Any 'high end' folks producing/mixing electronica?

[Jazzpunk]

Greetings,
This is my first post here so please go easy on me! I've been saving to do an upgrade but I am not sure if I am on the 'right' track. As I do everything ITB, I have been looking into building a decent signal chain to route my 'stereo buss' out to. Something along the lines of;

interface to 2-610 to 2-1176 to rosetta 200 back to computer (through firewire)

Is anybody here involved in electronica that does something similar or am I just way off base in thinking this will improve the sound of my mixes? While I produce mainly electronic music (Air, DJ Shadow, Amon Tobin, Squarepusher) I still look towards the classic recordings of the 60's and 70's for inspiration when mixing.

I know the 'warming through analog' thing has been beaten to death here but the people asking for advice never follow up as to what choices they made or if they achieved the sound they were hoping for.

I would greatly appreciate any advice/warnings from others who have attempted something similar.

Thanks

[Jazzpunk]

Moved on over to 'So Much Gear, So Little Time'.

[3rd world order]

the biggest "bang for the buck" IMO is 1/4" tape... and you can use tape to process individual sounds so tracks sit better in a mix... I also use a Smart C2 which is cool for electronic stuff.. but the before/after with tape is much more apparent than any compressor... so that's where I'd start.

for this experiment i recommend finding a local studio with a cool tape machine and just banging some mixes down to some different kinds of tape..... 456 and GP9 are good places to start... it shouldnt cost much more than $100-200 to hook something like this up for a day...

another box you'd probably dig is the Thermionic Culture "vulture".. or the Fatso.. or the TFPro p38.. or the Meek SC2.. or a Summit EQP-200.. or even a focusrite compounder.

[Jazzpunk]

Thanks alot for the info, I'll definitely look into your recommendations. Tracking some stuff to tape sounds like a worthwhile experiment indeed.

[mixxman]

Hi man.....
What you say about this product?
LILO Mixer?

[Jazzpunk]

Looks nice, what have you heard about it? That thing would take a serious bite out of my budget!

[1320 P.]

I am mixing a record right now that was done with the 2-610 through a Triton and an Andromeda. The 2-610 was killer on those trax. I would not even think twice about using one. Just my opinion though.

[Jazzpunk]

Thanks for the feedback 1320 (that Andromeda is ALOT of fun!).

[thethrillfactor]

I mix and produce electronica from time to time and it always starts with having great sounds and a great arrangement to work with.

I prefer to work on analog personally.


What comp you use on the mixbuss is way down on the list.

[Jazzpunk]

Guess nobody's really doing this or the $5-$7K range just puts me in a wierd limbo between High and Low enders.

[six_wax]

Running to tape can occasionally transform mild digital-itis into mojo, but only sometimes.

I only really do my electronica as a hobby these days [pop & rock pays the bills], but several released trance producer friends have gone through this search to discover that... by the time it's in the 2-mix, it's 2 late! In general, your warmth & color are going to come on individual tracks & in the mix. I wouldn't expect to find a 2-bus chain that will accomplish this retroactively...

[RobAcid]

doing electronic mainly here, a nice colorfull comp and a cool eq can help you to get a better sound from your DAW, a tapemaschine is killer !! very coool.

also a nice console, but its hard to get a good old one, that dont need re-capping and so on.

[GYang]

Well, I don't do electronica myself, but have friend who helps me with keyboard programming and arrangement and he does alot of electronica when studio not booked.
I think he gets excellent results, but for space and warmness, he mainly use real analogue synths (Omega-8, Buchla, Voyager, Roland Jupiter etc.) we have in studio, as well as, he pushes VAs and samplers via tube preamps or DIs or keyboard tube amp, so everything is so lively and hot from the beginning.
All synths and PC DAW channels finally routed to Nicerizer for summing.
I think that vintage reverbs adds to flavour, too.
But main point is song, arrangement, atmosphere.

[u b k]

Originally Posted by Jazzpunk

While I produce mainly electronic music (Air, DJ Shadow, Amon Tobin, Squarepusher)...

others have made all the points i'd want to make, especially the notion that getting the vibe in your individual tracks is infinitely more helpful than trying to baste it on at the 2-buss.

i'll just point out that air and dj shadow rely extensively on acoustic instrumentation recorded in good spaces to get their sound. air is heavy on acoustic guitars, rhodes & wurli, and organs, and their sound is big on outbaord analog color. shadow, likewise, uses mostly live drum hits and samples and loops, cut and mangled, but they were well tracked to begin with and drip with tape, analog compression, and plate reverb.

itb is mighty convenient, but trying to get the vibe and atmosphere of these artists with softsynths and plugs is going to be a frustrating endeavor. a sweet mix comp and tape will help, but reamping everything thru a colored preamp to tape and mixing with the re-processed tracks will get you a lot further.


gregoire
del ubik

[Jazzpunk]

Thanks to all who have contributed to this thread...you have given me much good advice to research.

[Jazzpunk]

Originally Posted by RobAcid

doing electronic mainly here, a nice colorfull comp and a cool eq can help you to get a better sound from your DAW, a tapemaschine is killer !! very coool.

also a nice console, but its hard to get a good old one, that dont need re-capping and so on.

Thanks for the feedback Rob. I enjoyed my trip to your website and those mixes went great with this bottle of merlot I am killing...good stuff!

[darkwavo]

I've been searching for the veritable "analog warmth" that has become the marketing tag word for mediocre prosumer audio products since i bought into the ADAT (which i think sounded better than my MixPlus TDM that replaced it)...digital recording for me has been a long study for me, but so has acoustics, tube pres, neve-alike pres, mic placement, gain structure, headroom and other concepts i took for granted when i was more naive... it all makes a big diff to me...but from my experience, i have never fallen in love with a piece of recording equipment like i did when i bought an ampex atr-102 1/2" 2 track. It is has been incredible inspiring to track to, mix to my protools session to- and much more reliable than my protools rig...when it comes down to making my music...it really sounds and feels right to me. Analog tape is that sound you hear on the final mix of Air's "moon safari" , even though it was tracked on Digital Fostex ADAT-alike machine--but your also hearing Korg ms-20, rhodes, memorymoog, roland space echo, solina string ensemble, and hyper-limited elec bass, which also have the aural nostalgia and connotations of era that they came from... it's hard to account for any records sound in terms of one piece of gear, but you can not go wrong with an ampex atr-102...(1/4" or 1/2")- as long as it has been taken care of. my opinion...as someone who really likes all the artists you mentioned. Ever checked out Cornelius from Japan- someone who actually makes good use of all the manipulations possilble in protools (or any computer based recording system).

I have a UA 6176, and while it sounds incredible for tracking my analog synths, i find the tube preamp section to lack appropriate headroom and offers WAY too much dirty "gauze" for the 2-bus processor. Never have used a LA-610, but seems like a great deal for what you get, but you can not "split" unit and use the pre/comp independently from one another... If you are generating sounds "in the box" with software instruments, i have found alot of improvement by using sererate cpu/interface, and sending out signal to the analog world (via 6176 line level etc) while recording the track on your main system- if you have another computer.........Analog tape compression is soooo much better for final mix than "in the box" for my music... and also improves the stereo imagery because the apparent loudness of the side signals (hard L and R) increases as the dead center panned program is glued together depending on how you hit the tape with levels... tape works wonders on focusing a "TR" style drum mach kik drum...fingerpicked acoustic....all things music in my experience...

p.s. i really like the rosetta 200...in conjuction...as a back and forth link to ptools...

thanks, nico...