UA 2-610 problems...

stakeoutstudios · 26th August 2003

Hi guys, I'd appreciate your thoughts on this preamp.

I've had it for a couple of weeks now, sitting next to my Manley MP40/2.

I'm just a bit disappointed with the head room in this pre - literally less than my behringer MX8000 (gasp)

After reading reviews, I thought a great place to start would be snare and kick drum - the kick drum was OK with the Shure beta 52 (it's got a fairly low output). However, on snare I like to use a Neumann KMS105. The mic-pre simply couldn't hack it and left a messy distorted sound. I was still having problems when I switched the mic for a Shure Beta 57, although to a much lesser degree.

Next test for the mic-pre was guitar amps, and bass amps. The preamp distorted straight away with RODE NT1000, NT1, and the audio Technica 4050/CM5. The pad on the 4050 improved the situation a bit, but it still wasn't great.

The latest test was a Roland XP80, playing hammond sound into the front inputs.

This worked OK and sounded great, but when we used less negative feedback, we had to lower to output of the keyboard to prevent clipping in the mic preamp. I just feel a bit restricted by this, as it closes a lot of the tonal options I bought the preamp for.

Incidentally, every situation here worked great and sounded great on the Manley preamp... No clipping.

So far the best use of the 2-610 has been for drum overheads with RODE NTK's which sound great and don't seem to clip.

I'm just wondering if there is so little headroom in such a high-end preamp, why on earth haven't they implemented a PAD switch?!

it's not complicated really!

have any of you got PAD boxes that you can use on a mic? I'm thinking this might be the only way round, unless I get the preamp modded to include a pad switch!

cheers,
Jason

davemc · 26th August 2003

Ok. I sold mine
I agree it has not the best headroom.
Also its very colored.
Sounded nice on keys and I was using it for OH's
Although where have you the gain knob, turn it down and adjust the level up.
Start with that at the lowest and see if it helps.

syra · 26th August 2003

The new ones (6176) have a pad switch. To tame this one with high output mics get:

http://shure.com/accessories/a15as.a...blem%20Solvers

This thing saved me...UA doesn't mod the new pad to the older units.

peace

dave-G · 26th August 2003

I'm not a fan at all of this preamp, and I'm relatively amazed at the positive hype it seems to readily get. It has a spitty, grainy distortion character that is almost impossible to avoid, regardless of gain settings. The idea of putting pad inline before the mic input seems like it could help, but then what's so great about the thing? Toob, schmoob -- I just find it unpleasant.

Sorry.. that wasn't very constructive of me.

-dave

skip bitmin · 27th August 2003

could there be inconsistances from model to model some people
love them and others dont.when put up against the isa 430
mine seems bigger and warmer sounding.Nathen what pre
would you suggest has the same type of charater as the 610
but does the job much better, x73? etc

De chromium cob · 27th August 2003

Just a thought-
I bought a Summit TPA 200 off a guy for a song because the guy thought it needed work....One side had less gain then the other and it sounded pretty bad. I ordered some NOS Mullard tubes for it and the thing kicks ass again. Tubes are funny things and can go without rhyme or reason sometimes so you might want to check them before you dump it. But based on the previous replies it seems like a long shot.

NathanEldred · 27th August 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by skip bitmin
could there be inconsistances from model to model some people
love them and others dont.when put up against the isa 430
mine seems bigger and warmer sounding.Nathen what pre
would you suggest has the same type of charater as the 610
but does the job much better, x73? etc

I don't know of a preamp that sounds like a 2-610 of what Atlas sells. There are many preamps that sound excellent with quite a bit of attitude; Both Chandlers, Vintech 473, Vipre, Great River NV, OSA C & L. If I've excluded any, probably means they sound in the cleaner camp to my ears, or I've just one too many Ketel One's.

BobbyPeru · 27th August 2003

Hey StakeOut,

How do you like that Neumann on snare when its not distorted through the 2-610?

Also, how do you like the VocAlign plugin, does it really work pretty good?

Bobby Peru
Milwaukee, WI

PRS1JAZZ · 28th August 2003

I agree.... I could not understand why people went nuts over it. From what I gathered it was to be great for bass and vocals...... yet I was turned off by both. I tried it on several other sources but was really disappointed...... I sold mine on ebay a few months ago......grudge

Time to move on!

bassmac · 28th August 2003

I had one briefly when they first came out. I thought it was pretty good, but I needed a four channel pre instead. I was however thinking about swapping out my 1176 for a 6176...

HEDDcase · 28th August 2003

The 6176 is a better deal because you have the Pad and you're paying less for the 610 pre.

I look at it as an 1176LN with an optional pre attached. IF the pre works for what I need fine, if not I bypass the pre and use the 1176LN on it's own.

stakeoutstudios · 28th August 2003

Hmm, it's a shame really!

I think I'll get one of those Pad boxes and see if I do like anything loud through it... if not, then I might sell it.

I do like it a lot on overheads or pres, but I'd rather have a preamp that I could use on anything I wanted.

The Neumann KMS 105 is fantastic on snaredrums (through the manley MP40) It's very directional, so spill is minimal and what I really love about it is how natural and uncoloured the off-axis pickup is.

I always used to have this horrible sound of hi-hats or cymbals spilling into the snare mic, and now while there is a little spill, it sounds great and works with the mix.

I can't enthuse enough about the natural top end clarity and what it does to snare drums. I'll never use a Shure Beta 58/57 or regular 57 again!

The Vocalign project works very well when I want to be ultra precise with double track backing / lead vocals. Literally, you can make them sound as one with the combination of that and autotune!

Based on this forum, my next logical purchase will be a matched pair of royer R121's and two GT Vipres! whaddya think?!

I've not got as much gear in the cupboard as most of you -

http://www.stakeoutstudios.com/equipment.html

Jason

faeflora · 29th August 2003

Trends

I didn't think my 610 was that bad. It was a very colored pre. Just like the abovementioned royer. I thought it was pretty good. I sold it though (along with my flamingo) to get a TAB-Funkenwerk pre (on it's way) which I read (never used it) was the bestiest of tube pres.

I reallly liked the DI on the 610 for synths. Awesome for synths with crappy noisy crispy output signals. I thought the mic pre headroom was rather low, even with dynamics (shure 57). I could never get past 2-3oclock on the level knob without FX style distortion happening. I thought the build quality really sucked though. The faceplate was not really bolted on and you could flex it by pulling at it with your finger.

syra · 29th August 2003

I like my 2610. Its certainly not your everyday mic-pre but it has a sound of its own. It is unique. I use it with excellent results as an insert (through the line in) in PT to beef up sterile tracks. It "tubifies" any source with a warm analog quality not found on "tube" simlutation plugs...

peace

HEDDcase · 29th August 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by syra
I like my 2610. Its certainly not your everyday mic-pre but it has a sound of its own. It is unique. I use it with excellent results as an insert (through the line in) in PT to beef up sterile tracks. It "tubifies" any source with a warm analog quality not found on "tube" simlutation plugs...

peace

Yup, just like a lot of folks put an 1176 inline and don't run any compression, the gain stage alone has a nice sound to it.

Jan Folkson · 30th August 2003

I also happen to really like my 2610. It's anything but clean and clear, but that's why I like it. And I haven't run into any headroom issues with it, I wonder if they might vary from unit to unit because I've got several friends who haven't had headroom issues either.

Nutmeg II. · 30th August 2003

Anybody tried to swap the tubes to Telefunken?

shaun thomas · 17th September 2003

ive got a m610 that i run with an at switchable (-10 to -30) pad when i record electric guitar. i wrote ua asking if mine was defective. i got a form letter back saying that a lot of people had had the same problem and had a link for attenulators. my voice likes it and a u87. my vox ac-15 and deluxe reverb absolutely hate it.

s.

skip bitmin · 17th September 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by Nutmeg II.
Anybody tried to swap the tubes to Telefunken?

Have you tried this yet? If you do ,please post the results-
thanks.I put the gain to -10 when recording vocals for a cleaner
sound.Also recorded a messa boogie mark4 with an sm57
(friends amp ,didnt want to give it back he he) gain at +5
wich I realy liked.

Nutmeg II. · 17th September 2003

Didn't try it jet but I will when I have some spare time (when ever taht will be).

faeflora · 17th September 2003

FYI I've got the TAB-Funkenwerk V72s now and it absolutely kills the 610. Kills. Best sounding pre for lead tracks I've ever used. Amazing.

skip bitmin · 18th September 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by faeflora
FYI I've got the TAB-Funkenwerk V72s now and it absolutely kills the 610. Kills. Best sounding pre for lead tracks I've ever used. Amazing.

Cant wait to try one, glad you like yours.

Thanks nutmeg , will be waiting

26th August 2003	#1
stakeoutstudios Gear nut Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: London, UK Posts: 96 Thread Starter	UA 2-610 problems... Hi guys, I'd appreciate your thoughts on this preamp. I've had it for a couple of weeks now, sitting next to my Manley MP40/2. I'm just a bit disappointed with the head room in this pre - literally less than my behringer MX8000 (gasp) After reading reviews, I thought a great place to start would be snare and kick drum - the kick drum was OK with the Shure beta 52 (it's got a fairly low output). However, on snare I like to use a Neumann KMS105. The mic-pre simply couldn't hack it and left a messy distorted sound. I was still having problems when I switched the mic for a Shure Beta 57, although to a much lesser degree. Next test for the mic-pre was guitar amps, and bass amps. The preamp distorted straight away with RODE NT1000, NT1, and the audio Technica 4050/CM5. The pad on the 4050 improved the situation a bit, but it still wasn't great. The latest test was a Roland XP80, playing hammond sound into the front inputs. This worked OK and sounded great, but when we used less negative feedback, we had to lower to output of the keyboard to prevent clipping in the mic preamp. I just feel a bit restricted by this, as it closes a lot of the tonal options I bought the preamp for. Incidentally, every situation here worked great and sounded great on the Manley preamp... No clipping. So far the best use of the 2-610 has been for drum overheads with RODE NTK's which sound great and don't seem to clip. I'm just wondering if there is so little headroom in such a high-end preamp, why on earth haven't they implemented a PAD switch?! it's not complicated really! have any of you got PAD boxes that you can use on a mic? I'm thinking this might be the only way round, unless I get the preamp modded to include a pad switch! cheers, Jason

26th August 2003	#2
davemc Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Melb, Australia Posts: 1,021	Ok. I sold mine I agree it has not the best headroom. Also its very colored. Sounded nice on keys and I was using it for OH's Although where have you the gain knob, turn it down and adjust the level up. Start with that at the lowest and see if it helps. __________________ Bye Ya Dave INDENT

27th August 2003	#6
De chromium cob Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 3,655	Just a thought- I bought a Summit TPA 200 off a guy for a song because the guy thought it needed work....One side had less gain then the other and it sounded pretty bad. I ordered some NOS Mullard tubes for it and the thing kicks ass again. Tubes are funny things and can go without rhyme or reason sometimes so you might want to check them before you dump it. But based on the previous replies it seems like a long shot. __________________ "I know that most men, including those at ease with problems of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the simplest and most obvious truth if it be such as would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, which they have proudly taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabric of their lives." Tolstoy Scott Benson Blue Ridge Mastering

28th August 2003	#9
PRS1JAZZ Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Worcester, MA Posts: 911	I agree.... I could not understand why people went nuts over it. From what I gathered it was to be great for bass and vocals...... yet I was turned off by both. I tried it on several other sources but was really disappointed...... I sold mine on ebay a few months ago......grudge Time to move on! __________________ And I put a Chaffing 5 post eq on the Choadometer. I loosened the meat wallet meter 2 db's on the jizload compressor and tipped the blond coiffer gig cut to an even feeder knob...

30th August 2003	#16
Jan Folkson Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NYC, NY Posts: 629	I also happen to really like my 2610. It's anything but clean and clear, but that's why I like it. And I haven't run into any headroom issues with it, I wonder if they might vary from unit to unit because I've got several friends who haven't had headroom issues either. __________________ - Jan Folkson www.janfolkson.com If you can't make it good, the least you can do is make it perfect.

26th August 2003	#3
syra Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: L.A. Posts: 2,096	The new ones (6176) have a pad switch. To tame this one with high output mics get: http://shure.com/accessories/a15as.a...blem%20Solvers This thing saved me...UA doesn't mod the new pad to the older units. peace

26th August 2003	#4
dave-G Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 2,481	I'm not a fan at all of this preamp, and I'm relatively amazed at the positive hype it seems to readily get. It has a spitty, grainy distortion character that is almost impossible to avoid, regardless of gain settings. The idea of putting pad inline before the mic input seems like it could help, but then what's so great about the thing? Toob, schmoob -- I just find it unpleasant. Sorry.. that wasn't very constructive of me. -dave

27th August 2003	#5
skip bitmin Gear maniac Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: canada Posts: 174	could there be inconsistances from model to model some people love them and others dont.when put up against the isa 430 mine seems bigger and warmer sounding.Nathen what pre would you suggest has the same type of charater as the 610 but does the job much better, x73? etc

27th August 2003	#8
BobbyPeru Gear addict Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 402	Hey StakeOut, How do you like that Neumann on snare when its not distorted through the 2-610? Also, how do you like the VocAlign plugin, does it really work pretty good? Bobby Peru Milwaukee, WI

28th August 2003	#10
bassmac Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 683	I had one briefly when they first came out. I thought it was pretty good, but I needed a four channel pre instead. I was however thinking about swapping out my 1176 for a 6176...

28th August 2003	#11
HEDDcase Gear nut Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Southern left coast Posts: 145	The 6176 is a better deal because you have the Pad and you're paying less for the 610 pre. I look at it as an 1176LN with an optional pre attached. IF the pre works for what I need fine, if not I bypass the pre and use the 1176LN on it's own.

29th August 2003	#13
faeflora Lives for gear Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: washington dc Posts: 2,019	Trends I didn't think my 610 was that bad. It was a very colored pre. Just like the abovementioned royer. I thought it was pretty good. I sold it though (along with my flamingo) to get a TAB-Funkenwerk pre (on it's way) which I read (never used it) was the bestiest of tube pres. I reallly liked the DI on the 610 for synths. Awesome for synths with crappy noisy crispy output signals. I thought the mic pre headroom was rather low, even with dynamics (shure 57). I could never get past 2-3oclock on the level knob without FX style distortion happening. I thought the build quality really sucked though. The faceplate was not really bolted on and you could flex it by pulling at it with your finger.

30th August 2003	#17
Nutmeg II. Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: GEARmany Posts: 985	Anybody tried to swap the tubes to Telefunken?

17th September 2003	#18
shaun thomas Gear interested Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 23	ive got a m610 that i run with an at switchable (-10 to -30) pad when i record electric guitar. i wrote ua asking if mine was defective. i got a form letter back saying that a lot of people had had the same problem and had a link for attenulators. my voice likes it and a u87. my vox ac-15 and deluxe reverb absolutely hate it. s.

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