Tweed Princeton vs. Champ

[Al Rogers]

Last year I built a tweed 5E3 Deluxe amp and I love it. Now I'm getting the urge to build again and am thinking of a smaller amp for recording and practice. The Deluxe is pretty loud when you get it where the tone is sweetest.

So I started out thinking I'd build a 5F1 tweed Champ with either an 8 or 10 inch speaker. Then someone suggested I build a 5F2A tweed Princeton which is also a 5 watt single ended amp. The argument for the Princeton is that the larger cabinet opens up more choices among 10 inch speakers. Of course it's also more money to buy a kit or parts.

Can anyone here help me out with my decision? What are the sonic differences between the tweed Champ and Princeton if the speaker were the same. Will the Champ with an 8 inch speaker record better? Or will the Princeton?

There seem to be a lot more tweed Champ than Princeton amps. Maybe it has to do with what they sold the most of back in the fifties. Or does the Champ have a mojo that the Princeton lacks? I hope someone here knows these amps well enough to shed some light on the subject.

-Al

[cavern]

try this forum, there's a lot of pro fender amp builders there....Amplifiers - The Fender Forum

[Al Rogers]

Thanks for the suggestion. Since I'm interested in which amp will record better, thought I'd try here first.

-Al

[Wes Kuhnley]

If I'm not completely mistaken, the tweed champ and princeton were nearly identical except for the tone control in the princeton. I would imagine they would be pretty much the same thing behind a mic. I'd go for the princeton myself.

[Al Rogers]

Thanks Wes. That's how it looks to me. Been wondering why you hear so much about the tweed Champ compared with the Princeton. Perhaps it's just that because the Champ was a cheap student amp they sold a lot more of them. I've seen a few tweed Champs but have never come across a tweed Princeton. The originals must be rare.

Another amp you don't hear much about is the tweed Harvard. A harp player I know bought one in a thrift shop for $50. The lady who ran the shop told him it was broken and didn't put out any heat. Yep, she thought it was a little space heater <LOL>. When I plugged my guitar into that Harvard amp I instantly became a tweed convert.

I'd like to build both, a Princeton and a Champ... and a few others like a Bassman and low power Twin. Since I'm on a budget and am more into recording than gigging right now the next project will be one of the small ones. Maybe a Princeton...

-Al

[projectMalamute]

Looks pretty close to me.

[Al Rogers]

Those aren't the same amps that I'm considering. I'm looking at a 5F1 versus a 5F2A. The circuits are similar for them also. However there are different transformers, different speakers, and different cabinets for the two models.

I'm wondering if the 8 inch 4 ohm speaker in the Champ might not be easier to fit into a mix as compared with a 10 or 12 inch speaker. It seems logical that an 8 inch speaker in a small cabinet would have a smaller sonic footprint. I haven't done much engineering/mixing so I can't say whether that would equate to any kind of recording advantage.

-Al