Why did the 1073 become the classic, most wanted neve ?

[gainreduction]

As the subject goes.

I'm just curious.

There are many other Neve input modules that could and/or should have reached the same status but still the 1073 is now, in fact, THE Neve module.

Why not the 1084 ? More versatile eq but same preamp (correct me if I'm wrong). Or the 1066 which is very similar to the 1073.

Why 1073 ?

[Thumper]

Originally Posted by gainreduction

As the subject goes.

I'm just curious.

There are many other Neve input modules that could and/or should have reached the same status but still the 1073 is now, in fact, THE Neve module.

Why not the 1084 ? More versatile eq but same preamp (correct me if I'm wrong). Or the 1066 which is very similar to the 1073.

Why 1073 ?

Because someone on Gearslutz said that it was, and I quote, "the best preamp ever". They were affordable back in the day. Everyone started buying them up, because they could afford them, and then EVERYONE wanted one, whether they knew how they sounded or not. (sound familiar?!?!?).

Now, everyone STILL wants one, they STILL don't know what they sound like, but they cost $5k.

Why the others aren't as popular? Because it doesn't say "1073" like what was on Gearslutz.... THAT'S why...

[GYang]

I wondered, too.
After made stupid step to buy it (paying overblown price) I made clever step and started listening by myself. Now I can understand words of highly admired Rupert Neve who also doesn't understand that phenomenon.

Some of thoughts well spreaded here and around studios:

-people are familiar with 'that sound'
-it will make almost every mic sounding good or better
-good sounding instruments (vocals, whatever) will sound great and great sounding perfect
-no 'world level studio' shoud be at least without couple of 1073 in rack
-multiple Grammys awarded engineer (mixer, producer) ___put name___ used it here and there, so judge by your ears

Is it good or great pres?
For all owners definitely yes.
I sold mine, so my opinion could be biased.

[Empty Planet]

Originally Posted by GYang

I sold mine, so my opinion could be biased.

[Fletcher]

The 1073 was the most sold module by Neve® so it became the defacto standard number for the "sheep factor" set.

"I know I love Neve® stuff because I'm really cool if I love Neve® stuff and seem edumakated... and I know this one number so it goes without saying that I NEED a Neve® Ten-Seventy-Three or I'll just be another 2 bit punque hack"... or it comes out to "I saw Neve® 1073's being used by ____ when I was an assistant so I know I can make hit records just like my mentor if I use Neve® 1073's".... except Bruce Swedien [the Zen master of the post Beatles era] uses 1084's... so I'm not really an upper eschelon follower of the leader until I know that 1084's are better"... and/or you talked to enough pimps to know that the other consoles that were taken apart to satisfy the original "I gotta have a Neve® module or I'm a gonna die" demand [which for the most part was created by the pimps because we all had Neve® modules piled up to the ceiling] had modules in them like 1095's and 1079's etc., etc., etc. which makes those guys the kings of the 1073 heap... because they know other numbers!! [or read some dumbass article I wrote for MIX 10 years ago that has a brief and cursory version of the number soup dictionary].

What was never really true has become legend... what is true is that there are tools that far exceed what those tools did... but they don't have the sheep factor / buzz word cache that the old Neve® tools had so they know enough to know a numbah or too and those modules sell for about triple what they should [because the demand was raised by the pimps to the price was made commensurate with the supply... which at one time was ample and is currently woefully short of where it should be which is why the "clone boys" can build crap with the right color knobs and help fill the demand created by the pimps raising the price.

True story... in 1991 David Moyles [Coast to Coast Audio - Toronto] and I were chatting... I told him I could have the price of 1073's over $2k in 2 years... he told me I was crazy [at that time we used to buy them for about $500 a piece and sell them for like $750... which in the scheme of things was high but not nearly as ridiculous as it is now]... once the $2k mark was hit [by about the end of '93, beginning of '94] we went for $3k, then $3,500-... but the supply was starting to dry up and more people got into the game so the competition to purchase the remaining remant consoles grew to ridiculous proportions, the sales competition grew and the legend was exploded past reasonable levels as a bunch of people [none of them named Rupert Neve] earned on "past reputation" and myth that this shit was "the magic bullet" [I stand absolutely guity as a motherfvcker of helping to create this myth shit]... interestingly I was talking with a couple of friends last night that we may have closed "Mercenary Iron Works" a decade to early [and/or started MIW a decade to early] as we could probably be selling the shit out of those sized frames again as the "1073" and "1073-esque" explosion hits new levels and there has never been a mounting system that was even close to comparable to the old MIW stuff.

To answer the original question... the 1073 has become THE module because the vast majority of the buying public has little idea of what they're actually doing and are too lazy to do actual investigative work for what tools will actually work best for them [so we end up with "what's the best mic ever?" kinda questions] or their applications as applications.

[MichaelAngelo]

Originally Posted by Fletcher

The 1073 was the most sold module by Neve® so it became the defacto standard number for the "sheep factor" set.

"I know I love Neve® stuff because I'm really cool if I love Neve® stuff and seem edumakated... and I know this one number so it goes without saying that I NEED a Neve® Ten-Seventy-Three or I'll just be another 2 bit punque hack"... or it comes out to "I saw Neve® 1073's being used by ____ when I was an assistant so I know I can make hit records just like my mentor if I use Neve® 1073's".... except Bruce Swedien [the Zen master of the post Beatles era] uses 1084's... so I'm not really an upper eschelon follower of the leader until I know that 1084's are better"... and/or you talked to enough pimps to know that the other consoles that were taken apart to satisfy the original "I gotta have a Neve® module or I'm a gonna die" demand [which for the most part was created by the pimps because we all had Neve® modules piled up to the ceiling] had modules in them like 1095's and 1079's etc., etc., etc. which makes those guys the kings of the 1073 heap... because they know other numbers!! [or read some dumbass article I wrote for MIX 10 years ago that has a brief and cursory version of the number soup dictionary].

What was never really true has become legend... what is true is that there are tools that far exceed what those tools did... but they don't have the sheep factor / buzz word cache that the old Neve® tools had so they know enough to know a numbah or too and those modules sell for about triple what they should [because the demand was raised by the pimps to the price was made commensurate with the supply... which at one time was ample and is currently woefully short of where it should be which is why the "clone boys" can build crap with the right color knobs and help fill the demand created by the pimps raising the price.

True story... in 1991 David Moyles [Coast to Coast Audio - Toronto] and I were chatting... I told him I could have the price of 1073's over $2k in 2 years... he told me I was crazy [at that time we used to buy them for about $500 a piece and sell them for like $750... which in the scheme of things was high but not nearly as ridiculous as it is now]... once the $2k mark was hit [by about the end of '93, beginning of '94] we went for $3k, then $3,500-... but the supply was starting to dry up and more people got into the game so the competition to purchase the remaining remant consoles grew to ridiculous proportions, the sales competition grew and the legend was exploded past reasonable levels as a bunch of people [none of them named Rupert Neve] earned on "past reputation" and myth that this shit was "the magic bullet" [I stand absolutely guity as a motherfvcker of helping to create this myth shit]... interestingly I was talking with a couple of friends last night that we may have closed "Mercenary Iron Works" a decade to early [and/or started MIW a decade to early] as we could probably be selling the shit out of those sized frames again as the "1073" and "1073-esque" explosion hits new levels and there has never been a mounting system that was even close to comparable to the old MIW stuff.

To answer the original question... the 1073 has become THE module because the vast majority of the buying public has little idea of what they're actually doing and are too lazy to do actual investigative work for what tools will actually work best for them [so we end up with "what's the best mic ever?" kinda questions] or their applications as applications.

I am sorry fletcher, But you missed the point... THE NEVE 1073 HAS BECOME SO POPULAR BECAUSE IT HAS A CERTIAN DESIRED SONIC PERSONALITY. i have tried many copies, including the DPA's,.. yes they were cleaner, maybe faster, but lacked the tone and vibe a original 1073 has... But just saying everybody wants one cause its faddy is rediculous.....remember strat or les paul......guys lets not discount.........tone. People keep buying les pauls cause it has a certian sound......You guys sound like the same people that say that most the people on the radio have no talent... lets hear you sing that good!

[Thumper]

Originally Posted by MichaelAngelo

You guys sound like the same people that say that most the people on the radio have no talent... lets hear you sing that good!

Give me an iLok with an Autotune authorization on it, 12 hours to work on one verse for a song, Melodyne... and I'm up to the challenge. Throw in a 58 too, cause most other mics would sound too good, which in turn would make me sound like shit.

Oh... and I get to keep the iLok and the mic for me proving it to you...

[xist]

So Fletcher, you're basically saying the 1073's "explosion" is a side-effect of capitalism? Interesting ;-)

[Geoff_T]

Originally Posted by Fletcher

The 1073 was the most sold module by Neve® so it became the defacto standard number for the "sheep factor" set.

What was never really true has become legend... what is true is that there are tools that far exceed what those tools did... but they don't have the sheep factor / buzz word cache that the old Neve® tools had so they know enough to know a numbah or too and those modules sell for about triple what they should [because the demand was raised by the pimps to the price was made commensurate with the supply... which at one time was ample and is currently woefully short of where it should be which is why the "clone boys" can build crap with the right color knobs and help fill the demand created by the pimps raising the price.

Hi Fletcher

I agree with what you posted there. I know for a fact that decades ago, when TV studios were off loading their old Neve consoles for super-de-luxe replacements, that (probably with a bit of palm greasing) the consoles were written off and sold for around £2,000 to the Neve broker.

That's at least 24 x 1073 and a boat load of 1272's for peanuts.

Consequently, the damn things could easily be sold for £100 each and you'd still come out on top!

Then, off course, the demand outstripped the supply and more old Neve consoles fell to the breaker's hammer to try to meet the demand.

Yup, 1073 is a buzz word, like 1272 and 1081... which are the models the cloners try to replicate.

1084, 1290, 1095? Who's heard of them?!!!

[Durv]

i gotta agree with Fletcher here. There are many pres that do such a wonderful job, and are so much more affordable.
$hit, i still use a UA 2108 on snare!

Durv

[T_R_S]

I agree with Fletcher (for once) but I'll call it the Lemmings factor just to be different.
Neve is a popular name like Nuemann, SSL, Protools etc.
There are plenty of alternatives in the market today that are probably every bit as good for less money.

[raal]

there was a time you could get Pultecs for $350. when the LA2 came out Fairchilds were being used as doorstops. how much could you get U47s and M49s for when the 'new improved' models came out? alot of that suff is going for unreal prices now.

but the fact is, no matter what you could get them for in the 70s 80s, you sure can't get them for that now. i have some lowly 1272s that don't sound any worse now than when i bought them. same with my 312s and V72s, Pultecs, etc. -- they still look good, sound good, and if/when i ever wanna sell 'em i'll get more $ than i did when i purchased them. try that with digital gear or brand spankin' new pres.

i'm a sheeeep baby so why don't you kill me...

[Ricey]

60Hz on the EQ - it's 70Hz on the 1084, right? that's why i like the 1073 more.

[Geoff_T]

Originally Posted by Ricey

60Hz on the EQ - it's 70Hz on the 1084, right? that's why i like the 1073 more.

Hi

You are teasing aren't you? A 10Hz difference in a high pass filter roll-over point over all the extra features of a 1084?

[t.dizzle]

I've used both the 1084's and 1073's side by side many times and I prefer 1073's overall. Sure, there are many (well, not that many) pres that sound good...but there's something special about the 1073. I hear it. Many professionals hear it, too. I understand the other points brought up here about the hype factor and most people not even knowing what these units even sound like, but it's an insult to those of us who know what we're hearing to suggest that we are just imagining things.

[ofsaints]

Originally Posted by t.dizzle

I've used both the 1084's and 1073's side by side many times and I prefer 1073's overall. Sure, there are many (well, not that many) pres that sound good...but there's something special about the 1073. I hear it. Many professionals hear it, too. I understand the other points brought up here about the hype factor and most people not even knowing what these units even sound like, but it's an insult to those of us who know what we're hearing to suggest that we are just imagining things.

I dont think anybody here is denying that the 1073s sound great. I think the general consensus is that there are cheaper and possibly better alternatives.

[Geoff_T]

Originally Posted by t.dizzle

I've used both the 1084's and 1073's side by side many times and I prefer 1073's overall. Sure, there are many (well, not that many) pres that sound good...but there's something special about the 1073. I hear it. Many professionals hear it, too. I understand the other points brought up here about the hype factor and most people not even knowing what these units even sound like, but it's an insult to those of us who know what we're hearing to suggest that we are just imagining things.

Hi

Nobody is insulting you. My sole premise is that there were endless circuit/parts list revisions, the modules may have been from any batch in that time line, the modules may also have received a different maintenance regime, etc., so it's very hard to make definitive comparisons unless you have two brand new, untampered modules to compare with.

Yes, there may be a difference... but what is the cause of that difference?

[Ricey]

Originally Posted by Geoff_T

Hi

You are teasing aren't you? A 10Hz difference in a high pass filter roll-over point over all the extra features of a 1084?

it's been years since i had a chance to use these, and when i did, there would be two only - i liked them on the kick and bass guitar. don't get me wrong, they're both great, but yes, i definitely wanted those 10 particular Hertzeses.

[Steamy Williams]

Originally Posted by Ricey

60Hz on the EQ - it's 70Hz on the 1084, right? that's why i like the 1073 more.

Originally Posted by Ricey

it's been years since i had a chance to use these, and when i did, there would be two only - i liked them on the kick and bass guitar. don't get me wrong, they're both great, but yes, i definitely wanted those 10 particular Hertzeses.

AFAIK, the two lowest frequencies on the high pass filter on the 1073 are 50Hz & 80Hz, whereas on the 1084 there are 45Hz & 70Hz.

So maybe it was the 1084 you preferred.

[Ricey]

i'm actually thinking of the band choices on the low shelf, isn't there a 60Hz on the 1073, as opposed to 70(or 80?) on the 1084?

[Steamy Williams]

Originally Posted by Ricey

i'm actually thinking of the band choices on the low shelf, isn't there a 60Hz on the 1073, as opposed to 70(or 80?) on the 1084?

AFAIK they both include 60Hz on the low band parametric.

[Geoff_T]

Originally Posted by Ricey

it's been years since i had a chance to use these, and when i did, there would be two only - i liked them on the kick and bass guitar. don't get me wrong, they're both great, but yes, i definitely wanted those 10 particular Hertzeses.

Hi

Yes, but with the bestest of respect, don't think for one minute that the figures silk screened on the front panels are precise. Neve didn't use silver-mica 1% capacitors in their filter networks and the components could be at least +/- 10% tolerance.

So, you could have a high 60Hz or a low 70% and it would have a similar roll off curve.

Plus they only really start doing serious attenuation down in the sub bass region if you are starting rolling at 60Hz, though, granted, if this is the sound you like, that's OK!

By the way, if you ever sweep the curves of the 1073 EQ they will be nothing like those published in the 1073 brochure! I recall Mr Neve presenting our graphics girl, Linda, with curves that he had drawn and she "polished" on her drawing board to become the curves on the brochure!

[Ricey]

you're right - the hp filter then...

[Steamy Williams]

Originally Posted by Ricey

you're right - the hp filter then...

So given the extra 10Hz made a significant difference to you, which one did you actually prefer if the high pass filter on the 1084 does 70Hz, but the 1073 does 80Hz instead of 60Hz?

[Ricey]

yeah, i've just had a look at all three. so i think it was the 1066 i preferred!
but no 60Hz on any of the filters, i'm tripping.

[Seamus TM]

Originally Posted by Fletcher

What was never really true has become legend... what is true is that there are tools that far exceed what those tools did... but they don't have the sheep factor / buzz word cache that the old Neve® tools had so they know enough to know a numbah or too and those modules sell for about triple what they should

you mean like pro tools?

[Seamus TM]

Originally Posted by FLYMAX

Dont forget too that the studios that pay 4k+ for them aren't fools..
A lot of people who come in to a studio to record feel better pulling out their money when there are 1073's in the house..

you mean like pro tools?

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by gainreduction

.

Why not the 1084 ?

There were more 1073's made. Its very difficult to find an original 1084 right now and they are fetching premium prices.

Originally Posted by gainreduction

Or the 1066 which is very similar to the 1073.

The 1066 has the fixed 10K(which can be modified) but it doesn't have the magic freq points in the mids.

Originally Posted by gainreduction

Why 1073 ?

To me it comes down to these freq points:(7.2k, 4.8k, 3.2k, 1.6k).

With these points you can make a vocal sing or snare crack or pop in the mix and they are almost always right on the money.

That's all you need to know.

[El Fatso]

Originally Posted by thethrillfactor

There were more 1073's made. Its very difficult to find an original 1084 right now and they are fetching premium prices.

speaking of 1084s...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Neve-1084-Rack-w...QQcmdZViewItem

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by El Fatso

speaking of 1084s...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Neve-1084-Rack-w...QQcmdZViewItem

These are reissues not originals.