Tube mic through Tube pre?

[woods]

Just wondering if there is any risk of having too much tube in the chain? Say a U47 or E47 through an Avalon 737. Then adding another tube or three via Massive Passive at mixdown time.

Could there be some adverse affects of combining or compounding or stacking tube sound on top of tube sound?

Ciao,

Woods

[Steve Smith]

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. The general rule of thumb alot of folks I know go by is that you done want too many in the chain, but if it sounds good, it is good.. I am tracking vocals right now with a Soundelux U95S through an Amek CIB and then into a Manley VOXBOX for comp.. A chain I have never chosen on a singer, as the comp in the voxbox rarely wins in the end around here, but on this guy it is rockin... sorry for the lack of def answer, but I do not think there is one.

[doug_hti]

I sort of wonder the same sometimes, and if there is more of an accumulative muck up or something. However, I think it depends more on the unit then the tube. If you have something like the vipre Pre, where you can change the rise time etc, there are more exceptions. I have a 737 and use it a lot. I think it's mushier, but I still like it a lot. Also, on your 737, if your not liking the "mush" factor, just don't drive the input as hard and don't be afraid to drive the output all the way if need be, you'll notice a big difference in color.

[littledog]

It's quality and design of the chain, not the amount of heaters.

Tube gear is no mushier than solid state. Except for crappy tube gear.

[Bobalou]

Littledog is so right!

In the old days they used tube everything in the chain and when I hear those old Motown vocal tracks they sound awesome!

I have run into the 737 being a bit too dark (mushy, dull) whatever you want to call it...not my favorite for vocals with or without a tube mic!...if I were going to spend the money on the 737 I would spend just a few extra bills and go with the Vipre without a doubt!... thats just me, but who the hell am I anyway

[Jay Kahrs]

Whatever works. It's more about what the gear sounds like then how it heats up the room. I've tried to avoid using tube everything just because it's there but there are times when I'll look at my track sheets while mixing and realize that the vocal went through a tube pre & tube compressor. Then while mixing it's another tube compressor and an EQP-200. Gotta love it.

[woods]

I guess I hear you.

Anybody else? Just to stir the freakin' pot -- take a listen to Dolly Parton doing "Shine".......

Any over done tubes?


Ciao,

Woods

[hollywood_steve]

my best (least colored) preamp is a Siemens V78 that has been refurb'd to "as new" condition. It's the only preamp that I have used with my BLUE Bottle mic in the 12 months that I've owned the Bottle. Most engineers would never identify the signal chain as "tube into tube" - its just the nicest thing I've heard; transparent with no hint of high end edge or bite. As everyone else has already said, too many folks have gotten the idea that tube mics or tube preamps are just studio quality fuzz boxes and that just isn't the case.

steve
lex125@pacbell.net

[lowswing]

very often I'm tracking vocals c12->v72->adl1000(tube compressor) , very often I compress the vocals more on mixdown with la2a, don't find it too warm

[Meriphew]

My chain for tracking my own vox is Soundelux Elux 251 > GT Vipre > tape. No issues for me.

[Wiggy Neve Slut]

Tube mic to quality tube pre = aural orgasm...

Tube mic to ART shitbox = leaves something to be desiredgrudge

lol

Its all in the application, mics, pre's, compressors and TALENT!!

Use ya ears cos they will tell you if it sounds right and ok.

PEACE
Wiggy

[Joel Hamilton]

I hadto track through an 8028 to an otari, then mix on the 8028 again, and that was too "tubey" without a tube anywhere in the chain.

**** "warm", I got really bummed at having to crank upper mids all day to get some bark out of my mixes....

I like 1073's a lot, but jeezus, with the otari, then back through all that. I almost pulled a stevie wonder and mixed it on the jukebox section. tape returns only!

[Deja V.U.]

Too much tube? Nope... Not possible. Too much tube saturation/distrortion on many levels? That's a possiblility. I'll take a U47 tube into a 737 over a U87 into a neve, api, or ssl pre anyday of the week. At least for vocals.

[Wiggy Neve Slut]

I hadto track through an 8028 to an otari, then mix on the 8028 again, and that was too "tubey" without a tube anywhere in the chain.

Joel...

Coming from a vintage Neve background i hear where u are coming from exactly. The best way around it is to EQ!!.. the 1073 is a great EQ and there is a reason to use when you are mixing stuff tracked thru a neve like that. There can be the low mid build up and is a problem that i termed with my mates as 'Double Fat'... . Funny thing is that we joke that things can never be fat enough but this can be symptomatic of vintages neves.

Secret is to go hard with the EQ... High pass hard and just listen to where the problems lie and then go and find them. The 1073 is a weapon that you must get used to as it can be easy to overuse cos it sounds so damn good, but they are equally adept at boosing as well as cutting unlike some EQ's, but having said that is very musical so even if you happen to screw something up it will still not sound as bad as others.......just a bit neve'y wrong if it makes sense..

Give it a go. It took me a while to get used to also i happen to gate and compress a lil bit harder when imtracking and mixing on a vintage.

Let us know how u go... and DONT BE afraid to EQ... If God (Rupert) armed us with 1073's there would be no wars!..lol and bad albums..... lol .. but im sure they would still sneak through under the radar

PEACE
Wiggy