RND Master Buss Processor- My little ramble

[Peter Stengaard]

Sounds great on drum buss too !! There's so much you can do w it...wicked box

[klaukholm]

It is taking way too long to get a demo. Apparently the distributor has not yet received a single unit

edit: we purchased one and it is excellent

[mixerguy]

anyone else have one?

comments?

[mixerguy]

Originally Posted by Plush

Thank you Scientist for this great introduction to the box. You have helped me here for sure.

This week the new Neve box serial #8 came in to our room. I am using it to finish out a record here. I am experimenting and learning its capabilities as you are.

A fantastic unit, basically inaudible when adjusted properly, and adding a MAJOR glue / smoothing / finishing effect here.

More experimenting and learning will continue for a while before pressing it in to service on a final mix.

I will check your "stereo link" issue and report back.

with appreciation for your good post,

Pllushhhhh-Phonic.

Hey Plush.....

having had it for a while - any more thoughts on the unit?

I work in a wide range of musical styles - including classical - but also rock / electronica / jazz / etc....

[phatbeatstudio]

I use a pair of Portico2 strips and they are amazing on the mix bus. The best mix I ever heard through my Barefoot mm27s . The MasterBP is probably even better. Im not sure if it sounds much better than that, but if it does holly crap .

[synthoid]

Originally Posted by phatbeatstudio

I use a pair of Portico2 strips and they are amazing on the mix bus. The best mix I ever heard through my Barefoot mm27s . The MasterBP is probably even better. Im not sure if it sounds much better than that, but if it does holly crap .

I'm in the same boat. And as much as I love the Portico IIs, the linking is not quite complete enough to make them convenient on the master bus (have to fiddle each channel independently and by eyeballing the knobs). I'm imagining what it would be like to have not only that problem solved but the stereo field editor (something I've thought about buying in the old Portico format) to boot. holy toledo. Bad case of gearlust.

-synthoid

[phatbeatstudio]

Originally Posted by synthoid

Bad case of gearlust.
-synthoid

Nothing wrong with gearlust but if you start calling the master buss compressor 20 times a day and then hang up you might want to check yourself into a padded room. LOL
I thought we were all gearslutz!

That is meant to be funny as a joke please do not be offended by that. was not my intent

[Plush]

Originally Posted by mixerguy

Hey Plush.....

having had it for a while - any more thoughts on the unit?

I work in a wide range of musical styles - including classical - but also rock / electronica / jazz / etc....

Thanks for checking in Mixermang,

This RND box is used for most everything here now. The reason is is that getting a beautiful full level with the box's sustaining effect also is highly desirable.

I am adding around 4-9 dB of gain make up and I cannot hear it here. My impression is that the high voltage design of this compressor provides a fantastic headroom. I can't hear it working here.

The width control on this unit is better than I have on my Neve console. The stereo linking is accurate and tracks very well.

I have not gotten in to the M/S capability of the RND , so I cannot report on that.

This design is really special and it's a knock out processor. Genuinely valuable, it glues, subdues, smooths, sustains, phattens, never flattens, goos up and boosts program material in a unique way.

Recommended without reservation, Sir.

[Doc Mixwell]

STRONG, move Plush!!!!!

She is the Ivory Elephant!

A true magician of two-shoot wizardry!

[Palaver]

I'm just curious:

1) For those of you using this on your mix buss or mastering chain, are you guys placing an EQ after the limiter section (before hidding your A/D)? I think it's a little strange that the didn't include a place to patch in an EQ before the limiter. Or are you just patching in your mastering/buss EQs prior to hitting the inputs RND MBP?

2) How does the device operate as a sole buss processor? How does the threshold hold up (if you patched the Input of the RND Master Buss Processor directly to the outputs of your D/A)??? Is this like an API 2500 in that it's preferable to have something 'driving' the signal before hitting the threshold of the RND MBP?

I'd love to hear your thoughts. It looks like a beauty.

Phil

[Greg B]

Originally Posted by Palaver

For those of you using this on your mix buss or mastering chain, are you guys placing an EQ after the limiter section (before hidding your A/D)? I think it's a little strange that the didn't include a place to patch in an EQ before the limiter. Or are you just patching in your mastering/buss EQs prior to hitting the inputs RND MBP?

Phil

I usually put the EQ before the MBP. If I need to do a final little EQ tweak after coming back into the DAW then I can do that with a digital EQ, but in general I prefer to EQ before the final compression+limiter so that the dynamic controls have the last word. When I use the limiter it's more to shape the sound rather than be the final brick-wall limiter to maximize loudness, so I'd be fine putting the EQ after the MBP as well.

[Palaver]

Originally Posted by Greg B

I usually put the EQ before the MBP. If I need to do a final little EQ tweak after coming back into the DAW then I can do that with a digital EQ, but in general I prefer to EQ before the final compression+limiter so that the dynamic controls have the last word. When I use the limiter it's more to shape the sound rather than be the final brick-wall limiter to maximize loudness, so I'd be fine putting the EQ after the MBP as well.

Thanks Greg!

BTW, are you just running straight out of your D/A converters into your EQ, then RND MBP? Or are you using something to drive the gain of the RND MBP (pre-EQ) to hit the threshold differently?

For example, on my current setup, I am going D/A into an InnerTube SumThang, and I am using the amp/gain stage from the output of the SumThang to hit and play with the threshold of my API 2500.

Does the RND MBP prefer to have something 'driving' its threshold? I find having that gain stage prior to hitting my API 2500 makes all the difference in the world.

Cheers,

PB

[Greg B]

Originally Posted by Palaver

Thanks Greg!

BTW, are you just running straight out of your D/A converters into your EQ, then RND MBP? Or are you using something to drive the gain of the RND MBP (pre-EQ) to hit the threshold differently?

Yes, lately I go straight from my DA to my EQ (CraneSong IBIS or Massive Passive) and then the MBP and/or Pair of BAE 10DC. The MBP has gain adjustment before the limiter. I generally use the BAE 10 DC's as my final make-up gain after the MBP. A Preamp/EQ like the 1073 or the BAE 1028's (which I'm saving up for) are also awesome for the final makeup gain or a bit more EQ if needed.

[Palaver]

Originally Posted by Greg B

Yes, lately I go straight from my DA to my EQ (CraneSong IBIS or Massive Passive) and then the MBP and/or Pair of BAE 10DC. The MBP has gain adjustment before the comp for driving the threshold however you like. The Make-up gain on the 10DC's is after the comp and limiter so I use those if I need a level boost after compression. A Preamp/EQ like the 1073 or the BAE 1028's (which I'm saving up for) are also awesome for the final makeup gain or a bit more EQ if needed.

I am under the impression that the gain knobs on the RND MBP are 'make-up' and are therefore post-threshold... Or that's how I'm at least understanding it on the site.

Anyway, it's a rather large threshold. I'm just concerned about 'sweet spots.' Most likely, I'd be running it this way: D/A->API 5500->RND MBP->Burl ADC.

It looks like everyone is running it just fine without additional gain gain controls before the MBP (or at least you anyway!).

Thanks so much for taking the time to answer my questions.

Cheers,

Phil

[Upfront2K]

Originally Posted by YOHAMI

Can anyone say this thing stinks?

My wallet is hating you all.

It's the new flavor of the month and in six months they'll be something else.

Sort of reminds me of when the STC8 arrived and it was being hailed as the second coming of christ. People were selling their children to get it. I never got the hype as I found it sterile & as boring as watching paint dry, but some loved it to each his own. Now there isn't a word about it at all as time went on people were dumping them very quietly.

Don't fret about anyone saying it stinks just give it a moment.

I'm not implying that it does just that the opinions change by the month.

[TristanRhodes]

Just to clarify, the gain on the MBP is post-compressor, pre-limiter, so you can drive into the limiter if need be (min threshold is +10dBu).

Also, if you are using the limiter to drive your ADC, be aware that the blend control effects the compressor, make-up gain and limiter together, and the silk control effects the output transformer (post limiter).

[mixerguy]

Originally Posted by TristanRhodes

Just to clarify, the gain on the MBP is post-compressor, pre-limiter, so you can drive into the limiter if need be (min threshold is +10dBu).

...

Um... ok... but how is that possible, given that the compressor and limiter are one circuit, not 2?

just curious.

[Greg B]

Originally Posted by TristanRhodes

Just to clarify, the gain on the MBP is post-compressor, pre-limiter, so you can drive into the limiter if need be (min threshold is +10dBu).

Also, if you are using the limiter to drive your ADC, be aware that the blend control effects the compressor, make-up gain and limiter together, and the silk control effects the output transformer (post limiter).

That makes sense now. I guess I assumed it was pre-compressor because I see the gain reduction meter increase as I increase the gain and hit the limiter harder. I mostly just adjust the threshold and limiter where I want them and I've been leaving my gain knob relatively unchanged and using my BAE 10DC's for the makeup gain so it hasn't been an issue thus far.

[TristanRhodes]

Originally Posted by mixerguy

Um... ok... but how is that possible, given that the compressor and limiter are one circuit, not 2?

just curious.

This is possible because the Gain is created with an applied voltage to the VCA instead of adding a pre or post VCA amplifier stage.

[Greg B]

Originally Posted by Upfront2K

It's the new flavor of the month and in six months they'll be something else.

Sort of reminds me of when the STC8 arrived and it was being hailed as the second coming of christ. People were selling their children to get it. I never got the hype as I found it sterile & as boring as watching paint dry, but some loved it to each his own. Now there isn't a word about it at all as time went on people were dumping them very quietly.

Don't fret about anyone saying it stinks just give it a moment.

I'm not implying that it does just that the opinions change by the month.

Many engineers I know who are getting the MBP are former STC-8 owners, including myself. I had the STC-8 for 4 years. I do know a couple engineers who have replaced their MBP with a Vertigo VSC-2, but that unit costs a couple thousand more and is not as versatile as the MBP (I have both). My MBP, VSC-2, and 10DC's are all very different with different strengths and weaknesses, but if I could keep only one of them it would probably be the MBP because of how much it does well. In considering price/performance/versatility it's definitely a stand-out.

[M.Brew]

Originally Posted by Greg B

Many engineers I know who are getting the MBP are former STC-8 owners, including myself. I had the STC-8 for 4 years. I do know a couple engineers who have replaced their MBP with a Vertigo VSC-2, but that unit costs a couple thousand more and is not as versatile as the MBP (I have both). My MBP, VSC-2, and 10DC's are all very different with different strengths and weaknesses, but if I could keep only one of them it would probably be the MBP because of how much it does well. In considering price/performance/versatility it's definitely a stand-out.

I'm considering getting the VSC-2 and MBP right now, what would you say are there different strengths and weaknesses sound wise?

[Greg B]

Originally Posted by M.Brew

I'm considering getting the VSC-2 and MBP right now, what would you say are their different strengths and weaknesses sound wise?

I have not had the VSC-2 as long as the MBP but here are my general impressions:

MBP = Swiss Army Knife: More versatility in sound and control, More Compression Settings, Optional colors, blend controls, etc. Generally neutral in tone, but can be colored if desired (silk modes).

VSC-2 = Machete (cuts deeper): Seems to handle more extreme compression levels before pumping, especially on master-buss if you're looking for maximum loudness. Seems to add a touch more high-end "sheen" compared to the MBP.

[M.Brew]

Originally Posted by Greg B

I have not had the VSC-2 as long as the MBP but here are my general impressions:

MBP = Swiss Army Knife: More versatility in sound and control, More Compression Settings, Optional colors, blend controls, etc. Generally neutral in tone, but can be colored if desired (silk modes).

VSC-2 = Machete (cuts deeper): Seems to handle more extreme compression levels before pumping, especially on master-buss if you're looking for maximum loudness. Seems to add a touch more high-end "sheen" compared to the MBP.

Cool, thanks for your description.