Bottom Tom Mics, and comments.

[knerd]

question one: Who here mics the bottom of toms as well as the top? if so, which mics do you like for the bottoms? how do you use them in the mix?

The reason I ask is because I NEVER mic the bottom of toms anymore, the reason for that is because I only have 16 inputs into protools.. so I need to use them sparingly..


extra question :-) ... when I was young, and recording my band in my parents' basement, our drummer didn't have skins on the bottom of his toms.. So what I did to mic them was just stick a mic right inside, usually pointing where the skin meets the shell.. ... WOW... I mean, they really booooomed!! ever since then, I've yet to run into a drummer that doesn't use bottom skins on the toms.. Am I competely alone? I mean, I'm not an idiot, I've worked on platnium selling records etc etc etc.. I know what I hear and everytime I bring it up, people pretty much laugh at me!


discuss :-P

[tubejay]

I've only done it a few times as it is such a huge hassle, and every time I did it, or watched others do it, I preferred the sound of one mic.

[Bob Olhsson]

The only way I've gotten good results was by gating the bottom mike and triggering it off the top.

[Apemandan]

I read that Ken Nelson, Coldplay's producer, mics the bottom of toms. I have never had any success with it myself. I prefer to get the bulk of the information from my overheads or room mics and just 'firm up' the sound with a spot on the top skin.

[PhilE]

Yep I do it. I tend to use the Samson clip Qtoms- dont laugh at me here... better than the Senhieser, AKGs etc that I've tried there- I like 421s on top and Q-Toms under for rock n roll.

I have also gone with the single skin thing you mentioned if I cant force what I want from a drum with a dodgy shell or hoop... been a long time since though.

[mtstudi@pacbell]

I have used an RE-20 on the bottom of Floor Toms on occasion to get more bottom end. Tom Allom (ala Judas Priest producer) use to use sm58's ONLY, on the bottom of concert toms (no bottom heads). At least that is the way he did it on an album I played on.

www.bluethumbproductions.com

[by-tor]

I have only done it once. I used e609's on the bottom sounded really cool. It added some nice depth. I wanna try a subkick on the bottom of a floor tom.

[phelbin]

A mic under the snare adds more of the chain sound. What kind of sound do you get from the bottom of the toms?

[paterno]

Originally Posted by phelbin

A mic under the snare adds more of the chain sound. What kind of sound do you get from the bottom of the toms?

More depth of tone. I am a big fan of micing underneath the toms. I started doing it again a few years back. I just mic the top and bottom, buss them together [flip the phase relative to the top mic, obviously], and then blend it to 'tape'. There's still plenty of attack, but there's more body to it. I don't mix in a ton of it with the top mic -- just enough to give it some girth. Then again, i like three mics on the snare...

JP

[blackcom]

Top AND Bottom micing demands a better tuned kit. Remember to set the bottom mic a little lower then the top mic in the mix (3/4 of the top mic level).

This method IMO provides bigger toms with less attach and focus and it don't allways fit in too well in a mix.

I've seen lots of engineers using sm57, MD421 or AKG414 for bottom micing.

When I need toms that are simply "moore" I use samples in addition instead of bottom mics.....make shure to tune the samples according to the mic signal and set them a little lower then the mics....

[Musiclab]

I used to be a sceptic, but now I find I like top and underneath mics on the toms.
They do sound bigger. I hate micing under the snare. Mic the side instead.

[adamcal]

Originally Posted by phelbin

A mic under the snare adds more of the chain sound. What kind of sound do you get from the bottom of the toms?

If the tom has 2 heads, the bottom mic will pick up more of the bottom head, it makes a sound too!!

[mwagener]

Lately I've been micing top and bottom of the toms again and love it. Fletcher reminded me of that method when we worked on the King's X drums together during the MOAW. I had done it in the 80s/90s and then kinda forgot about it. We used Josephsons 22s with great results. But 8 Josephsons (for 4 toms) are quite an investment, so I now mostly use SM58s on the top and Sennheiser 504s (now 604s) on the bottom. Since both mics are recorded out of phase it takes out quite a bit of the cymbal bleed as well. I mix them together to one track per tom.

[rainsinvelvet]

When doing a record with Steve Albini last year I was blown away by the number of mics he sets up. TOp and Bottom mics for everything..! I always thought he got his drum sounds using minimal micing, but atleast on this session there had to be like 14 mics on this 4 piece kit. How did it come out sounding?
Total huge drums ala Albini
How did the toms sound? HUge. (e22's top and bottom)

After that session I've messed around with it abit myself. I like the results and will do it if the time / sittuation permits..

ERic

[knerd]

Originally Posted by rainsinvelvet

When doing a record with Steve Albini last year I was blown away by the number of mics he sets up. TOp and Bottom mics for everything..! I always thought he got his drum sounds using minimal micing, but atleast on this session there had to be like 14 mics on this 4 piece kit. How did it come out sounding?
Total huge drums ala Albini
How did the toms sound? HUge. (e22's top and bottom)

After that session I've messed around with it abit myself. I like the results and will do it if the time / sittuation permits..

ERic

how do you tune the bottom skin compared to the top? I heard 1/2 step down? is that true?

[rainsinvelvet]

Sorry, I wasn't involved in tuning or playing the drums on the session. I do know that the drummer was going for the Keith Moon / John Bonham Type tones and get it pretty easy. Kick had a solid front head (no hole).

Anyhow, Sorry I can't comment more on the tom tuning. I usualy tweek em till they sound good

ERic

[phelbin]

Originally Posted by Musiclab

I hate micing under the snare. Mic the side instead.

Where? And what does it do?

[seaneldon]

Originally Posted by phelbin

Where? And what does it do?

in my experience it gets the woody slap sound. good job for a small diaphragm condenser. avoid pointing the mic at a hole on the side of the drum, which many drums have.