Hyper Dynamic Vocals, what do you guys do?

[Sput]

I have this guy coming to my studio tomorrow who has the most radial dynamics you can think of. He is not very technical. He goes from whispering to screaming from one syllable to the next. It's not like he whispers during the verses and then screams in the choruses. That's natural and I can handle that. He is totally random about it, and he never sings the same way twice, so you can't learn the tune and react.

I have already recorded this guy, and I didn't do a good job, to be honest (the record sold out though; you know how that goes).
I don't blame him. It's my job to make the most of what he delivers. I just can't figure out what to do. First I tried changing preamp gain as I went, then with 2 compressors, no luck. This time is gonna be all live, that's why I'm concerned.

Can you guys share some experience/ideas?
Thanks mates!

[Sput]

BTW, I usually go for TUBETECH preamp for vocals, but I also have a Chandler Germanium, Avalon 737, ISA 220 available. The tubetech is stepped, so I can't change the gain very cleanly there.

My compressors include Cranesong STC8 and Distressors.

Oh, and the music is kind of pop/soft rock with a flamenco touch.

[Daedalus77]

What mics ya got for the job?

[M4-10]

Two or three microphones, all with different gain settings?

[Rednose]

Explain to dude you will have to try to even things out dynamically or it will be hard to get decent levels.
Using proper mic techniqs will help.
Get close on the whisper stuff and back up on the loud stuff.
You can also set up two mics, one for whisper and one for the louder stuff.

[Sput]

My mic closet includes:

Neumann u87, m147, 184's
Royer 122's
AKG 414's
421's, 441's, 58's, 57's, ...

As I said, the gig will be a live performance and I'm not sure that I wanna keep this guy inside a booth. My booth is big enough for 2 mics, so that's a possibility. If I don't isolate him, I rather go for 1 mic though.

Thanks for your ideas! Keep 'em coming, boys!

[Baithak]

Hey Sput :
My choice of mics in preferred sequence would be SM7, RE20 (hey, if it can handle Rush ... :-) and MD431 the vocal cousin of the 441. In an extreme case, I would set up the 431 and 431 or 441 (a bit farther away) with different gain settings and cut and paste in post.

Good luck with the science project.

Baithak

[Fletcher]

OK... this technique usually comes out a bit better with a stereo mic but it can work with a mono mic as well... find the mic that best couples with his voice... then run the output of that mic into two separate mic pre-amps. Set one of the pre-amps to have 10db more gain than the other pre-amp.

On the back of the pre-amp that has 10db more gain than the other patch in the STC-8. Set up the STC-8 so that when the volume on the "screaming" increases by 10db you have 12 - 15+db of gain reduction on the STC-8 (which will effectively shut that channel off in relation to the channel with 10db less gain).

Sum the outputs of the two mic-pre channels. Run the output of the sum of the two channels into the other channel of the STC-8... and use the limiter so you aren't going to clip the input of your A/D converter (you can do some "overall" compression as well... or string a couple together if you'd like).

This way, when the singer is singing softly or whispering you have a setup that will give you sufficient gain so you'll be able to hear what he's saying... and when he gets "loud" the compression will kick in and turn down that channel so that the channel with less gain will now be the 'dominant' aspect of the signal path.

This is about the most natural way I've found to reduce the dynamics with a very dynamic singer.

With a stereo mic you can pick which capsule sounds best on the singer for the "loud" parts and the "soft" parts [singers invariably move their head when they get loud & soft... using a stereo mic you can optimize which capsule is doing what... but you don't have that option so the point is moot].

Hope this helps.

Peace.

[Dean Roddey]

Don't forget that old standby, quaaludes. Or I guess you could always stand behind him, holding him by the hair, and do his mic technique for him.

[Croaker]

they still make quaaludes?? dam those where the days.

[jonathan jetter]

Fletcher's reply sounds pretty money.

on my end- MC77 set to "kill" during tracking.

then make your automation lines look like jackson pollock paintings during mix time.

done.

[Sput]

Fletcher, that sounds interesting. I'm afraid I read it too late though!
I'll be tracking him again in 2 weeks, so I'll try it and let you all know.

The recording went well. This time the main dynamic difference was verse/chorus. He'd still sing a bit too loud or too soft at times (many times), but I'll write that and it'll be alright.
As Rednose suggested, I told him that it'd probably be good for the recording if he backed up a bit on the loud parts. Then I realised the problem: he doesn't know!! I mean he doesn't realised when he is singing softly or screaming ... That led to some hilarous moments a in the control rooms thumbsup

I ended up using the 737, so I could change the gain on the fly. I even used the compressor in the 737 (first time in a while, really) to do like -1db on the screams, then I compressed a bit more with the STC8. The good thing with the cranesong is that you don't hear an obvious compression going on but it'll still react pretty quickly to sudden peaks.

Thanks again for your suggestions, folks!
Cheers!

[Adebar]

Originally Posted by Fletcher

OK... this technique usually comes out a bit better with a stereo mic but it can work with a mono mic as well... find the mic that best couples with his voice... then run the output of that mic into two separate mic pre-amps. Set one of the pre-amps to have 10db more gain than the other pre-amp.

On the back of the pre-amp that has 10db more gain than the other patch in the STC-8. Set up the STC-8 so that when the volume on the "screaming" increases by 10db you have 12 - 15+db of gain reduction on the STC-8 (which will effectively shut that channel off in relation to the channel with 10db less gain).

Sum the outputs of the two mic-pre channels. Run the output of the sum of the two channels into the other channel of the STC-8... and use the limiter so you aren't going to clip the input of your A/D converter (you can do some "overall" compression as well... or string a couple together if you'd like).

This way, when the singer is singing softly or whispering you have a setup that will give you sufficient gain so you'll be able to hear what he's saying... and when he gets "loud" the compression will kick in and turn down that channel so that the channel with less gain will now be the 'dominant' aspect of the signal path.

This is about the most natural way I've found to reduce the dynamics with a very dynamic singer.

With a stereo mic you can pick which capsule sounds best on the singer for the "loud" parts and the "soft" parts [singers invariably move their head when they get loud & soft... using a stereo mic you can optimize which capsule is doing what... but you don't have that option so the point is moot].

Hope this helps.

Peace.

Very good suggestion. If you realise this technique with the Josephson C700A you have even more possibilities to manage that situation.

The C700A has 2 capsules, a LD figure 8 and a SD omni as pressure mic. Both signals lead out seperetely and make it possible to adjust pattern s from omni to supercadiod later. So I would just increas the distance beween singer and mic a little more than you would with a cardiod. When he whsipers you can zoom in via hyper cardiod and support directivity and intimacy. When he screems just go mor on the omni side.

Another technique that makes this approach even more versatile is to use different compressor adjustments for both capsules. So you can even have a kind of automatic zoom in and out with polar patterns via different compression ratios depending on how loud the singer is.

If you go further and use a little different EQ settings you also avoid the voice to be to sharp during screeming and get more highs when the singer whispers.

******//www.josephson.com/pdf/srs7.pdf

As always, take what I write as maybe biases. I´m the german dealer for Josephson Engineering and will show that mic at the Musikmesse in Frankfurt this week. But still I can say the described technique is not theory from marketing it is used technique in several studios with this mic.

[Sput]

You know, I've being planning on a stereo mic for a while. I do in location recordings of classical music, but also rock back at the studio. Was thinking about a stereo Royer, but I already own a pair of 122's. That Josephson is tempting, but I don't think I'll ever have a chance to listening to one. Brauner's stereo version of the VM1 is top on the list right now. Gotta save some bucks first though.