Adding tape to existing set-up

[dmb10]

After just under 5 years of building up a nice collection of mics/pres/outboard I've come to the point where another pre-amp flavor or new condensor is really not cost effective. After asking around It seems that the next step is to in someway incorporate tape into my set up. Right now I run the signal through the pre's straight into a Fireface800. I have many questions but I'll start by asking - where would be the most benefitial way to add tape into what I'm running now?

Thanks,
Jeremy

[js1]

You have 3 basic options:

- Run tape instead of your DAW
- Run tape along side your DAW
- Run tape in the signal path of your DAW.

First option is obvious. Common practice is to record basic tracks to tape, then bounce to DAW for editing and overdubs.

In the second case, you need to be able to sync up the two together. Usually means SMPTE timecode. Either the DAW is the master, and the tape machine slaves to SMPTE (requires special hardware within the tape machine, and a source of SMPTE timecode in the DAW). Or, the tape machine is the master, and the DAW is the slave (requires a SMPTE interface in the DAW that can varispeed). Tape tracks need a mixer, of course.

In the third case, you treat the tape machine as a signal processor. Run a signal through a 3 head tape machine recording, and monitoring off the playback head. You can do this on the input (preamp->compressor->eq->tape->DAW), you can bounce through it (DAW out->tape->DAW in), or you can use it as an "external FX" if you're on Cuendo/Nubase.

In this third scenario, there will be latency based on the time it takes from the tape to go from the record head to the playback head. You'll need to slide the track to compensate it.

The "external FX" takes a little more explanation. In Cuendo, you can define a DAW in/out pair as an external FX. You then plug in the gear. The external FX shows up in the plugins list, and you can then insert it as any other plug in. What's really neat about this is that it has a facility to measure the latency of the signal path, and then compensates for it using the Plug Delay Compensation (PDC). Using the external FX does, of course, add another A/D->D/A stage.

In the early DAW days, when DAW tracks were limited, I used to slave my DAW to a tape machine. Just recently, I dusted off an old Teac 3440, and set it up as an external FX. Works great.

Hope this helps.

js

[dmb10]

I'm looking at about a $2000-$4000 budget for the tape machine (if anyone can point me in the right direction from where to purchase from let me know)....I'll most likely be using 10-12 tracks max at once so I would record straight to tape and then bounce all of this through the A/D and do the editing there. Is there any point in sending the master buss from the DAW back to tape and then bouncing that again into the daw or will that have a negative effect?

-Thanks,
Jeremy

[brianroth]

A 2" 16 track would fit your needs. However, the "quality" of any given machine will be all over the map depending upon the maintenance history. I would suggest having a reputable tech check out any machine you are considering.

Bri

[John Noll]

Stay digital for your multitrack and instead get a 1/4" two-track and mix to that. You can find a decent MCI JH110, Studer B67, or Ampex 440 for a very reasonable price. Hire a tech to get it in good shape, buy a few reels of 456 and have fun. You could also buss out pairs of tracks to tape and back to your DAW. Calculate the off-playback head latency and shift the tracks ahead to be back in sync. Or run a send to tape for slap echo and print that back to a track.

[Mike Tholen]

If your mixing ITB...get a 1/4" or 1/2" two track to mix onto, then record back into your DAW...

[3rd world order]

Originally Posted by Mike Tholen

If your mixing ITB...get a 1/4" or 1/2" two track to mix onto, then record back into your DAW...

what he said.

you can also track THRU the tape machine, monitoring off the repro head, straight into the DAW.. you'd just need to figure out the "latency" of your particular machine... it's not hard. That is, if you can live with 2 tracks at a time.

[dmb10]

I'm assuming these are all used which leads me to a few more questions.... Are there any new 2 track tape machines, and are there benefits to using 1/2 in. over 1/4in. or using tube based circuitry compared to solid state?


-Jeremy

[u b k]

if you really will be doing 10-12 tracks at a time, you'll either need 10-12 converters to dump the tracks, or you'll need to use smpte to keep things locked while doing the transfer in multiple passes.

i really hope you go with a 2" 16-track, there's just no way you can get drums to sound as fat without it.

regardless, even if you just get a 2-track for tracking and mixdown, i'd like to congratulate you because it's an *excellent* decision.


gregoire
del ubik