Solutions for bright vocalist?(not an oxymoron)

[Tonear]

I am working with an excellent singer/songwriter with a harsh vocal quality. Something in the signal chain sounds like it is clipping when she opens up, even though the meters and waveforms look fine.

I'm looking for help finding a solution in terms of a mic/preamp/mic placement, etc, that will help me get a fuller yet still detailed sound on her.

I've tried 5 mics on her. At a pro studio, we used an M 49/Neve/PTs. That was excellent when she sang light to moderate, but razory when she sang high or loud.
At home I run into the Apogee Ensemble pre/converters to Logic. I've tried the Nuemann TLM 49, Shure KSM44, At 4047, and SM57. I've never heard anyone overload a 57, but that is how it sounded. The darker mics helped up high, lost detail on softer passages. And vice versa.

I've posted soundclips on this site at this thread:

Shootout Neumann TLM 49, Shure KSM44, Octava 012, SM57

Would a tube pre help this issue? Tube mic? U87?
I recorded her about 9" to 12" from the mics, through a metal screen. Is there a pattern or placement that would help?

I'd appreciate any suggestions. Thanks in advance.
John

[s.d.finley]

I would say back her up even more. Maybe you could purchase an inline pad to put between the mic and the preamp. Try both. stike

[tapehiss]

or use a dynamic mic.

a la sm7/re20

[evangelista]

Set up 2 mics, one close, one far. Record to separate tracks. Use the farther for the loud stuff, closer for the detailed/intimate spots.

[Tonear]

Is there a difference between the SM7b and the SM7?
Would the pad on the mics help?

[u b k]

She's probably too close to the mic, and/or it's positioned less than ideally, and/or you still haven't found the right mic.

My guess is you're up against that 'is it 3k? no, i think it's 2k' overloaded hardness that some females produce.

Try a thick dynamic, like an re20 up close, or a thick ribbon, like an r84, about 2 feet out. Try having the mic over her head pointed at her forehead. Try it at chest level pointed at her nose.

Used to be a time when that overload was hyped for impact and drama, thinkin' Aretha here. In these days of squeaky clean, distortion has become the enemy, the art of harnessing it for good is becoming lost.

Pity.


Gregory Scott - ubk
.

[Tonear]

Good suggestions, I'll try the mic positioning stuff.
A ribbon....Would the Royer that everyone uses(but not usually on vocals) work? Is that a 121?
Does the RE20 act differently that the SM57? Because she nailed the 57 from 9".

[KRStudio]

I use the Royer 121 and 122 for vocals and like them. 121 for really loud stuff. I would still try mic placement changes first. Put a 57 right in front for her to sing into. Aim that 4047 from forehead level down to her mouth and about 18inches out. record the 4047. The 57 is just for spacing and breaking up plosives.

[Gretschman]

Originally Posted by Tonear

Good suggestions, I'll try the mic positioning stuff.
A ribbon....Would the Royer that everyone uses(but not usually on vocals) work? Is that a 121?
Does the RE20 act differently that the SM57? Because she nailed the 57 from 9".

I use a Crowley & Tripp Vocal ribbon and it sounds like the right tool for this job .
But they sold out to Shure microphone last summer . So , now , Shure is selling 2
versions of his mic . You may want to find one you can demo with . Remember ,
no phantom power needed ! Those mic's should be 30 - 15000 hrtz . very smooth .

If you can't get one , try the royer 122 and put a pop filter in front , singer at 10-12 inches back . Be careful on this one , it uses 48 V and watch your levels .

The EV RE-20 is a good mic also , you might give it a try .

I can't believe she stressed out a sm57 !!

You may just need to back her up to a 10-12 inches minimum for the mic .

[Bassmec]

Originally Posted by Tonear

Is there a difference between the SM7b and the SM7?
Would the pad on the mics help?

Quite a marked one, probably a transformer/impedance change thing by the sound of it.
some pres prefer the old one some love the new b.
I like the old one but then, I am old.

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by Tonear

I'd appreciate any suggestions. Thanks in advance.
John

Sanken CU-41.

And ride the gain/output to tape.

[Tonear]

Tape.
How quaint.
I love tape.
I'll ride the computer.
John

[Tonear]

Aren't the ribbon mics all figure 8 pattern? So when you do a lead vocal, don't you get alot of room sound?
Is the pattern different on the Royer 122?
Is there a trick to keeping the ambiance level down?

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by Tonear

Tape.
How quaint.
I love tape.
I'll ride the computer.
John

Tape, ADAT, Hard disc, DAW...its all the same bullsh*t!!!

Basically ride the gain on the mic pre so when she starts hitting the tones harder you anticipate it and back it down keeping it from distorting.

The Sanken CU-41 is a transparent/flat mic so it doesn't accentuate any part of the vocal freq spectrum which is what you need when recording a vocalist with hot spots in their singing voice.