BAC500 and Brute: redundant?

[ben_allison]

Bamp.

[NathanEldred]

I thought one is a FET and one is an Opto. That would (at least based on my own personal knowledge) make them complementary.

[ben_allison]

That's true... I'm thinking they might compliment each other...

I've also been thinking about the Leviathan. :P

My primary compressor needs are for vocals, bass, guitars, drum smash, and mix buss. IT just seems like the Brute is absolutely killing it for opto vox bass duties. Seems like a good starting point anyway (I have no outboard except for a Sweet Ten and some CAPI pres, so these would be my first comps).

[Kags]

I have two Brutes. I bought them after having the Vac Rac TSL-4 in my studio for a couple months. The TSL-4 is ridiculous for vocals, bass, drums, etc.. I also have a single Vac Rac Limiter module in the old sled loaded rack. After not being able to convince my wife to let me drop the money on the TSL-4, I demoed the Brute, the Vogad and couple other 500 series modules and the Brute won out by a long shot. It is very flexible, with 40 steps for gain and reduction, along with the HPF sidechain. I don't have another outboard compressor that I would put on a lead vocal before the Brute, except for the TSL-4. The Brute can do the Stun thing, with the gain up and the reduction at max for the rock vocal sound, or it can be much more gentle, like an LA2a without the distortion and color. The Brute is very subtly colored, but very big sounding - it just brings things forward, thanks to the xformer and super clean circuit. I also find it great on bass, especially when you play with the sidechain filter. There are a lot of compression options from the one box and pair is pretty affordable. Great for tracking and mixing, imho...

[Tony Shepperd]

IMO the best way to test a unit is in your rack, in your studio. Especially the BAC 500.

[ben_allison]

Originally Posted by Tony Shepperd

IMO the best way to test a unit is in your rack, in your studio. Especially the BAC 500.

Oh agreed. Just putting out feelers. With limited funds and just screwing around, it helps to narrow down the things I have to audition. Otherwise I'd just buy all the compressors and never see the light of day.

[pan60]

I absolutely love the Pete's Place BAC comp.

Seem to be a great do-it-all compressor.

indeed it is: )
I also love the AML 54F50 as well as the API 527. Just some hard comps to beat.

[LoFiAudio]

Originally Posted by ben_allison

I've also been thinking about the Leviathan. :P

I'd like to submit that the Leviathan is also an excellent complimentary flavor to the BAC- it sounds wonderful, and gives you a lot more options than the Brute with the adjustable Attack and Release, but also gives you easy to use two knob operation in vintage mode. A very nice comp indeed!

Plus, Nathan is a great guy too!

[LoFiAudio]

Oh, yeah, and the BAC-500 is KILLER too! A great choice.

[ben_allison]

Originally Posted by pan60

I absolutely love the Pete's Place BAC comp.

I knew it was only a matter of time before you piped in with your love of the BAC500!

Originally Posted by LoFiAudio

I'd like to submit that the Leviathan is also an excellent complimentary flavor to the BAC

Has anyone compared it to the Brute? The Brute just seems to have the non-pumping opto, vox/bass thing down. But the additional controls on the Leviathan are enticing...

[ben_allison]

I'm pretty set on the BAC500. Seems like it could be a workhorse (especially since I have ZERO outboard now, apart from pres).

This might turn into a Brute vs Leviathan thread, since those two seem to have far more overlap, given that they're both opto, and with the Leviathan in Vintage mode, their functionality seems to be pretty similar.

[rob S]

I love the bac. I have a pair.
They are grt on gtrs bass drums.
They can be aggresive or neutral.
Very well made classy piece of gear.

[NathanEldred]

Originally Posted by ben_allison

But the additional controls on the Leviathan are enticing...

There is always a dedicated demo or two here for people who would like to try them.

[cbdrummer44]

I've got a Brute. Absolutely awesome. Big sounding (in terms of the tone it imparts) and just perfect in a lot of ways.

I actually found this thread searching for the BAC 500. No way in hell I'd let go of the Brute, but to answer your question I think both would compliment eachother very well. Tracking wise, the Brute's where it is at. You can take it to about 7db of GR without even hearing it.

I often find myself at mixdown going back through the Brute again subtly and then through an 1176 type plugin. Almost every time. So I'm actually looking at a FET style compressor to go after it eventually and the BAC seems to be the go around here, or a likely place to start in terms of testing.

I will say this though - what the Brute does for me in terms of tracking is pretty irreplaceable. If I could only have one, it'd be the Brute because of its ease of use. You can't really go wrong with it. Then again, if you only get one you'll always wonder..."what if I got the other"....so get both!

[ben_allison]

Originally Posted by cbdrummer44

I've got a Brute. Absolutely awesome. Big sounding (in terms of the tone it imparts) and just perfect in a lot of ways...I will say this though - what the Brute does for me in terms of tracking is pretty irreplaceable. If I could only have one, it'd be the Brute because of its ease of use. You can't really go wrong with it. Then again, if you only get one you'll always wonder..."what if I got the other"....so get both!

Nice! The idea of benig able to knock off a bunch of db's on vox without pumping or hardly any artifacts is pretty sweet.

And more and more it seems like the Brute and BAC500 would compliment each other.

[Ernest Buckley]

Originally Posted by ben_allison

So I have a Sweet Ten that needs filling. 4 spaces are dedicated to pres. I'm thinking I'll grab a pair of A Designs EM-PEQs. I'm positive I'll devote two slots to something buss-related (a Vandergraph or two AM660s perhaps? That will require its own thread).

So that leaves two slots. While I prefer buy in pairs (so I can run stereo tracks) I also see value in having options. Since so many sources (vox, bass, snare, guitar) are mono, variety might be nice.

So I thought about grabbing a Brute. It seems to be emerging as the ideal 500 compressor for vocals. I'm also thinking about a Pete's Place BAC500. Seem to be a great do-it-all compressor.

But apparently the BAC500 is a great comp for vocals too (can smash without too much pumping).

So I'm just wondering if the Brute would be too much of a one trick pony... or perhaps made redundant by the BAC500.

I'm only interested in tone/colour boxes. I'm going to keep all the surgical/corrective stuff ITB.

From the audio files I have heard online, I really like the BAC... probably the most transparent of the 500 series comps... with that said, for another $400 you could get a Distressor. I don`t think there are any 500 series comps that come close to the versatility of the Distressor. I could be wrong but I just haven`t heard any yet. Something to consider...

[ben_allison]

Originally Posted by Ernest Buckley

From the audio files I have heard online, I really like the BAC... probably the most transparent of the 500 series comps... with that said, for another $400 you could get a Distressor. I don`t think there are any 500 series comps that come close to the versatility of the Distressor. I could be wrong but I just haven`t heard any yet. Something to consider...

But I have a half empty 500 rack that I want to fill.

[Ernest Buckley]

Originally Posted by ben_allison

But I have a half empty 500 rack that I want to fill.

That`s what I figured!

I have 4 empty spaces in my lunchbox...

[ben_allison]

Originally Posted by Ernest Buckley

That`s what I figured!

I have 4 empty spaces in my lunchbox...

Yeah! I mean I'd love you to get a bunch of other outboard at some point. I'm just looking to fill this puppy up. So far its:

VP26 (x2)
VP28 (x2)

I'm pretty sold on a pair of A-Designs EM-PEQ's.

That leaves four spaces.

My front runners are:

Brute
BAC500
Vandergraph

Though, I'm still open to another pair of EQ's for more tone shaping.

[cbdrummer44]

Originally Posted by ben_allison

Yeah! I mean I'd love you to get a bunch of other outboard at some point. I'm just looking to fill this puppy up. So far its:

VP26 (x2)
VP28 (x2)

I'm pretty sold on a pair of A-Designs EM-PEQ's.

That leaves four spaces.

My front runners are:

Brute
BAC500
Vandergraph

Though, I'm still open to another pair of EQ's for more tone shaping.

Yeah the BAC will definitely compliment the Brute no question. Just on EQ's, I was pretty set on the Maag EQ4 until I tried the plugin. The air band sounds incredible but it just wasn't flexible enough in the mids on vocals for my taste.

YMMV but the only reason I mention is that I felt like The Maag and a Pultec style EQ was doubling up in a way. Heaps of bottom and tops but very little mid range flexibility.

Got my eyes on a Buzz Audio Tonic which seems as though it'll be the ticket, just have to try it. Still had the wide band for tone shaping but is sweep able. Very interested to hear it.

[cbdrummer44]

That was just in relation to you mentioning about getting the EMPEQ and another EQ on top of that

[ben_allison]

Nice tip! I was thinking the Purple Odd might be a nice compliment, but the Tonic seems pretty neat too.

[thesoundpost]

I thought I'd chime in since I own several of the units mentioned in this thread. For compressors I have BAC, API 525, Brute and Buzz Essence. For EQ's Buzz Tonic, Harrison 32, Helios 69 and Purple Odd. My choice would be Buzz Essence and Purple Odd.

The Essence is very flexible, super smooth and to my ears doesn't change the color of the incoming signal too much. It just makes it sound a little bigger and more polished and is capable of a lot of gain reduction without pumping. It has all the controls you need and can be linked.

The Odd has a lot more color than the Tonic, but it's a color I seem to like. The frequency choices are limited of course, but it's still pretty flexible because you can really crank those knobs. It never gets nasty. I also like its high shelf more than any of the other units I have. Very smooth. A tone shaper.

Good luck making a decision!

Martijn.

[thesoundpost]

For what it's worth: I could live without the BAC, but I would never get rid of my 525 :-)

[roho]

martijn, it would be awesome if you could share your experiences with those 4 comps you listed in terms of regular uses and strengths and weaknesses. i'm particularly interested in your assessment of the brute as it's been on my radar for a while.
thanks!

[jrod9900]

I have the BAC500, an 1176, some API 527s, an LA610, and a Serpent SB4001.

For what you are looking for, I think the BAC500 would be a great candidate. I just tracked vox with it this weekend. My chain was Mojave 201 - Chandler Lil Devil - BAC500 - API 550. I usually set the attack fairly slow for tracking, but I was getting quite a bit of reduction on peaks without really hearing the compression at all. It was so smooth.

To my ears the BAC500 adds a hair more grit than an 1176. I will usually track vox with the BAC and mix vox thru an 1176. Bass kills with the BAC500. It's also awesome to use for crushing drums and light snare reduction. Haven't used it on guitars yet.

Just my $.02.

JROD

[ben_allison]

I want all the compressors.

[thesoundpost]

OK, thread closed

[ben_allison]

lol