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Tlm-102 tlm-103 u195
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icit
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#1
31st December 2009
Old 31st December 2009
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Tlm-102 tlm-103 u195

Does anyone have any experience with all 3 of these? How would you categorize the differences sonically between them?
#2
31st December 2009
Old 31st December 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icit View Post
Does anyone have any experience with all 3 of these? How would you categorize the differences sonically between them?
ice pick's versus sledgehammer

Maybe?

Sorry, not much of a fan of the transformer less TLM line.
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31st December 2009
Old 31st December 2009
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Never tried the 102 but I replaced my 103 with a 195 and have never looked back!
With the 103 I was Always trying to find a situation where it worked, With the 195 Its a go to vocal mike!
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icit
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1st January 2010
Old 1st January 2010
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I become curious about the mic when checking out Pamplamoose (YouTube - PomplamooseMusic's Channel). They use a 103 for tons of stuff. Then the 102 came out and the reviews make it sound like it's a little more balanced version of the 103. Saw a video of it being used at Mercenary for overheads. Good SOS review. Thought it might be worth looking at.

Maybe I just need to stop looking around and use my U195 but I've had a few people tell me they weren't crazy about it on my voice and it's also a little shaky - once in a while it'll create a quiet rustling sound, like someone's softly blowing on the diaphragm. So that's giving me a little bit of incentive to see what else is out there.

Dunno. I feel a little obsessive about finding the "perfect" mic for my voice. Sometimes I feel like that's a good thing. Sometimes I feel like I need to just move on and make music. The curse of being an artist/musician and an engineer I suppose.

Would love any other feedback from anyone who's used the U195 next to a 102.

Thanks guys!
#5
5th January 2010
Old 5th January 2010
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I love the 195 as a vocal mic, but it does tend to have a prominent top end on some voices. Sometimes it's perfect, other times it's just a little bit much. Nothing a little subtle high shelf cant fix though.

On the other hand, i've never liked the TLM103, and by association have very little interest in the TLM102.

What problems have you had with the sound of the 195?
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icit
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5th January 2010
Old 5th January 2010
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It's more sibilant than I'd like. I also am not crazy about it on acoustic. I know I can use other mics, but I loved the idea of having 1 mic for vocals and acoustic that I could carry around for smaller projects.
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5th January 2010
Old 5th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icit View Post
Then the 102 came out and the reviews make it sound like it's a little more balanced version of the 103. Saw a video of it being used at Mercenary for overheads.
I am generally curious about the video you refer to. I personally have never put our "broken" TLM 103 over the drums, and I would be cautious for anyone who would, unless that's what they are going for of course.

Anyway; check out the Microtech Gefell MT71 or M930. They are superior transformer less designs in my experience.
icit
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5th January 2010
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#9
6th January 2010
Old 6th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icit View Post
I'm sorry. I shouldn't have said Mercenary. I meant to say SoundPure. Sorry about that.

Here's the video in any case:
YouTube - Neumann TLM102 Microphones - Drum Overheads
Ok, maybe it's me but imo from this sound clip, the TLM102s sound very small, and not very good at all. Very flat, one-dimensional, zero excitement
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7th January 2010
Old 7th January 2010
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You are right the youtube video doesnt sound any spectacular,
but I would not judge the new 102 by this anyway...nor any possible relation with 103 as some do - which is not. /I can hear something familiar but not same though, but thats just me/

Couple days ago I borrowed demo unit of Tlm 102, 4 days later I bought it for 500 usd - not because it is Neumann - but because it sounded really nice on vocals, which I cut most, full and focused with nice shine but not unneccessary bright,definitely nice surprise to me at least..
#11
7th January 2010
Old 7th January 2010
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The TLM series is really bollocks. Go Gefell. You won't be disappointed.
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7th January 2010
Old 7th January 2010
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I like the TLM103 but the 195 is the best bang for the buck I've ever found.

My Valvet is better but 3X the price.
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7th January 2010
Old 7th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia View Post
I like the TLM103 but the 195 is the best bang for the buck I've ever found.

My Valvet is better but 3X the price.
Ill put it top 5 with
SM7B
Gefell UM70
Lawson Fet
AT4047
#14
7th January 2010
Old 7th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus77 View Post
The TLM series is really bollocks. Go Gefell. You won't be disappointed.
Or Wagner perhaps? : )

Depends, lots of great stuff was cut with TLM series...
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7th January 2010
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any comparisons to the tlm49?
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7th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daedalus77 View Post
The TLM series is really bollocks. Go Gefell. You won't be disappointed.
TLM is *not* a "series" it just means that the mic. doesn't have a transformer. TLM microphones can be very different from each other.

OK - you don't like them and Gefell still make great mics.

Others love them.

A mic. is a tool - you choose the one that does the job you want it to - there is no need to call something a rude name just because it does not suit your purpose - it's like saying a screwdriver is crap because it's not a hammer.
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#17
7th January 2010
Old 7th January 2010
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icit,
Can i suggest a good deesser like the Eiosis E2 Deesser. A plugin yes, but it's literally the best i've found, hardware or software and i've used quite a few.

Also the 195 isn't often my first pick for acoustic guitar, but I have gotten some really good results using it in the over the shoulder position, next to the player's right ear aiming down at the guitar.

I'm basically trying to convince you NOT to swap your 195 for the Neumann TLMs, because i'm absolutely certain that this is the wrong thing to do.
icit
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#18
7th January 2010
Old 7th January 2010
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Thanks AR. I think I'll keep it.
#19
7th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AbbeyRhodes View Post

I'm basically trying to convince you NOT to swap your 195 for the Neumann TLMs, because i'm absolutely certain that this is the wrong thing to do.
I agree. The 195 is the better mic.

When I bought my TLM103, Mercenary was blowing them out for $750 which is a good price.

Now it seems they're priced similarly, so the 195 is the move.
#20
8th January 2010
Old 8th January 2010
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Will someone please fill me in on Gefell. I have seen them recommended on this site many times. I look at their model letters and numbers, and cannot figure out what they mean? UM, M, MT, U, 70, 71, 91, 900, etc, etc. I suppose the Neumann system is just as confusing, but I know the mics and it seems to make sense. To me, their literature in not very clear in explaining what the models mean.
Thanks, John
#21
8th January 2010
Old 8th January 2010
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I don't think there are more maligned pieces of gear on this site than the TLM103 and Avalon 737.
There is not a more talented artist/songwriter/singer/producer on the music scene today than Imogene Heap. Every vocal track she has cut since the beginning of her career has been done on the TLM103 and 737.
Interesting.
John
#22
8th January 2010
Old 8th January 2010
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don't worry man, so many great artists use the 737 and tlm series...

its just the 0.0000000000002632% of the world on this forum who participate in hating gear because its "the cool thing to diss"

we are an elitist group and some flavors we like, some we don't....

however, this gear craze really has nothing to do with making good music or not.....

its all about being a gearslut!!!!!!!
#23
8th January 2010
Old 8th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonear View Post
Will someone please fill me in on Gefell. I have seen them recommended on this site many times. I look at their model letters and numbers, and cannot figure out what they mean? UM, M, MT, U, 70, 71, 91, 900, etc, etc. I suppose the Neumann system is just as confusing, but I know the mics and it seems to make sense. To me, their literature in not very clear in explaining what the models mean.
Thanks, John
Hello John,
you´re right. This system is very confusing and you might have to know these mics to know what they are. Actually you should search for everyone of them to get an idea of what it is. For models which are still on their list look here:
MICROTECH GEFELL GmbH Deutschland - english-
For the ones which are not continued, there is a modular system which can be a MV690, MV691 or MV692 (all these have a transformer). For these there are different type of capsules.
There are small diaphragm capsules like M70, M94 (cardioid), M93, M58 (omni) and large diapraghm capsules M71 and UM70. The M71 is the Cardioid only and the UM70 the capsule with changeable patterns cardioid, omni and figure-eight. Actually everytime you see UM stands for multiple patterns. (Sorry for my english, I´m from germany )
The UMT70 or MT71 or UMT70s and MT71s are almost the same as UM70 with a mic-preamp MV692 but without a transformer. There the UMT70 is switchable patterns and the MT71 is the cardioid version.
The T there stands therefore for Transformerless.
There are other great mics like the M930 which I have and can highly recommend it! The UM930 is like 3 times its price.
So,... hope that helps a bit.
I can also highly recommend the MV691 from which I have 4 and almost all of the capsules besides the M93. The M93 for me wasnt really good. There its much better to get the M58 or the golden M93 which have M58 inside although they are designated M93.
Greetings from Germany,
prema
#24
8th January 2010
Old 8th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonear View Post
I don't think there are more maligned pieces of gear on this site than the TLM103 and Avalon 737.
There is not a more talented artist/songwriter/singer/producer on the music scene today than Imogene Heap. Every vocal track she has cut since the beginning of her career has been done on the TLM103 and 737.
Interesting.
John
Voices are as unique as fingerprints. Bono uses a Shure SM58 mic and it works for him. I just watched a documentary on Depeche Mode and David Gahan uses a Shure SM7.

Imogen Heap could be one of the 5% of people that the TLM103 works very well for. She certainly has a unique voice.

Whereas a mic like a Neumann U47 works on a much larger percentage of people and instruments.

I'm one of the people that think for the price the TLM103 is quite good. But then I put it up beside tracks I've done on a long body chrome top U47 and
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8th January 2010
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I`ve used the TLM103 for 10 years, never had a problem with it on baritone vocals. Also use it occasionally for trumpet, and miking an amp from about a foot away.

Recently had the pleasure to audition the 102. Its a very nice mic. I was actually considering getting one for vocal recording. I have a baritone voice, slightly on the bright side and I really liked what it did for my voice.

We ran it through a Vintech X72 and the Avalon 2022. It also worked nicely on acoustic guitars, especially finger picking. Recording a strummed Martin D 15 which has a big bottom to it needed some extra tweaking but after moving the mic around and the levels set, it had a nice smooth sound to it with a slight bump bringing out the top end a bit. Very tasty. However, in that price range, you have the 4050 which rocks.
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#26
10th April 2010
Old 10th April 2010
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tlm 103, I don't like on most things, sounds hyped.... tlm 102 pretty sweet, much more neutral....It;s a totally different mic. No comparison. Still, after playing with my friends 102, I don't feel the need to buy one. I like my Peluso more. But for god sakes, stop putting this mic in the same category with the tlm 103, no relation in sound what so ever! Apples and oranges... Try it before you knock it. Sounding small on Youtube is just a result the dry recording and lack of processing. You would get a small sound with any mic like that. The mic can sound quite big and it's pretty true sounding with clarity through out.
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#27
13th April 2010
Old 13th April 2010
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....yeah....what he said! I have one and love it!
#28
1st July 2010
Old 1st July 2010
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Although I admit that I've never liked the sound of a TLM103 or other TLM mics from Neumann, I absolutely LOVE the TLM102. This mic is sweet as hell.

For vox, they designed a bump in the high frequency range to be specifically suitable for voice, however, I think it sounds incredible on acoustic guitars (as a stereo pair) and drum overheads. That post higher up this page about them sounding lifeless as overheads is just silly, primarily from the already mentioned; the sound clips are 100% uneffected/dry signal. Besides, I thought that they sounded awesome as overheads in that youtube video, primarily because I can tell what it would sound like in the mix. It would hold it's own for sure.

The other thing to take into consideration here is that many people don't have an amazing sounding room, and the TLM102s as overheads rejects a lot of off-axis reflections and whatnot, so you don't get too much of the room sound. Besides, that's what room mics are for anyway. ;-)

War TLM102. Awesome, awesome mic, regardless of price. How ironic that the best sounding TLM mic from Neumann is the cheapest. Just my opinion of course. :-)
#29
1st July 2010
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Everytime I've seem to have heard the tlm 103 it sounded pretty good on the voice it was used on. It does have build up in the lower mids I recall, but it seems to be a hated mic around here LOL maybe because its limited, I was wondering is there a mod for this mic? As many people that talk about this mic I'm Surprised I haven't seen a mod for this mic to make it more useable to some peoples taste. I've seen way cheaper mics be modded lol mxl mics and what not. Some one should chime in if you've had your tlm 103 modded, and what did I do or didn't do for you
#30
2nd July 2010
Old 2nd July 2010
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103 bashing again...sick of it.


its a top mic. my goto singing mic. no complaints. into amek cib=

i shot it out next to peluso 2247. the tlm came out best.
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