Vintage mic question! u47/u67/u87 and km84/akg 451

whitepapagold · 25th January 2006

I have the possibility of purchasing a few vintage mics. They have all been maintained and I can test them all I want before choosing. If I do purchase, its as much an investment as an instrument! Just wondering what price range Ill be looking at for:
U47- Neumann/telefunken(???) Did they do a 47? I just ran through the locker and didn't really look at the telefunken since I dont have 10 grand for a mic! He says its a 47. I assume it will be XPENSIVE.

U67- not cheap either

older U87s (are the older ones of a better build and/or tone potentially?- I cant a/b with a new one- they dont have any and nor do I.)

AKG 451 with 3 capsules and tilt arm

and finally KM84

There are multiples of everything except the telefunken. Any direction would be GREATLY appreciated. Im looking at overhead/acoustic guitar pairs and vocal mics. And please dont tell me to search- I already did. Prices are market dependent- recent prices would be GREAT!
Thanks
Joseph

jomo1234 · 25th January 2006

"I have the possibility of purchasing a few vintage mics. They have all been maintained and I can test them all I want before choosing. If I do purchase, its as much an investment as an instrument! Just wondering what price range Ill be looking at for:"

Neumann was the OEM manufacturer of the U47 for Telefunken. Many people will tell you the Telefunkens were better mics...they were exactly the same except for the logo. A top notch U47 (with VF14m tube, original parts (perhaps a reskinned M7 or KK47 capsule), excellent cosmetic condition, w/ cabling and power supply) should run anywhere from $6000 to $7500. That seems to be the going rate for most gear brokers.

"U47- Neumann/telefunken(???) Did they do a 47? I just ran through the locker and didn't really look at the telefunken since I dont have 10 grand for a mic! He says its a 47. I assume it will be XPENSIVE."

"U67- not cheap either" A good U67 now seems to be in the $4000 range.

"older U87s (are the older ones of a better build and/or tone potentially?- I cant a/b with a new one- they dont have any and nor do I.)"

Good quality vintage 87's (they should have a 9V battery compartment) seem to go around $1500-$2000

"AKG 451 with 3 capsules and tilt arm" Which capsules does it have? A good vintage specimen seems to go around $300-350 with a standard CK1 cardioid capsule.

"and finally KM84" In nice shape, around $750 to nearly $1000.

ALL VINTAGE MICS WILL AGE DIFFERENTLY, SO PLEASE MAKE YOU GIVE EACH ONE A THOROUGH LISTEN....ideally see if you can have each mic checked out by a reputable mic repair person (Bill Bradley, Doug Walker, Klaus Heyne, Tracy Korby, etc.)

Good luck!!

There are multiples of everything except the telefunken. Any direction would be GREATLY appreciated. Im looking at overhead/acoustic guitar pairs and vocal mics. And please dont tell me to search- I already did. Prices are market dependent- recent prices would be GREAT!
Thanks
Joseph[/QUOTE]

De chromium cob · 25th January 2006

U47 with M7 cap VF14 tube (important to verify, as it has a large effect on price)
$7500 to $8000

U67 in good shape $4000 to $4500

U87 is about $1500 give or take a couple hundred.

KM84 in the neighborhood of $750 to $1000 each

451 about $300 each

whitepapagold · 25th January 2006

I couldn't have asked for better responses! Thanks so much. Plus you both basically agree which gives me a solid foundation!

And THANKS for pointing out the telefunken/neumann equivalence for the 47. There is one of each, and now I can just pick the one that sounds the best!

Im surprised the akg is so cheap but its the only one Ive never heard so once I do it all may be clear why! Then again I just assumed it was a mic comparable to the km.

jomo1234 · 25th January 2006

The 451's are great mics and the reason for their relatively low price on the vintage market is due to the fact that AKG made so many of them. Good specimens are always available.

The capsules are also interchangable with earlier versions of AKG tube mics (C28, C60, C61).

whitepapagold · 25th January 2006

Good to know! I know the km84s have a good rep but I was more interested in the akg because of the capsules! Id rather have the options. Now I need to go try em out! I keep getting more excited! Im trying to work from home this year so the studios mic locker is not as accessable! Ive got great pres, comps, and eq but for mics all I have is a sm57 and blue blueberry! Nice in a pinch but they dont cut it for everything by ANY MEANS! Man, Im actually salivating over the u47!

jomo1234 · 25th January 2006

The KM84s actually have screw off capsules as well. KM84's are cardioid pattern, KM83's are omni and KM85's are cardioid with a lower bass response. If you have a KM series body, you can interchange the capsules.

jomo1234 · 25th January 2006

If you can afford it, definitely go with the KM84's...they are soooooooo nice and sound great on just about anything.

whitepapagold · 26th January 2006

Quote:

Originally Posted by jomo1234

If you can afford it, definitely go with the KM84's...they are soooooooo nice and sound great on just about anything.

Damn slutz. The akgs are 1/2 the cost- cant we pretend they are better? TELL ME WHAT I WANT TO HEAR! Actually, Im really going to base the decision off the listening. It will probably end up being a combination of sound and condition! I haven't gotten a chance to listen to THESE specific mics yet, but they should all be in top notch condition. At least thats what Im telling myself. Plus I can take them home and run them through the paces before I decide. Its a good situation!

jomo1234 · 26th January 2006

For me, the KM's just have a depth and silkiness that the AKGs lack. The AKG is still a fine mic, but there is an immediacy and presence to the sound of the Neumanns that you don't get with the AKG.

In some instances, I do prefer the AKGs. Some acoustic guitars respond better to it, as well as some snare drums. It's nice to have both in your arsenal!!

walth · 21st March 2011

those are really great vintage mics. i love the C451s

Showcase · 13th April 2011

Maybe off topic but Km 84 is one hell of a great microphone, almost everything I´ve tried them out on sounds good, All owners of this mic should try this one out on a good drummer and on the snare for a modern sound!

doorknocker · 13th April 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by jomo1234

A good U67 now seems to be in the $4000 range.

I just noticed that this thread started in 2006! So the subject matter is appropriate as the thread itself is 'vintage' internet-wise.

6 years gone and 'a good U67' seems more like 7-8k now.

lakeshorephatty · 13th April 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by jomo1234

For me, the KM's just have a depth and silkiness that the AKGs lack. The AKG is still a fine mic, but there is an immediacy and presence to the sound of the Neumanns that you don't get with the AKG.

+1

KM84 will ALWAYS please you.

Russell

walth · 13th April 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitepapagold

I have the possibility of purchasing a few vintage mics. They have all been maintained and I can test them all I want before choosing. If I do purchase, its as much an investment as an instrument! Just wondering what price range Ill be looking at for:
U47- Neumann/telefunken(???) Did they do a 47? I just ran through the locker and didn't really look at the telefunken since I dont have 10 grand for a mic! He says its a 47. I assume it will be XPENSIVE.

U67- not cheap either

older U87s (are the older ones of a better build and/or tone potentially?- I cant a/b with a new one- they dont have any and nor do I.)

AKG 451 with 3 capsules and tilt arm

and finally KM84

There are multiples of everything except the telefunken. Any direction would be GREATLY appreciated. Im looking at overhead/acoustic guitar pairs and vocal mics. And please dont tell me to search- I already did. Prices are market dependent- recent prices would be GREAT!
Thanks
Joseph

great selection of mics

skybluerental · 13th April 2011

well, you are talking about some of the best mics ever made here in my opinion.

U47: great mic. haven't used a tube one enough to know it that well. used the FET one a bunch and like it a lot. only used the tube 47 3 or 4 times and its been a while.......

U67: my favorite mic. wonderful for so many reasons.
classy and versatile.

U87: this mic is what i consider good, but not great. rarely wrong for anything but rarely makes you go wow either. versatile, but never spectacular.

KM 84: amazing mic. can record anything quite well with it.
i recently acquired 2 KM 86's, which are very similar.
cant go wrong with a pair of KM 84's or 86's.

AKG 451: the old EB 451's with CK 1 capsules are really great mics that are a bit on the brighter side. not harsh. great for cymbals, strings, ac gtrs, piano.
the new 451's i have used are not the same. they are harsh and cheap sounding.

the mics you are talking about are some of my and many others favorites of all time. i own and regularly use the U67, 451 EB and KM 86.

these are all great tools.

25th January 2006	#1
whitepapagold Banned Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Penis Kitchen, California Posts: 1,230 Thread Starter	Vintage mic question! u47/u67/u87 and km84/akg 451 I have the possibility of purchasing a few vintage mics. They have all been maintained and I can test them all I want before choosing. If I do purchase, its as much an investment as an instrument! Just wondering what price range Ill be looking at for: U47- Neumann/telefunken(???) Did they do a 47? I just ran through the locker and didn't really look at the telefunken since I dont have 10 grand for a mic! He says its a 47. I assume it will be XPENSIVE. U67- not cheap either older U87s (are the older ones of a better build and/or tone potentially?- I cant a/b with a new one- they dont have any and nor do I.) AKG 451 with 3 capsules and tilt arm and finally KM84 There are multiples of everything except the telefunken. Any direction would be GREATLY appreciated. Im looking at overhead/acoustic guitar pairs and vocal mics. And please dont tell me to search- I already did. Prices are market dependent- recent prices would be GREAT! Thanks Joseph

25th January 2006	#2
jomo1234 Lives for gear Join Date: May 2005 Location: NYC Posts: 1,375	some prices... "I have the possibility of purchasing a few vintage mics. They have all been maintained and I can test them all I want before choosing. If I do purchase, its as much an investment as an instrument! Just wondering what price range Ill be looking at for:" Neumann was the OEM manufacturer of the U47 for Telefunken. Many people will tell you the Telefunkens were better mics...they were exactly the same except for the logo. A top notch U47 (with VF14m tube, original parts (perhaps a reskinned M7 or KK47 capsule), excellent cosmetic condition, w/ cabling and power supply) should run anywhere from $6000 to $7500. That seems to be the going rate for most gear brokers. "U47- Neumann/telefunken(???) Did they do a 47? I just ran through the locker and didn't really look at the telefunken since I dont have 10 grand for a mic! He says its a 47. I assume it will be XPENSIVE." "U67- not cheap either" A good U67 now seems to be in the $4000 range. "older U87s (are the older ones of a better build and/or tone potentially?- I cant a/b with a new one- they dont have any and nor do I.)" Good quality vintage 87's (they should have a 9V battery compartment) seem to go around $1500-$2000 "AKG 451 with 3 capsules and tilt arm" Which capsules does it have? A good vintage specimen seems to go around $300-350 with a standard CK1 cardioid capsule. "and finally KM84" In nice shape, around $750 to nearly $1000. ALL VINTAGE MICS WILL AGE DIFFERENTLY, SO PLEASE MAKE YOU GIVE EACH ONE A THOROUGH LISTEN....ideally see if you can have each mic checked out by a reputable mic repair person (Bill Bradley, Doug Walker, Klaus Heyne, Tracy Korby, etc.) Good luck!! There are multiples of everything except the telefunken. Any direction would be GREATLY appreciated. Im looking at overhead/acoustic guitar pairs and vocal mics. And please dont tell me to search- I already did. Prices are market dependent- recent prices would be GREAT! Thanks Joseph[/QUOTE]

25th January 2006	#3
De chromium cob Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 3,655	U47 with M7 cap VF14 tube (important to verify, as it has a large effect on price) $7500 to $8000 U67 in good shape $4000 to $4500 U87 is about $1500 give or take a couple hundred. KM84 in the neighborhood of $750 to $1000 each 451 about $300 each __________________ "I know that most men, including those at ease with problems of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the simplest and most obvious truth if it be such as would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, which they have proudly taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabric of their lives." Tolstoy Scott Benson Blue Ridge Mastering

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26th January 2006	#10
jomo1234 Lives for gear Join Date: May 2005 Location: NYC Posts: 1,375	For me, the KM's just have a depth and silkiness that the AKGs lack. The AKG is still a fine mic, but there is an immediacy and presence to the sound of the Neumanns that you don't get with the AKG. In some instances, I do prefer the AKGs. Some acoustic guitars respond better to it, as well as some snare drums. It's nice to have both in your arsenal!!

21st March 2011	#11
walth Gear Head Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: San Diego Posts: 39	those are really great vintage mics. i love the C451s

13th April 2011	#12
Showcase Gear maniac Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 224	Maybe off topic but Km 84 is one hell of a great microphone, almost everything I´ve tried them out on sounds good, All owners of this mic should try this one out on a good drummer and on the snare for a modern sound!

13th April 2011	#16
skybluerental Lives for gear Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Chicago, IL USA Posts: 1,206	well, you are talking about some of the best mics ever made here in my opinion. U47: great mic. haven't used a tube one enough to know it that well. used the FET one a bunch and like it a lot. only used the tube 47 3 or 4 times and its been a while....... U67: my favorite mic. wonderful for so many reasons. classy and versatile. U87: this mic is what i consider good, but not great. rarely wrong for anything but rarely makes you go wow either. versatile, but never spectacular. KM 84: amazing mic. can record anything quite well with it. i recently acquired 2 KM 86's, which are very similar. cant go wrong with a pair of KM 84's or 86's. AKG 451: the old EB 451's with CK 1 capsules are really great mics that are a bit on the brighter side. not harsh. great for cymbals, strings, ac gtrs, piano. the new 451's i have used are not the same. they are harsh and cheap sounding. the mics you are talking about are some of my and many others favorites of all time. i own and regularly use the U67, 451 EB and KM 86. these are all great tools.