A question to PRO MIXING ENGINEERS, what to do when clients give you shitty drums??

[Karloff70]

I'm touched again. Twice in the same thread.....

Thanks for the nice words and support.

[deft_bonz]

Originally Posted by jonathan jetter

1. i try to communicate with the artist or producer and (politely) broach the subject of the sounds. and see if they were intentional or not.

+1 Very good
Usually they trust you and let you change the kick. A lot of time saved

[George Necola]

karloff I am desperate.. pm me..

[Karloff70]

Originally Posted by George Necola

karloff I am desperate.. pm me..

I know you are. I can't help you.

[George Necola]

Originally Posted by Karloff70

I know you are. I can't help you.

now I have to report you

[Karloff70]

Originally Posted by George Necola

now I have to report you

Petze!

[deft_bonz]

Originally Posted by Karloff70

Petze!

Bingo

[kosmokrator]

Originally Posted by juniorhifikit

One has to define "shitty". Sometimes shitty is good. If I think the drums sound bad, I ask the artist what they were going for before I start changing things. Sometimes I've been surprised when what I thought was shitty, was actually done on purpose, and sounds quite correct for this genre that I didn't know much about. I learn new things all the time from artists I work with.

Other times they give me crap and say they want "xxxx" sound. Then I start digging in the sample bin.

BINGO!

Always ask first! The higher you climb the ladder, the more important this gets.
You're the mixer, NOT the producer. It might be that those sounds are exactly what the producer wanted.
Maybe not. Then take out your favourite samples to replace/augment and your bag of mixing tricks.
But, seriously, ask first!

[u b k]

Originally Posted by Glassindo

? What does it take to make drums sound great enough to support a hit song.

Great drums are great drums regardless of whether the song is a hit song or not. Mostly it takes good ears, and it helps to have the right tools. The better the source, the easier your job is. I suspect you know this already and are merely being argumentative, but it's a fair question so It deserves a fair answer.

You have made hit songs right?

No sir, not yet, but I routinely make drums sound amazing and I routinely have conversations with mixers whose credits and workproduct reside at the top of the field, so I feel confident in sharing my take on the matter. The pro mixers I know will do anything and everything required to make the drums (and every other element and aspect of the mix) be what it needs to be in order to serve the production to its fullest; afaict, that's the basic job description.

That may seem like a tautology, but plenty of people in these waters have a purist or idealistic view of the process that, IMHO, prevents them from doing the job the way the big boys do. It is for them that I post such simple reminders.


Gregory Scott - ubk

[Karloff70]

Originally Posted by u b k

That may seem like a tautology, but plenty of people in these waters have a purist or idealistic view of the process that, IMHO, prevents them from doing the job the way the big boys do. It is for them that I post such simple reminders.


Gregory Scott - ubk

Ain't that the truth.....lol.......enter the "I only cut, never boost" and " You shouldn't need to _____" and "Too much compression is bad" and all that rubbish. The trick was never to 'never do this and always do that' or such, but to simply do whatever it takes, know WHAT that might be from assessing the situation, and be able to do it fast enough to get the gig finished on deadline.
Takes getting to the other side of the long micro learning zone though, back to the surface where you hear the actual tune and how it works/wants to work, not just frequencies and technicalities. Many stay inside that micro learning zone it seems.....from where you can't see the wood from the trees.....

[Ryan Gregory]

Originally Posted by joeq

I too, chose Audio as my career out of a sheer desire to give the people KILLER KICK DRUMS.

Of course I was young and naive then, and have since also discovered AWESOME SNARE DRUMS, HUGE GUITARS and IN YOUR FACE VOCALS

hahaha well said!

[jrhager84]

How much are the slapper samples?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Gearslutz App

[Karloff70]

Originally Posted by jrhager84

How much are the slapper samples?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Gearslutz App

All info here:

karloff70's "Slappers&Fluffers" kick drum toolkit

[kafka]

Originally Posted by joeq

I too, chose Audio as my career out of a sheer desire to give the people KILLER KICK DRUMS.

Of course I was young and naive then, and have since also discovered AWESOME SNARE DRUMS, HUGE GUITARS and IN YOUR FACE VOCALS

Don't forget the motherfunkin' bass.

[wwittman]

Originally Posted by aarvin2

...The problem is I like my clients to have ASTOUNDING mixes and KILLER KICK DRUMS ...

you're right.
that's the problem.

because it's supposed to be about what your clients want, not what you 'like to have'

[joeq]

Originally Posted by kafka

Don't forget the motherfunkin' bass.

omg, I almost forgot the MOTHERFUNKIN BASS

[aarvin2]

Originally Posted by wwittman

you're right.
that's the problem.

because it's supposed to be about what your clients want, not what you 'like to have'

The problem is that not all my clients or people I deal with, are experts in knowing how good kick drums should sound and specially how awful shitty drums sound on big sound systems... even I couldn't notice between a good kick drum and an average one before.

For them if it sounds good in crappy monitors, untreated room etc etc ... they assume it will sound good in the club ... but NO WAY.

Creating good kick drums for EDM seems to be an an easy deal BUT u'd be shocked to hear how many people, sometimes talented producers get it wrong ... and if you look out there u'll find out that only a select number of people have amazing sounding kick drums.

I go out from time to time in big festivals, clubs and stuff, and man it is very noticeable when a kick drum is amazing, and how the crowd reacts to that.



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I finally found a way to go around my client's kick drum this time I kept the flabby splatty kick drum(he gave me) for the intro where the bass is predominant and just created another one that knocks and punches properly in the peak time. Quite a nice contrast I find

I'll post a sample when I finish it if u'd like to hear the difference

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By the way Boris's samples are astonishing!! there are some real gems in there, which have the ability and quality to be processed and taken even further into real beasts. I would really advise this pack to people worth the money ??? YEEESSSS!!!(even though I was lucky enough to have them for free) and I will be using them as soon as I get my slate digital plugin :D yeeeheee :D

Thanks again for this amazing pack Sir



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Thanks sincerely a lot guys for you input I have read the posts and found lots of useful information Now I have got many ways to get out of this situation and will be using the good advices

THANKS A LOT

[Karloff70]

Originally Posted by aarvin2

By the way Boris's samples are astonishing!! there are some real gems in there, which have the ability and quality to be processed and taken even further into real beasts. I would really advise this pack to people worth the money ??? YEEESSSS!!!(even though I was lucky enough to have them for free) and I will be using them as soon as I get my slate digital plugin :D yeeeheee :D

Thanks again for this amazing pack Sir

Glad you found they hit the spot.

[nino213]

Originally Posted by Karloff70

You sir, are going to get a complimentary set of my Slappers&Fluffers kick drum tool kit samples for free as you sound so desperate.

These are pretty damned useful for exactly your problem, as if the original kick doesn't have enough, or the right type of punch, you slip a slapper (i.e. a transient heavy) kick on top, sorting out the front edge but keeping the original tone of body as it works = instant.

Or the other way, if the original kick does have the right front edge punch, but not enough or the wrong type of body, you slip a fluffer on top (i.e. a rolled off attack, body only kick sample) and voila.

PM me your email address and the Slappers&Fluffers will be on their way. I imagine your problem on the "mixing other people's kick drums" front will be largely over after that.

Haven't heard the sound-kit but the act deserves recognition and certainly sounds nice.

[Slipperman]

"A question to PRO MIXING ENGINEERS, what to do when clients give you shitty drums??"

Optimally...


1.) I get on the phone and try to get paid more.

2.) I get an extra assistant engineer in play.

3.) I start to drink heavily and talk to myself.

4.) I throw up a thoroughly baffling wall of bullsh*t that would take a week to explain and is none of your business anyways.

HOHOHO.

Kinda.

SM.

[Barish]

Originally Posted by wwittman

you're right.
that's the problem.

because it's supposed to be about what your clients want, not what you 'like to have'

LOL!

Too true.

B.

[Sudad G]

If the kick just misses punchyness or contour I would use the Sonnox TransMod plugin. It's a kind of transient designer plugin, but with more tweaking possibilities than the SPL. Works fine for me.

If the kick is really unusable I would usually call the client and ask him, whether it would be possible to send me a mixdown without the kick. It's the best solution because it gives you also the possibility to tweak his bass sound too - someone who uses a bad kick often uses a bad bass sound too or mixed it wrong

If it's impossible then I try to eliminate his kick with a combination of a new kick sample with a little sidechain compression. The new kick triggers the sidechain compressor.

When I have to replace the kick I generally speak with the client before. It prevents a lot of stress

Slate trigger would be also a very very comfort solution - if you add some more EDM samples to its library.


Sudad G