Ceriatone or Bugera?

[wesarvin]

So here's a question:

Ceriatone Dizzy 30 or Bugera BC30?

I'm really diggin' that chimey, jangly, clear-mids with open top sort of sound. I have a Mark IV combo that sounds good, but is too barky or honky for my tastes. My Bogner Ecstasy is close on its blue channel, but I'm downsizing rigs and looking at two smaller amps, one of them being in that DC30 vein, the other higher gain. Any experience or opinions out there? Thanks.

[Lonnie5]

Probably not the answer your looking for but look up the Genz Benz Black Pearl. I just picked one up last month. LOVE IT! I was looking to get an AC30 at first. I really wanted a new hand wired version with the Alnico Blues (unreal) but it was a little out of my price range and was afraid of gigging with a handwired amp. So I thought about getting just the regular custom classics version with the greenbacks in it. I played one and it just wasn't even close to the handwired with the alnico. Anyway long story short lol I looked up alternatives to an AC30. BTW I was thinking of going the Ceriatone DZ30 route at first but I came across the Genz Benz Black Pearl at a local shop. I played it and it was exactly what i was looking for. Bell like clean tones , very dynamic, and the overdriven tones are agressive when you dig into it. ALA AC30. I did a little research and found out it is pretty much an AC30 clone BUT with more options and an Eminance speaker. Suprisingly pretty cool. Not as good as the Alnico blue, but fits the amp much better than a greenback. You can pick one up used for around $700. Hands down can't beat it. pheewwwww!

[wesarvin]

That sounds awesome. I know we're straying off topic of Ceriatone or Bugera, but I was also considering the MTS. Here's a clip of the tone of what I'm after:

YouTube - ‪Randall MTS ultra module modified by Tonehunter‬‏
YouTube - ‪Divided by 13 and Matchless amp comparison‬‏

and for higher gain, this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Xw8d...eature=related which is very similar to a real Bogner

[biggator6]

Bugera is Behringer
Ceriatone is hand-made.

I know where I'd spend my money. Nik makes some good stuff.

[wesarvin]

Bogners are PCB. Does that make them inferior? I feel that circuit design is generally more important than construction methods. "Hand-Made" isn't always the greatest. If I built an amp by hand, it'd be garbage. I know that it's a generalization, but hand-made is often used by marketing guys to sell items.

Or one can compare it to power amp class ratings. Many people think that class AB or D amp designs are inferior to class A. It's like they're grading beef or something...

I apologize for being difficult, but do you have any evidence on build quality, tonal qualities, or price/performance ratio?

[nedorama]

For the most part, anything Behringer/Bugera builds is garbage - while some folks have had fine amps, at their prices, they're cutting corners on:

parts
factories - yes they have their own factories, but unclear what standard they pay vs. others
quality assurance
R&D, since they "liberally borrow" from other designs.

I'd rather have a Ceriatone clone that's made with better parts than a B-word amp. I think you'll find from posts Ceriatone has great customer service as well. I like the fact that Ceriatone is unapologetic about cloning great designs, whereas Behringer tries to hide it.

As for PCB, Boogies have had PCBs in them for years - it's not an automatically bad thing, but if used correctly (hint - not like Fender's Hot Rod Series) they can be great to add consistency on circuit layout.

[carlheinz]

There are too many moving parts that make up any final guitar sound and these clips are all over the place due to mics guitars and players and settings.

You will never get it all out of one amp IMO.

Unless you only want 1 flavor and feel,Keep the bogner for your hi gain hi volume and power needs and get something in the AC30 vein for chime..... and the blue alnicos make all the diff.

I tried a 1799 "30" combo from PRS that was interesting but probably not enough clean headroom for a loud band...good tone and worth a listen.

if you can find a Roccaforte "rocky" or 18 and pair it with a cab with C blues alnico's you cant go wrong

[BLUElightCory]

I picked up one of the new AC15 Customs with a Greenback and it's an amazing amp - this coming from a guy who has owned British/handwired AC30s and AC15s in the past. The Greenback is nice, but with a Blue installed (or a 2x12 Blue cab) I have no doubts you'd be happy with it if you like the chimey Vox thing. I've got lots of nice amps around the studio and the Vox has just kind of taken over for guitar tracking, it just sounds GOOD and it's surprisingly versatile (especially when using external speaker cabs).

[wesarvin]

Thanks guys. Sorry for being difficult, as I was trying to spark some more conversation. It seems that a trip to the local GC (eek) is in order.

I've played on an AC30 before, and it seemed like mud and fizz rather than chime. It could have been the guy's settings at the time. Do the amps in that vein carry an articulate midrange, or are they more scooped-sounding? I'm thinking "jangle" as a tonal quality, if that's possible to describe.

Oh, and for Berhinger, I agree that build quality can be spotty. I have an ADA8000 that has two cruddy channels...although the others sound fine!

[nedorama]

I'd seek out other guitar shops than a GC in Houston to try not only the Vox, but also other vox-inspired amps -- there's a lot of boutique amps that can do the AC30 chime really well but it's all a matter of taste.

Don't know what AC30 your friend had or the settings, but mud and fizz wouldn't be the tonal goals. The speakers are a big part of the equation.

[BLUElightCory]

Originally Posted by wesarvin

I've played on an AC30 before, and it seemed like mud and fizz rather than chime. It could have been the guy's settings at the time. Do the amps in that vein carry an articulate midrange, or are they more scooped-sounding? I'm thinking "jangle" as a tonal quality, if that's possible to describe.

In my experience AC15s/AC30s can be about as chimey and jangly as amps get, especially with something like a Tele. They're generally not fizzy/muddy at all, and in fact they can sound thin compared to Marshall/Oranges/Hiwatts, etc. - but this is part of the "open" sound of these amps. Since the mids and highs are emphasized, they tend to sit in the mix really well. With a bigger cabinet they can sound really thick (I run mine into a 4 x12 if we're looking for bigger rock tones).

Avoid the CC (Custom Classic) amps - they're a pale imitation of what an AC amp is supposed to sound like. You're better off with the current handwired or Custom models, or the older British amps. Especially with the Celestion Blue speakers, the AC amps have an amazing, swirling, chimey clean/crunch tone that's to die for.

[carlheinz]

Sometimes you find an amp and it sounds terrible and basically it needs service

...fresh tubes...preferably

N.O.S.

MULLARD OR TELEFUNKEN etc.

Worth the price IMO.

[Lonnie5]

sorry I'm posting again about it..... Unless you have 2k to spend on a handwired AC30 with Alnico Blue speakers, look into the Genz Benz Black Pearl.

Sent from my Vortex using Gearslutz.com App

[Draytone]

Go the Dizzy 30, you will not regret it one bit. I have one and am always getting compliments on how good it sounds, and I think it sounds fantastic. I'm running it through a 2x12 cab with a G12H and a Vintage 30.

To me, its no comparison. The Dizzy 30 holds its own next to any of the "boutique" gear tone wise. Get it in a nice shiny box and you will be the envy of all your friends.

[wesarvin]

As for now, the search is over. I now have a Randall RM50 combo. One of the modules is a modified Super V. All the jangle, chime, and crunch I want, along with a slew of other modules.

It's an ugly-looking beast compared with boutique puppies, but oh well...tone matters.