Recording vocals in a 5'x7' room with nothing but concrete....good or bad idea?

[truth123123]

i edited my original post because i was way off on the dimensions of my room.

ok...the dimensions of the room with nothing but concrete is 4'W x 7'L x 6'.5''H

i have an other room that measures 6'.3''W x 8'.7''L x 6'.9''H

i want to use one of the two for a vocal booth, i plan on putting 2in and 4in panels on the walls,ceilings and straddle the corners.

the bigger room has ceiling and walls with drywall except for the floor and one wall which is concrete....should i place insulation (bonded logic acoustical cotton),drywall then the panels or forget insulation and just put the panels?

the smaller room is all concrete but i plan on placing bonded logic (acoustical cotton) on the walls then placing drywalls and then bass traps.

which room will be better?

i know i can get the small room but im not sure if i can get the bigger room but still i decided to mention it for expert advice.......ethan chime in again

i tried to post pics up.

[LAVLAB]

should be good for an extremely BOOMY sound. It'll be very hard to get a clean recording, treat that room!

[theblue1]

I wouldn't say "boomy" -- but definitely pingy... and with some treatment you might get it down to "boxy." With enough treatment, you can probably have a decent enough little solo room. I don't know if you could get a drum kit in comfortably (maybe if the drummer doesn't have long arms ) but it should certainly be fine for vocals, guitars, amps, and such.

[drBill]

You've only got 3 choices. Leave it like it is, and it will almost certainly sound terrible for vocals. Completely deaden it with auralex, 703 or the like and it will be liveable, although perhaps a bit lifeless - AND, it will still sound like a small space. Or find another room to record in. Personally, i don't really like the sound of a vocal in a "vocal booth", and if you treat it heavily, that's what you will basically end up with. Good luck, bp

[lord_bunny]

get a crystal mic in there and you've got some cool tom waits bone machine mojo... but if your looking for the standard vocal sound, these guys have given you the straight dope

[Ethan Winer]

Originally Posted by truth123123

I should treat the room right?

Right. If you can't do a full treatment right now, this will help a lot:

RealTraps - Portable Vocal Booth

--Ethan

[gabehr]

Definitely gonna be "pingy". Go into the room and shut the door. Clap your hands. Hear that ringing noise? That's gonna be on basically everything you record in that room unless you treat it.

I've got a (very) small room I use for solo vocals, and I covered it about 90% with acoustic treatments of various sorts. It's quite usable. Like they said above, it's still gonna have a certain "smallness" to the sound, but it's not something that sounds noticeably unpleasant. It's probably the best you could do with a space like that.

[aehp]

When you treat a VERY small room like that, do you have to treat everything? Even the floor?? I have done that and found it very strange... Totally DEAD!!! I don't record drums in there just vocals... Do you think i should remove the treatment from the floor??

[dkelley]

Originally Posted by aehp

When you treat a VERY small room like that, do you have to treat everything? Even the floor?? I have done that and found it very strange... Totally DEAD!!! I don't record drums in there just vocals... Do you think i should remove the treatment from the floor??

i'd leave it dead, you can add controlled ambience electronically afterwards. that's why many of us use 3 reverbs on vocals, short plate (small room sound but you can control it if you add it like this), medium room or something like that (in limited amounts only, shouldn't be apparent in the mix at all and hard to hear when solo IMHO), and I tend to use some delay or echo as well sometimes (a third box), but there are other verbs to use on a third box, delayed verb, gated things are useful, etc.

if you have a room with any verb or slap to it naturally then you kind of have to use an insensitive close mic for vocals and hope for the best, or just live with the room's tone on everything you record. I prefer dead if it's a small space, but I'll tell you, having some amount of control over the physical dampening in the room is nice too, liven it up for somethings, deaden it for others, so non-permanent 703 panels are fun (I hang them on the walls and remove them if needed, which is very rare but has been done when useful).

but a dead room can be a blessing when you have the technology to add verbs and delays and plates and slapbacks afterwards. I'd leave it personally. although if you have, for example, a wood floor and a decent enough sized room it can actually sound very good, but I think decent size really starts around 20' between the walls, which isn't common in home studios. that's me talking of ideal situations though, i've gotten great sound in a 10'10' untreated room, it depends if you know how to work with the room and use your mics and gear I guess, or just use your ears well at least.

Cheers,
Don

[gabehr]

Originally Posted by dkelley

but a dead room can be a blessing when you have the technology to add verbs and delays and plates and slapbacks afterwards. I'd leave it personally. although if you have, for example, a wood floor and a decent enough sized room it can actually sound very good, but I think decent size really starts around 20' between the walls, which isn't common in home studios. that's me talking of ideal situations though, i've gotten great sound in a 10'10' untreated room, it depends if you know how to work with the room and use your mics and gear I guess, or just use your ears well at least.

I second that. Dead, while not as good as the perfect sounding live room for the right track, is versatile for making good music if you have a good sense of how to apply reverbs and delays. Reverb vs. Delay has also been discussed at length. I like short delays better than reverbs in many cases, but the idea is the same either way.

Dead is better than being stuck with a poor live room that's going to fit one time in a million with the music you're making.

[truth123123]

bump.......cuz i edited original post and i thought since i edited, it would renew

[jitterybit]

back to the 70s! wheres the egg shell?

[Glenn Kuras]

I would go with the larger from and just put all much on the walls as you can. If you do it right you can buy or make panels that can be taken out if you might want to get a little more of the room sound. Dought you will every want that sound but it is always there if need be.

Glenn

[Liran]

Originally Posted by Ethan Winer

Right. If you can't do a full treatment right now, this will help a lot:

RealTraps - Portable Vocal Booth

--Ethan

How does that compair to the MAX WALL by Auralex?

[Ethan Winer]

Originally Posted by Liran

How does that compair to the MAX WALL by Auralex?

Our PVB is larger than products from other companies that aim to be placed right near a microphone, but it's smaller than the Max Wall. If you're looking for something large enough to use with more than one singer, or to surround an acoustic guitar etc, a set of MicroTraps on stands will do an even better job.

See the photo on this page:

RealTraps - MicroTraps

--Ethan

[Liran]

Originally Posted by Ethan Winer

Our PVB is larger than products from other companies that aim to be placed right near a microphone, but it's smaller than the Max Wall. If you're looking for something large enough to use with more than one singer, or to surround an acoustic guitar etc, a set of MicroTraps on stands will do an even better job.

See the photo on this page:

RealTraps - MicroTraps

--Ethan

I've been looking at your products today since that post and they look to be of very high quality. I am definiately going to look into some of your products soon.

I just moved and unfortunately my new apartment has some flaws when it comes to accoustics, when i get my set up over here I want to take some pictures and maybe you can give me a few suggestions. One thing I'm very worried about are single pain glass sliding doors, theyre not "air-tight" like the previous apartments i've lived in. The room will be used for recording (in the headphones) and maybe some rough mixing. But it's mainly pre-production.