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Drum miking - what else do I need?
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Herman Munster
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#1
18th February 2007
Old 18th February 2007
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Drum miking - what else do I need?

I'm about to embark on my first rather large project and will be tracking drums for the first time. I have a decent room with 10ft. ceilings that is rather large to track in and am now at the point of trying to decide what else I need. Here's what I have:

AT3035
SM57 (2)
SM58
Oktava MK012 (I can get the one I have matched if need be)

I'll be tracking through a Presonus Firepod into Cubase. I do have a little $$$ I can spend if need be. My current thoughts were:

SM57 on snare
SM57 on 2 toms
Oktavas for overheads
AT3035 for room (maybe)

So, I'd need another MK012 then a mike for the kick and possibly floor tom. Any other ideas? I was hoping to keep it to 5-6 mikes total. Thanks.

Mike
#2
18th February 2007
Old 18th February 2007
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Total $ amount for 3 additional mics?

What's your total budget for the additional MC-012, a kick mic, and a floor tom mic?

Are you willing to purchase used?

canderson
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18th February 2007
Old 18th February 2007
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What's the genre & context? Is it a 'rock' thing, jazz, some sorta gumbo?

I'd probably start with an MC012 on snare, 57's on toms or maybe even room...3035 as a mono overhead or on floor tom...

It all depends on what the artist is after.
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Herman Munster
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18th February 2007
Old 18th February 2007
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I'm actually tracking some of original material I've written and co-written along with some things a friend has written. Some of the tunes are more rock oriented and some more jazz oriented. I will be tracking acoustic guitar, keys and bass as well (almost forgot the vox). I play keys and plan to mostly use piano, Rhodes and Wurlys if that gives you some kind of idea. There will be some electric guitar, but this will be an acoustically oriented project. I could spend probably another $400-500 on mics if need be, but would prefer to save as much as possible. And, yes I am willing to purchase used. I play keyboards, but am really beginning to realize how far we've got to go in the world of samples. I may end up miking an acoustic piano as well. The real deal really does sound better if recorded the right way....
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19th February 2007
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i noticed you didn't have a kick drum mic listed and you want to save money, so i'll put in a good word for the blue kickball. it sounds great on kick and bass cabs, it's cheap as hell ($90-$100 on ebay) and it looks really cool.
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19th February 2007
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perhaps stick a 57 on the kick, 57 on the snare, 1 oktava OH and be done.
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19th February 2007
Old 19th February 2007
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Hmmm.. 4 mics should do it, maybe 5.

Try a 57 on kick, a 57 on snare and two octava's for L/R overheads. Use the 3035 for front of kit mic. Maybe 6 feet in front and about the hight of the Tom-toms.

Keep it simple. 4 mic setups are used all the time and work great. The addition of the 3035 to the front side of the set will add some dept to the mix.

If you want to buy a kick mic, the replace the 57 with a dedicated kick mic, but 57's work great in that position too.

JD
Herman Munster
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19th February 2007
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Sounds good. One more question - will it be important for me to try to have my MK-012 matched or can I just go with an unmatched pair?
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19th February 2007
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Try this maybe. Record the kit with four mics and after you finish tracking, play back the four mics into a speaker in a room and put the the oktava somewher way away to capture some natural ambence. I just did it for some rock songs and it is way better than adding verb later IMO.
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19th February 2007
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definitely add a bass sensitive mic or 2 on the kick.
i picked up a ATpro25 & Shure Beta 52 fairly cheap for that purpose.
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19th February 2007
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oh the options

Try the 3035 and oktava both over the drummers head. That will give you a bit more to work with in mixdown.
put them right next (above, below, etc..) to each other to help with phase issues(align the caps) and mabe point the oktava toward the snare and hat, the 3035 @ the toms.
Maybe roll the lows off the oktava and the highs off the 3035.
pan then out a bit(not two wide as to draw attention to the use of different mics)
57 on bottom snare(check phase)
57 or 58 w/out the grill on kick. I would also recomend an Audix D6. Awesome kick mic for under $200. Or find an old bookshelf speaker with some low end to it, unwire the tweeter and use it on your kick.(search forums-"speaker for mic")

-or-
try the recorderman technique(search forums) with the 57s w/ the oktava in front right above the toms@ 4-6 feet(depending on how big the kit is) @ the same distance from both the 57s or try the same distance from the snare as the 57s, w/ low cut and the 3035 for kick or room.

oh the options with just a few mics.
hope i helped.
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19th February 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herman Munster View Post
I'm actually tracking some of original material I've written and co-written along with some things a friend has written. Some of the tunes are more rock oriented and some more jazz oriented. I will be tracking acoustic guitar, keys and bass as well (almost forgot the vox). I play keys and plan to mostly use piano, Rhodes and Wurlys if that gives you some kind of idea. There will be some electric guitar, but this will be an acoustically oriented project. I could spend probably another $400-500 on mics if need be, but would prefer to save as much as possible. And, yes I am willing to purchase used. I play keyboards, but am really beginning to realize how far we've got to go in the world of samples. I may end up miking an acoustic piano as well. The real deal really does sound better if recorded the right way....
In that case, if you might be tracking a real piano too I'd get another at 3035 or Oktava so you have a matched pair of "something". You'd probably get a fair amount of mileage from a Sennheiser 421 or ATM25 for the kick drum & other low frequency instruments too.

You might also be able to get an acceptable, open..."jazz" kick sound by placing the 3035 just off the front head...maybe 3-6" out and about 1/3 of the way in from the outter shell. That probably won't have enough 'smack' for rock tracks but you never know...

Since you have the luxury of time, keep moving & swapping mics around until you hit upon a combination that works.

Peace.
TYY
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20th February 2007
Old 20th February 2007
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Use the octava as a mono overhead, use the 3035 in the kick. I actually had to use a 3035 in the kick once, because the 421 shit the bed, and the 3035 was the best sounding of the leftover mics.

Besides, cymbals sound kinda poopy with the 3035, and with some massaging, the kick sound was fine.
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21st February 2007
Old 21st February 2007
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unmatched pair

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herman Munster View Post
One more question - will it be important for me to try to have my MK-012 matched or can I just go with an unmatched pair?
An unmatched pair will be just fine.
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21st February 2007
Old 21st February 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRE Productions View Post
Use the 3035 for front of kit mic. Maybe 6 feet in front and about the hight of the Tom-toms.
This is the key. The front-of-kit mic makes the drums come alive. Also, consider placing the snare mic outside the drum, to get more shell - or inside if you want more thump. If you want a stereo image, you're going to want that other oktava for the OH pair. Mono drums don't sound natural to me. You can always mono them later, but you can't un-mono them. (Well, you can, but without the stereo OH's, your L-R image is going to be all screwed up.)
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