trying to get a happy sounding pop punk guitar tone

[socalstyleonline]

Trying to get a happy sounding pop punkish tone for a project I'm helping my friend out with, and my marshall just seems a bit too angry... So anyways, im looking for a guitar tone similar to the academy is, specifically, their song One more weekend is what I am referencing the desired amp tone from. (its like a happy sounding distortion) --

So basically here's what I'm working with if anyone has any ideas, or if not, what they think would be the best amp for the job.

Marshal jcm 2000
marshall 4x12 cab
Orange tiny terror
1 orange 1x12 1 orange 2x12 cab

Boss compressor, (7?) band eq pedal, and distortion pedal.

Anyone have any ideas? P.S. pedals dont play nice running into the tiny terror head.

[pfosk]

pretty easy on a jcm:

1. NO Pedals

2. set the eq for predominantly mids and treble but roll the bass down a bit

3. have the drive all the way down and start playing palm mutes while a friend increases the presence and gain until you have just a bit of "chunk". Its should be pretty nicely distorted without having a buzzsaw tone. Its what I call a "clean" distortion, meaning you still have all the nuances of picking and a clear tone of each string..none of that mushy chugging with no mids that newbs always dial in.

4. Set up an SM57 (if you don't have one, buy one) and have it 45 degrees and facing the top right speaker cone at a distance of about 2-6".

5. See how that sounds on tape or in the DAW. Move the mic slightly until you like what you hear. Sculpt the hell out of the track...cut everything below 150Hz to get rid of all that mud and rumble, cut everything above 8 or 9k, and adjust dips in the mids until you get what you like. Remember, if you know exactly what youre going for, the best resource is the actual recording. If you want to sound like The Academy Is... , their records are basically a giant How-To. Use your ears and take your time and sculp that eq and add some nice compression. I find rock guitars respond well to liberal treatments of limiting as well. DO NOT eq or compress on the way into whatever youre using to record. Youre just going to limit your options.

Keep in mind that you may start to think your guitar tones are getting pretty weak sounding but in a good mix with supporting bass guitar thats in the pocket everything will set nicely. Don't overdo the guitars, they have their place in a mix and its smaller than most people think. All guitars need is a tiny bit of bass to give it some body, decent mids to fill the rhythm, and just a tad of highs to give it some teeth.

[uknowitsallagame]

has anybody tried recording with a jvm 410H?
I need a second opinion on it

i bought on a few months ago. mostly for melmetalcore/melodic hardcore. my old band played in drop B flat =D

now im jsut recording all types of bands. yestardya i recorded a verryyy amateur pop-punk ish band. i mean they sucked, and had low quality guitars but thats all i had to work with.

I have a mesa 4 x 12 rect cab. JUST bought an API 512C pre amp mod, and i tried out 5 diff mics, (both dual micing ,and single) sm57, md 421, sterling audio tube condensor, audix I5, and another sm57 i found. It was like impossible to get a good tone. even in the room the amp didnt sound great. I dislike the tone of that amp every other time i use it for any genre of music im recording.

ended up getting the worst thinnest tones ive ever recorded =/. just muddy for almost everything ive used that amp for. anybody else have luck with that amp?

[socalstyleonline]

Originally Posted by pfosk

pretty easy on a jcm:

1. NO Pedals

2. set the eq for predominantly mids and treble but roll the bass down a bit

3. have the drive all the way down and start playing palm mutes while a friend increases the presence and gain until you have just a bit of "chunk". Its should be pretty nicely distorted without having a buzzsaw tone. Its what I call a "clean" distortion, meaning you still have all the nuances of picking and a clear tone of each string..none of that mushy chugging with no mids that newbs always dial in.

4. Set up an SM57 (if you don't have one, buy one) and have it 45 degrees and facing the top right speaker cone at a distance of about 2-6".

5. See how that sounds on tape or in the DAW. Move the mic slightly until you like what you hear. Sculpt the hell out of the track...cut everything below 150Hz to get rid of all that mud and rumble, cut everything above 8 or 9k, and adjust dips in the mids until you get what you like. Remember, if you know exactly what youre going for, the best resource is the actual recording. If you want to sound like The Academy Is... , their records are basically a giant How-To. Use your ears and take your time and sculp that eq and add some nice compression. I find rock guitars respond well to liberal treatments of limiting as well. DO NOT eq or compress on the way into whatever youre using to record. Youre just going to limit your options.

Keep in mind that you may start to think your guitar tones are getting pretty weak sounding but in a good mix with supporting bass guitar thats in the pocket everything will set nicely. Don't overdo the guitars, they have their place in a mix and its smaller than most people think. All guitars need is a tiny bit of bass to give it some body, decent mids to fill the rhythm, and just a tad of highs to give it some teeth.

cool man ill give this a try thanks for the reply.

1 quick question. When people talk about inches from the speaker cone, how much does the mesh add in inches to the distance? (I've never removed the mesh, grille, if that is the appropriate term for the thing thats covering the speakers.)

If Im not concerned about appearance of the cab, should I just remove it and record with it off so I know exactly how far the mic is away from the speaker? (and I guess id be able to see the speakers move and hit as well, which I suppose would help me judge volume levels better....)

[socalstyleonline]

Originally Posted by uknowitsallagame

has anybody tried recording with a jvm 410H?
I need a second opinion on it

i bought on a few months ago. mostly for melmetalcore/melodic hardcore. my old band played in drop B flat =D

now im jsut recording all types of bands. yestardya i recorded a verryyy amateur pop-punk ish band. i mean they sucked, and had low quality guitars but thats all i had to work with.

I have a mesa 4 x 12 rect cab. JUST bought an API 512C pre amp mod, and i tried out 5 diff mics, (both dual micing ,and single) sm57, md 421, sterling audio tube condensor, audix I5, and another sm57 i found. It was like impossible to get a good tone. even in the room the amp didnt sound great. I dislike the tone of that amp every other time i use it for any genre of music im recording.

ended up getting the worst thinnest tones ive ever recorded =/. just muddy for almost everything ive used that amp for. anybody else have luck with that amp?

Im pretty sure its the head/cab combo. I bought a mesa cab to use with my marshall because I only wanted a 2 speaker cab, and it was one of the worst sounding guitar tones id ever heard, no matter what I did on my jcm's head. I think marshall heads and mesa cabs just were not meant to be.

[wwittman]

Buy an SM57, by all means.
next,
Put a good large diaphragm condenser mic in front of the speaker cab about 2" in front of the best sounding speaker (determine this by listening with the mic to each speaker).

Now, with the guitar player about to begin, take the SM57 and throw it as hard as you can at a wall.

This will both inspire a true punk rock attitude in all people present AND will get the maximum benefit from an SM57

[pfosk]

Originally Posted by wwittman

Buy an SM57, by all means.
next,
Put a good large diaphragm condenser mic in front of the speaker cab about 2" in front of the best sounding speaker (determine this by listening with the mic to each speaker).

Now, with the guitar player about to begin, take the SM57 and throw it as hard as you can at a wall.

This will both inspire a true punk rock attitude in all people present AND will get the maximum benefit from an SM57

I got my mic technique from Mass Giorgini himself, and if his Rise Against, Anti-Flag, and Alkaline Trio albums have anything to say about it, an SM57 will work just fine.



As for removing the mesh, it shouldn't change the sound too drastically, so experiment with it on and off.

[wwittman]

they do work just fine, unless an actually decent mic is available

[theGeek]

Originally Posted by pfosk

I got my mic technique from Mass Giorgini himself, and if his Rise Against, Anti-Flag, and Alkaline Trio albums have anything to say about it, an SM57 will work just fine.



As for removing the mesh, it shouldn't change the sound too drastically, so experiment with it on and off.

having worked with Mass on an occasion (helped run sound at Squirtgun's latest live album) and having heard a lot of his studio work I must say that his methods are top notch.

[joeyjazz]

Originally Posted by pfosk

I got my mic technique from Mass Giorgini himself, and if his Rise Against, Anti-Flag, and Alkaline Trio albums have anything to say about it, an SM57 will work just fine.

Kind of misleading to include Alkaline Trio before the word albums since he only recorded a couple b-sides for them, though anyone with any interest in pop punk should be more than well aware of his work as he was responsible for like half of what most of us were listening to in the 90s.

[Studio Addict]

Originally Posted by wwittman

Now, with the guitar player about to begin, take the SM57 and throw it as hard as you can at a wall.

Biggest laugh in a long time! Thank you!!!

[Ol' Betsey]

Originally Posted by joeyjazz

Kind of misleading to include Alkaline Trio before the word albums since he only recorded a couple b-sides for them

Well aren't we the train-spotter?

I think we all know what he meant, b-sides or not.

R.

[Jonboy79]

Originally Posted by pfosk

I got my mic technique from Mass Giorgini himself, and if his Rise Against, Anti-Flag, and Alkaline Trio albums have anything to say about it, an SM57 will work just fine.

Hey man, you know how people in this business are. If someone doesn't like something, no matter how many countless albums it was used on and no matter how many great tracks were cut with it, then they usually won't give it any credit at all.

What I love seeing is when someone with a simple budget asks about what to use to record dirty guitars and you get people telling them to go get an md421 and an r-121, as if everyone has 1500 bucks to throw down on mics to record guitars. Are there better mics than a 57, of course. Will a 57 work just fine if it's what you have? Absolutely.