attuned and trained to the special sound -priceless-brilliant-designed especially to impart that sound to musos-we got classic gear in this dark pit with the vintage buzz.

GJ
Newcastle/OZ

Tibbon · 18th November 2007, 02:30 AM

I mean, I could build you a really crappy mic pre out of an LM386 and a few passive components likely.

There's various forms of crappy however.

giraffe · 18th November 2007, 03:39 AM

everyone's always said that the bellari pre's had a crap-tackular sound.

never tried one. maybe fun.

dviola · 18th November 2007, 03:57 AM

ive always liked putting a toilet paper roll on a 58....gives it this really compressed mid-rangy sound....really cool if anyone hasn't tried it. paper towel rolls are even crazier. It was just an experiment I came up with in the days when all i had was a tascam 4-track cassette, a 58, and a crappy impedance transformer...getting cool sounds is why i love recording....try anything

Good luck

Blake Minaker · 18th November 2007, 04:28 AM

http://cachepe.zzounds.com/media/qua...a627b804da.jpg

Might be a little too fancy though, since it has a tube ;)

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16th November 2007, 08:05 AM	#1
A LaMere Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 743	Looking for a crappy mic pre... Yep. I said it... I've been accumulating gear for an upcoming solo project and I've decided that one piece of gear I'm surpisingly lacking right now is a really crappy sounding mic pre. I've got the Bla-modded pre's in my digi-002 rig... and now I've got my Great River mpnv pair of pre's in a lunchbox that I just picked up. I'm now lacking a really crap sounding mic pre. Now I realize that I could get lo-fi in other ways... record my acoustic with my sm57 for lo-fi acoustics, etc.. What I'm thinking is... If I could pick up a lo-fi pre for around $1-$200 it might be a good idea?? I need some different soundscapes... No need for two channel jobs either... One channel of ultra lo-fi should be decent I think. Any ideas? What about the original Presonus "bluetube" pre's? I heard those were really super lo-fi, even compared to their newer tube dp thing. What about those old "aphex" model pre's?? those were pretty grainy if I recall correctly... I'd love to pick up a less modern, crap sounding, two rack space, "what the hell is that thing?" if anybody has any ideas... I just can't think of any off the top of my head... __________________ www.myspace.com/aaronlamere

16th November 2007, 08:35 AM	#2
joeq Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New York Posts: 3,899	IMHO you are looking in the wrong place. investigate this: Placid Audio - Home of The Copperphone™ The Copperphone mic will give you GOOD low-fi as opposed to crappy attempted hi-fi. a modern, inexpensive, store - bought mic pre such as the ones you listed is simply not low-fi enough. They merely fail at being hi-fi. They will not move anyone to shout: "what the hell is that thing?" The Copperphone will. Check out the samples on the website. The first half of each clip is an SM 57, then the Copperphone. Instant 1932! __________________ . “What you ask about is music. What you like is sound. Now music and sound are akin, but they are not the same.” — Confucius

16th November 2007, 09:06 AM	#3
A LaMere Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 743	Yep... I've seen the copperphone also. :) Thanks for the tip! Agreed, I listed the pre's as the only that I could possible think of and my thought on them is that generally they are close to what I'm looking for, but not quite "it". I'm not sure there is a difference in my mind between "good lo-fi" and crappy attempted lo-fi to be completely honest... It's all textures to me. Some are used well, and some are used poorly. I'm not necassarily moving anyone to shout "what the hell is that" when listening to the track I guess... It's nice to have a big, old, two rackspace, essentially worthless piece of gear in the studio for people to come in and look at the normal gear and then ask "what the hell is that piece of crap sitting in the corner". Also.. .sometimes you get lucky with pieces like this.... The first time I ever saw an old Gates Sta-Level I thought.. "what the...." Then we used it for the next 30 or so straight days in the studio... Now they're selling re-issues for $2000+ __________________ www.myspace.com/aaronlamere

16th November 2007, 09:11 AM	#4
FossilTooth Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 882	Want a preamp that sounds like crap? Try overdriving a transformer-based solid state preamp. Your Great River should beable to do the trick. I remember a session where I had to get a Guitar Wolf kinda tone. Hitting the input of my Vintech 273 really hard and pulling back the output sure did the trick. But sure, you could get a dedicated one-trick pony for fun. I have a ton of one trick pony mics I rarely use... but sometimes they're perfect. I agree with "joeq": you're probably better off digging up a wacky old fossil than buying a thoroughly mediocre modern preamp. __________________ Justin Colletti Audio Engineer

16th November 2007, 09:16 AM	#5
A LaMere Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 743	Exactly! I'm totally looking for a one-trick pony here!! :) Thanks for chiming in! __________________ www.myspace.com/aaronlamere

16th November 2007, 10:33 AM	#6
SebCarr Gear Head Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Chingford, London Posts: 56	Behringer Mic200. It has a knob that switches between various limiter and non limiter modes with different voicings, which as far as i can tell just seems to change the volume of the background hiss, and the amount of audible distortion. You can use it as a DI too, and it has a pair of outs so you can split the signal and send half for even more butchery. Mine cost £25, and it really is crappy.

16th November 2007, 10:46 AM	#7
frans Gear addict Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Bavaria, Germany Posts: 312	The stock pre's of my MOTU 828 sucked like a hoover, but that's not enough. Overdriving my Telefunken V672 (solidstate 70's with trannies way in and out) gets quite raunchy. But what do you want from your one-trick-pony? What kind of suck? Slow-no-transients? Distortion? Smear? Noise and intermodulation? After all, this is Gearslutz and what about that: send the signal through a tube guitar pre or better through a 1-watt tube amp (Dr. Z or the like), into a ringmodulator. Really, a good solidstate ringmodulator is the bomb for trashing in nice doses. A sherman filterbank could be your ticket, too. All these gear looks nice and is guaranteed to get attention in your rack. don't waste your time on bad "bad", waste it on good bad. Or into a modular synth.. now we really get on a spending spree... __________________ The Hiwatt R&D department claims that Pete Townshend smashed 25 SG's over each head before they hit the shelves. After the holocaust the only things left will be cockroaches and Hiwatts.

16th November 2007, 06:26 PM	#8
manning1 Lives for gear Join Date: May 2004 Location: canada Posts: 3,187	try a cassette dek mic pre mate. actually some are pretty ok....if u do some post recording clean up. try a shuremic>>>impedence convertor>>>dek mic in. go dumpster diving...lol.....or used hi fi stores for free old cassette decks... i got about ten here i paid all of 5 buks for. if u wanna hear what one sounds like.... check out the rough song muckabout called jumbo pillows on my motagator site. now compare to the "her lady" song on same site that used a hi end big buks mic thru a hi end pre. peace. __________________ i'm just a dumb computer engr (ret'd)...."quantum computing is the future" running a native software studio daw...Powertracks and Reaper on amd. my little songs www.motagator.com/bmanning (saving up for pristine ADA convertors i cant afford...lol)

16th November 2007, 06:26 PM	#9
Jayro_Rockola Gear maniac Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Asheville, NC Posts: 264	I've been wanting to rack up a pair of crappy portastudio pres for awhile now. There are totally situations where you want that mystical tascam sound. __________________ Jayro "Danger" Rockola Hi-Five Recording www.hifiverecording.com

16th November 2007, 07:25 PM	#12
John Suitcase Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 1,260	When I think of a crappy pre, I think of a pre that adds some haze over the sound. Not something you want, under any circumstances, unless you're trying to emulate bad home recordings (not cool ones.) Recording some tracks to a portastudio, then flying them into the DAW gets some cool sounds, but sync can be an issue. Old home stereos often had mic inputs, those pre's can be interesting for some things. And running anything through guitar pedals always opens a whole pallet of lo-fi goodness! If you want a good, if somewhat obvious lo-fi sound, try a Shure Green Bullet mic, into a small guitar amp with some drive. Always a cool vibe for garage bands, etc. __________________ --------------------------------- Suitcase Recordings Indie, Punk, Garage - On Location Recording

16th November 2007, 09:27 PM	#13
manning1 Lives for gear Join Date: May 2004 Location: canada Posts: 3,187	gravity. re chipmunks.....hope your kidding. sounds normal here..last time i checked. hmm..will check the site out. mebe the host site has done something. weird...thanks. __________________ i'm just a dumb computer engr (ret'd)...."quantum computing is the future" running a native software studio daw...Powertracks and Reaper on amd. my little songs www.motagator.com/bmanning (saving up for pristine ADA convertors i cant afford...lol)

16th November 2007, 09:43 PM	#14
Acoustic Cloud Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: around the corner Posts: 1,964	Chipmunks here also. __________________ If the Earth wasnt created, where'd all the dirt come from?

16th November 2007, 10:05 PM	#16
manning1 Lives for gear Join Date: May 2004 Location: canada Posts: 3,187	re jumbo pillows song. the chipmunks problem is solved. the song now plays normally. thanks chaps for pointing this out to me. (host site musta done something.) the songs just a giggle/comedy song i did useing english cockney lead vocals. it was an experiment to see how far i could push cassette deck mic pre's for a giggle. please tell me if it plays ok now. cheers to all. __________________ i'm just a dumb computer engr (ret'd)...."quantum computing is the future" running a native software studio daw...Powertracks and Reaper on amd. my little songs www.motagator.com/bmanning (saving up for pristine ADA convertors i cant afford...lol)

16th November 2007, 10:26 PM	#17
tINY Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 6,053	How about a 70's era Bogen or Realistic MPA small PA mixer? -tINY

16th November 2007, 10:48 PM	#18
naked-puritan Gear nut Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 81	How about using an old Realistic (Radio Shack) mic instead of a crappy pre-amp? Costs less and may suit your needs better. __________________ -- Lance Brenner songwriter, producer, devil in a chicken suit The Naked Puritans, The Falsies & Thrum www.myspace.com/lancebrennermusic www.myspace.com/falsies www.c-fest.org

16th November 2007, 11:16 PM	#19
AndrewsLaneRec. Gear addict Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 313	i've got this old tube 1/4" tape preamp by a company called Ampligraph. i've got the deck too. i've used it as a DI before, but haven't really gotten the chance to put any mics through it. this post makes me want to try it out. i'll post a picture up here sometime. __________________ http://www.myspace.com/andrewslanerecordingcompany

16th November 2007, 11:28 PM	#20
AnAverageJoe Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 703	Good choices everyone, I would look maybe into ART and or an Alto or somethin from radioshack should be fine __________________ "ppl wanna praise protools like its the best thing since pu$$y" - DivineMusic "You gotta have some knowledge before you can start having an opinion" - Barish "I got my information from 25 years of working with Pultecs and the Amtec I have in my rack... where did you get your information?" - Fletcher "There are no stupid questions, only stupid people"

16th November 2007, 11:57 PM	#21
Keldog Gear maniac Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Nevada Posts: 191	I'm just checking in to see if any of my pre's are on the list.... OK, move on...nothing to see here. __________________ some air came outta my butt. myspace/doghausrecords

17th November 2007, 12:40 AM	#22
scrubs Gear addict Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: NC Posts: 348	Worst pre I've used: Alto Alpha Mictube. Close 2nd: Behringer MX802A mixer pres ART Tube MP is always a solid crap choice. Engage the limiter and crank the input gain = instant poo.

17th November 2007, 03:50 PM	#23
spazticstar Gear maniac Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Nashville Posts: 167	+1 on the art We have the old silver rackmount version, with the power supply mounted right next to the pcb.

17th November 2007, 07:35 PM	#24
squeegybug Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Missouri USA Posts: 2,010	No need to buy another preamp or mic if you have an SM57. Painters tape around the vents makes for a ... different sound: Anyone taping up the side vents on your small condenser cardioid mics? Scroll down for a sample clip. Steve

17th November 2007, 08:57 PM	#25
Tibbon Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Boston/MA Posts: 4,109	PZM mics can be all sorts of fun. __________________ David Fisher (aka tibbon) What is Noise, Blog (DIY, gear, tech, etc) Follow me on Twitter

18th November 2007, 02:27 AM	#26
asagaai Gear addict Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Newcastle/OZ Posts: 390	[quote=A LaMere;1632806] I'm now lacking a really crap sounding mic pre. Well-really crap sounding= Berenger single channel "tube" desk top silver thingy. Got it to power a rode S1 vocal mike for 48V through Yamaha mixer - sounded so shitty vocalist went on strike. Relegated it to power talkback mike in my control room-hats off to berenger-perfect-nice thin brittly edge with a shimmery echo effect-incredible designed tube with inbuilt dsp plate 140 style effect. How do they do it-brilliant-also the inbuilt dsp designed buzz designed to gradually increase over time as your ears become attuned and trained to the special sound -priceless-brilliant-designed especially to impart that sound to musos-we got classic gear in this dark pit with the vintage buzz. GJ Newcastle/OZ

18th November 2007, 02:30 AM	#27
Tibbon Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Boston/MA Posts: 4,109	I mean, I could build you a really crappy mic pre out of an LM386 and a few passive components likely. There's various forms of crappy however. __________________ David Fisher (aka tibbon) What is Noise, Blog (DIY, gear, tech, etc) Follow me on Twitter

18th November 2007, 03:39 AM	#28
giraffe Gear nut Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 106	everyone's always said that the bellari pre's had a crap-tackular sound. never tried one. maybe fun.

18th November 2007, 03:57 AM	#29
dviola Gear maniac Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 258	ive always liked putting a toilet paper roll on a 58....gives it this really compressed mid-rangy sound....really cool if anyone hasn't tried it. paper towel rolls are even crazier. It was just an experiment I came up with in the days when all i had was a tascam 4-track cassette, a 58, and a crappy impedance transformer...getting cool sounds is why i love recording....try anything Good luck

18th November 2007, 04:28 AM	#30
Blake Minaker Gear nut Join Date: May 2007 Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada Posts: 98	http://cachepe.zzounds.com/media/qua...a627b804da.jpg Might be a little too fancy though, since it has a tube ;)