Confused. Do Converters Help Soft Synths?

jaysunice · 5th February 2006

Newbie to the forum here... My question is do better quality converters (either A/D and D/A) help the sound of software synths i.e., those found within Logic, Sampletank, etc..??? If so (or if not), how and why? Right now I'm using a MOTU 896HD and some soft synths like the ones mentioned, but although they sound great within Logic, once they are bounced and taken out of Logic, I feel everything has an apparent digital "chill" to it. Almost as if there is a blanket covering the clarity.

I've also been thinking about picking up the new Apogee Ensemble. Any thoughts? Big leap over the MOTU no doubt, but would I be better off picking up an external clock and/or converters? Maybe just a rosetta 200 or something similar? Many thanks. J.

vixapphire · 5th February 2006

I noticed a big difference when I upgraded from a FW Motu 828 (v.1) to the RME HDSP 96/52 card, both running into my ddx 3216 via lightpipe. The Motu didn't come close to the quality of the RME; I think it has to do with the RME's better clocking, since neither box was being used for the D/A conversion (that was happening in the mixer). It made the softsynths pretty usable, whereas before they sounded like bad Colecovision game soundtracks.

Cojo · 5th February 2006

Well it would sound exactly the same regardless of the converters as long as you stay in the computer. Of course it will sound diffrent if you put the sound out thru diffrent DA converters but if you mix inside your computer and render your tracks to a stereo file and burn a CD, then you should not hear any diffrent regarding the DA:s. Does that make any sense?

/Cojo

Lagerfeldt · 5th February 2006

Yes, there's absolutely no diference to the sound of what's going on inside the DAW (including soft synths) in respect to what sound card or converters you are using.

The sound card/convert will only influence latency, and A/D D/A. Which means that what you personally are hearing (and thus the way you EQ, etc.) will be affected by the D/A but not the actual sound in the DAW.

jaysunice · 5th February 2006

Thanks you to everyonne for clearing all of that up for me. I guess my next question would be how much will using an external clock (such as Big Ben) help clean up the "blanket-chill" within my tracks?

5down1up · 5th February 2006

well, somehow you have to monitor whats going on inside the puter .

so if your using a " classic " setup you have to have a DA conversion to feed your monitor speakers, headphones, etc .

DAs defenatley change the sound you are listening to and this at least affects everything coming out of the puter BIGTIME .

i am a lil bit confused :

cause it sounds like you like it to the point before you bounce it to disk

the whole bounce to disk thing is a book filling discussion !

cant see how a piece of gear should give you the result back your used to listen to before you hit the bounce button .

trident fan · 7th February 2006

i am thinking of getting dimension pro dxi soft synth to use with my sonar 4.04. i only use the sonar for sequencing. i use a radar 24 and an analog mixer for audio.
what would be the cheapest decent quality method of getting at least 8 outputs out of the dimension pro for use as virtual midi tracks to be ran into the ananolg mixer with the radar trax for mixdown. edirol makes a breakout box for about $500, does anyone have any experience with this box or can recommend another?
i already have an emu ultra, so i don't want anything cheesey.
thanks,
regards,
TF

5th February 2006	#1
jaysunice Gear maniac Joined: Feb 2006 Location: Sinking Spring, PA Posts: 205 Thread Starter	Confused. Do Converters Help Soft Synths? Newbie to the forum here... My question is do better quality converters (either A/D and D/A) help the sound of software synths i.e., those found within Logic, Sampletank, etc..??? If so (or if not), how and why? Right now I'm using a MOTU 896HD and some soft synths like the ones mentioned, but although they sound great within Logic, once they are bounced and taken out of Logic, I feel everything has an apparent digital "chill" to it. Almost as if there is a blanket covering the clarity. I've also been thinking about picking up the new Apogee Ensemble. Any thoughts? Big leap over the MOTU no doubt, but would I be better off picking up an external clock and/or converters? Maybe just a rosetta 200 or something similar? Many thanks. J.

5th February 2006	#4
Lagerfeldt Lives for gear Joined: Sep 2004 Location: Copenhagen, Denmark Posts: 4,770	Yes, there's absolutely no diference to the sound of what's going on inside the DAW (including soft synths) in respect to what sound card or converters you are using. The sound card/convert will only influence latency, and A/D D/A. Which means that what you personally are hearing (and thus the way you EQ, etc.) will be affected by the D/A but not the actual sound in the DAW. __________________ Professional geek Online Mastering - At the moment: Mastering Christopher (EMI) · Mixing Michalis (Universal)

5th February 2006	#6
5down1up Lives for gear Joined: Jun 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 2,006	well, somehow you have to monitor whats going on inside the puter . so if your using a " classic " setup you have to have a DA conversion to feed your monitor speakers, headphones, etc . DAs defenatley change the sound you are listening to and this at least affects everything coming out of the puter BIGTIME . i am a lil bit confused : cause it sounds like you like it to the point before you bounce it to disk the whole bounce to disk thing is a book filling discussion ! cant see how a piece of gear should give you the result back your used to listen to before you hit the bounce button . __________________ http://www.kaiportolano.com http://www.myspace.com/kaiportolano

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5th February 2006	#2
vixapphire Lives for gear Joined: Jan 2006 Posts: 2,493	I noticed a big difference when I upgraded from a FW Motu 828 (v.1) to the RME HDSP 96/52 card, both running into my ddx 3216 via lightpipe. The Motu didn't come close to the quality of the RME; I think it has to do with the RME's better clocking, since neither box was being used for the D/A conversion (that was happening in the mixer). It made the softsynths pretty usable, whereas before they sounded like bad Colecovision game soundtracks.

5th February 2006	#3
Cojo Lives for gear Joined: Dec 2005 Location: Gothenburg, Sweden! Posts: 1,471	Well it would sound exactly the same regardless of the converters as long as you stay in the computer. Of course it will sound diffrent if you put the sound out thru diffrent DA converters but if you mix inside your computer and render your tracks to a stereo file and burn a CD, then you should not hear any diffrent regarding the DA:s. Does that make any sense? /Cojo

7th February 2006	#7
trident fan Gear addict Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 378	i am thinking of getting dimension pro dxi soft synth to use with my sonar 4.04. i only use the sonar for sequencing. i use a radar 24 and an analog mixer for audio. what would be the cheapest decent quality method of getting at least 8 outputs out of the dimension pro for use as virtual midi tracks to be ran into the ananolg mixer with the radar trax for mixdown. edirol makes a breakout box for about $500, does anyone have any experience with this box or can recommend another? i already have an emu ultra, so i don't want anything cheesey. thanks, regards, TF