Ideas for a new style of studio ,,

[Brett 123]

I'm thinking about starting a new kind of studio set up , I would appreciate some feedback from some of the guys in this forum,,

I have a small to mid range studio in London , I have good pre amps , mics and converters .

I have been thinking of buying a large format console for a while , though the more I research in to it , I think there might be another interesting and original way ahead .

Looking at all the great summing mixers on the market I was thinking of getting a few for a few different flavours .

If you can imagine a studio set up with lets say for example , a small Tonelux console alongside a Chandler Mixer , a Fat bustard and the new Great river mixer .

This would give you great flexibility of Tone , depending on the type of music you're recording , using different outputs from the different mixers then bussing them together .

I think it would be a pretty modern recording setup without so many worries about keeping an old analogue desk up and running .

Would appreciate peoples opinions on this , if they think it would work / be attractive to other engineers ? How would this set up compete in terms of mixing with a standard studio set up , i.e vs an SSL etc in terms of sound .

Thanks ,

Brett

[Purple]

Cool idea, but obviously the return on the investment is (as far as I can tell from the info you have posted) to come from artists (ie paying clients).

If you think they will see the value in having four different summing desks as opposed to big impressive looking SSL (or whatever), then it could be an interesting studio.

For the record, personally I wouldn't do it, as most musicians I know are realistically more interested in size and brand name. But each to their own!

[T1M0N]

One problem I see is with Aux Sends. For a recording setup the monitoring possibilities wouldn't be enough. For a mixing setup you'll miss auxes, especially if you plan to incorporate other outboard gear (such as equalizers). If it's only about summing it would basically work, but if you want to have 4 stereo subgroups you'll need 5 summing boxes. With that you are moving in the price range of nice consoles with much more flexibility. And in the example with 5 summing boxes you would have a 72 Track mixing setup that might be too much (unused tracks also might add noise) but only 8 single tracks you could use besides of the groups. Also you would patch like crazy. One session you might want group 8 drum tracks 4 guitar tracks and 4 vocal tracks, next session you have 13 drum tracks and 8 guitar tracks you might want to subgroup. If you don't have 72 D/As on your workstation you have to repatch for every session where on a console you would just assign the track to a different bus/group.

So I think this solution would have less possibilities is less flexible and much less clear layouted than a console and not really cheaper.

[jcc449]

I find "multifunctional" is quite important for studio success today.

[Brett 123]

Originally Posted by T1M0N

One problem I see is with Aux Sends. For a recording setup the monitoring possibilities wouldn't be enough. For a mixing setup you'll miss auxes, especially if you plan to incorporate other outboard gear (such as equalizers). If it's only about summing it would basically work, but if you want to have 4 stereo subgroups you'll need 5 summing boxes. With that you are moving in the price range of nice consoles with much more flexibility. And in the example with 5 summing boxes you would have a 72 Track mixing setup that might be too much (unused tracks also might add noise) but only 8 single tracks you could use besides of the groups. Also you would patch like crazy. One session you might want group 8 drum tracks 4 guitar tracks and 4 vocal tracks, next session you have 13 drum tracks and 8 guitar tracks you might want to subgroup. If you don't have 72 D/As on your workstation you have to repatch for every session where on a console you would just assign the track to a different bus/group.

So I think this solution would have less possibilities is less flexible and much less clear layouted than a console and not really cheaper.

This is a good point , but was thinking I could add in an aux section on the Tonelux , and would be also able to use internal busses on PT for monitoring . Though will have too look more in the possibilities .
This or I could keep the Mackie 32/8 for monitoring ,,

The flexibility I was talking about was more to do with the set up being suited to the music . Where as with a single console you are stuck with that sound to an extent . Also being able to add to it whilst going along , when money becomes available will help allot.

Thanks for the opinions ,,

[Greg Curtis]

I think that, as a business model it is a resounding "no." Are you going to be able to charge more to make up the loss? Or gain more clients (work more)?

Outside engineers will see more of a problem than an opportunity, with all the complexity and limitation.

It's a really, really cool idea, but worth it for you if you can dismiss the costs.

But as a commercial endeavour it is a dead-end.

GC

[Brett 123]

Originally Posted by Greg Curtis

I think that, as a business model it is a resounding "no." Are you going to be able to charge more to make up the loss? Or gain more clients (work more)?

Outside engineers will see more of a problem than an opportunity, with all the complexity and limitation.

It's a really, really cool idea, but worth it for you if you can dismiss the costs.

But as a commercial endeavour it is a dead-end.

GC

Ok thanks for the input , I guess I will have to think about this a little more .

[G-Spot]

Originally Posted by Brett 123

If you can imagine a studio set up with lets say for example , a small Tonelux console alongside a Chandler Mixer , a Fat bustard and the new Great river mixer .

That would cost you as much as an Audient ASP8024 24 channel (in-line console, 52 inputs (48 with inserts) at mix down, with 8 sub-groups (with inserts) and 14aux). Excelent flexibility. I have a 36ch and I love it. Its clean, very easy to work with, proper EQ, and I can add dirt and colour with outboard gear. And it sure attracts more clients

It seems to work for Pete Townshend...
Audient makes life easier for Pete Townshend:

[Pr.tiouz]

You will come out with headche, trying for ever wich mixer suits wich kind of music, i don't think one mixer is for one music blah blah

[Smithcok]

In the end, it would (at most) turn out to be a "neat thing" to offer clients, but I think it'd be a hard sell as a booster-of-business.

Having one analog summing option available is good - but multiple in a startup studio will be, IMHO, an unecessary expense.

[seaneldon]

Having a gaggle of different mixers is more convoluted than it needs to be. For me, it's best to have ONE central mixer/console that suits your needs for both sonics and functionality, and then find the different tones and textures in other ways (different instruments, amps, mics, reverbs, outboard equipment, etc.)

Just one man's opinion, I s'pose...but I really couldn't imagine working in a room where I have four different solo/mute busses, four monitoring sections, etc. I mean, I could do it...but I'd be pulling my thinning hair out the entire time.

[evangelista]

If I walked into a studio like this, my first thought would be "Does the owner actually listen to music?"

[subspace]

I'm in the middle of integrating a second console into my room and would agree that it adds complexity and takes away from the unified solution that is a recording console. I'd only consider doing it if your adding functionality that makes things so much easier it offsets the added complexity.
In your proposal, I'd rather walk into a room with 8 channels of Tonelux 500 eqs, 8 channels of Great River Harrison 500 eqs, and 8 channels of Chandler 500 eqs all feeding one summing solution than have to bus through their respective summing boxes.

[balanceman]

too many options gets to be annoying after a while. What are you setting up the room for? Working on music or testing summing boxes? Get something that's built well and sounds good. Move on. Get to work...

[kraku]

To get flexibility of tone, I would suggest you buy the console (can't remember the manufacturer right now) which consists only of sliders and 500-series lunchbox slots. This way you can choose all your modules and create super-versatile console of your dreams

[tobias schuch]

Originally Posted by kraku

To get flexibility of tone, I would suggest you buy the console (can't remember the manufacturer right now) which consists only of sliders and 500-series lunchbox slots. This way you can choose all your modules and create super-versatile console of your dreams

Tree Audio 500 Web Site

[kraku]

Exactly! Thank you!