The kinks recording session

[Jules]

I am a huge Keef fan.. I can pretty much play Midnight Rambler (Get your Ya Yas live version) pretty much damned near perfect + do a verry acurate live 'bootleg' version of Brown Sugar.. no probs...

HOW-EVER - much as I love the guy.. the SFTD solo - sounds like it could well be Jimmy Page in my book.

It remains to me.... one of lifes great mysterys

[chap]

Les Paul always said that he recorded the least important tracks first so when it was time to bounce, the more featured tracks would suffer the least degradation (and humiliation).
cheers,
chap

[blesscurse]

Well, yes...we'll never really know. We can only believe. Getting back to The Kinks, I think that Mick Avory is a tremendously underrated musician. His drumming on Muswell Hillbillies (the LP) and all the Kinks Kronikles-era collected songs is just amazingly subtle and nuanced, original and powerful. He has a signature style, unique in its own way as Watts or Starr.

One last moment of recording production-related Stones trivia. I grew up with the Stones on vinyl and then the early poorly done CDs, so I anxiously awaited the recently remastered stuff to (re-)confirm one thing: On the final chorus of "Ruby Tuesday," when a tom fill is subsituted for the usual snare fill, the console overloads and distorts as a result. Very cool sound...and that they didn't mind, or bother re-doing the take because of it.

"Distortion Is Truth."

-Robert Poss

http://home.pipeline.com/~rmposs/

[Jamz]

Originally Posted by blesscurse

Well, yes...we'll never really know. We can only believe. Getting back to The Kinks, I think that Mick Avory is a tremendously underrated musician. His drumming on Muswell Hillbillies (the LP) and all the Kinks Kronikles-era collected songs is just amazingly subtle and nuanced, original and powerful. He has a signature style, unique in its own way as Watts or Starr.

One last moment of recording production-related Stones trivia. I grew up with the Stones on vinyl and then the early poorly done CDs, so I anxiously awaited the recently remastered stuff to (re-)confirm one thing: On the final chorus of "Ruby Tuesday," when a tom fill is subsituted for the usual snare fill, the console overloads and distorts as a result. Very cool sound...and that they didn't mind, or bother re-doing the take because of it.

"Distortion Is Truth."

-Robert Poss

http://home.pipeline.com/~rmposs/

Many amazing vocals from the 60's had that overdriven sound!
Prince obviously loved that sound.

Trivia...1962 Mick Avery was playing drums with Mick, Keith and Brian. He was replaced by the new guy CW.

[Winey]

Originally Posted by blesscurse

Well, yes...we'll never really know. We can only believe. Getting back to The Kinks, I think that Mick Avory is a tremendously underrated musician. His drumming on Muswell Hillbillies (the LP) and all the Kinks Kronikles-era collected songs is just amazingly subtle and nuanced, original and powerful. He has a signature style, unique in its own way as Watts or Starr.

One last moment of recording production-related Stones trivia. I grew up with the Stones on vinyl and then the early poorly done CDs, so I anxiously awaited the recently remastered stuff to (re-)confirm one thing: On the final chorus of "Ruby Tuesday," when a tom fill is subsituted for the usual snare fill, the console overloads and distorts as a result. Very cool sound...and that they didn't mind, or bother re-doing the take because of it.

"Distortion Is Truth."

-Robert Poss

http://home.pipeline.com/~rmposs/

Yep I agree.
Avory is amazing!
I love these records, but I also agree that the Kinks are the main reason they sound that way.
Get some mics out there in the traditional 60's style.
I'd start with a kick and a mono overhead compressed together, a LDC on bass amp.
Get these guys all playing together for sure.
These albums have some serious tape artifacts, it's up to you if you want (or are able) to chase that or not.
I'd worry about the excitement the band can create in the room more than anything.
If you have that, the rest should be painless and fun.

BTW...The Kinks are right up there with the Beatles and Dylan IMO.
Ray Davies songwriting skills are insanely impressive.

[u b k]

Originally Posted by borau

Ribbons and Tubes...

i think i'll make that into a poster and slap it up in the control room.


gregoire
del ubik

[Pohaku]

OK, I checked. It's a knitting needle (preferably your Mum's) that you need to insert into the speakers of an 8 watt green formica covered amplifier to get the "right" sound.

[borau]

Originally Posted by u b i k

i think i'll make that into a poster and slap it up in the control room.


gregoire
del ubik

[Delk]

The fabulous guitar sound on that ground-breaking track is a hollowbody Harmony Rocket --> modified El Pico amp (with slashed speakers) acting as a preamp --> Vox AC-30... I researched this in the past but can't find the link.

By the way...what a COOL ASS Project!!!

May the force be with you.

- Delk

[Pohaku]

Yes to the AC-30. I finished listening to my copy of Story Teller and, according to Ray, the "little green amp" was run into an AC-30 to get the guitar sound on You Really Got Me.

[Junkie]

Well, im back after a grueling 6 and a half hours and this is what happened...

TL audio valve unit inserted on all channels

drums were recorded with a D112 as an overhead (seriously, was better than any other mic we tested!!), bass roll of and high shelving was applied, other than that sounded great (premier kit by the way). guitar and bass with SM58's off axis. guitar cab was a vox AC30, he used an epiphone hollow body guitar. Well old fender bass going through a trace elliott 250 or something? they played the rhythm track live, first take and got it perfect!! guitar took some EQ'ing but got a suitable tone after some fluffing about. bass was generally ok as it was recorded so it was left.

bounced drums, guitar and bass to one track with a little spring reverb on guitar and drums (made all the difference!).

Piano part was done next, used a MIDI controller going thorugh a Roland JV 2080 synth, ran upright piano preset through another TL audio dual valve EQ to crunch it up a little. the lead guitar part was done pretty much the same as the rhythm was done but messed around with the tone for that edge.

bounced these down to another track (only 2 tracks left!!).

lead vocals and one backing vocal part was done on one mic with a little compression from ol' focusrite red 3. Used SM58.
remaining channel was used for the rest of the backing vox and tambourine, used SM58.

all thats left is mixing but we are generally pleased with the outcome of today, was hard but we did it!
Gonna overdrive the vocals like you guys suggested, the original to me sounds limited to f*ck so will do that too. noticed how we only used dynamics for the recordings, any criticism here...? we did have an array of quality mic's but we found these to be most suited.

Anyone who wants to listen to the finished product let me know (dont have a copy at this stage, all on ADAT)!!!

p.s. but please remember: i am only a novice : )

THANKS FOR THE ADVICE SO FAR EVERYONE, GREAT WORK!

[Drumsound]

I was reading your post and though the only dynamics was a good idea. The track never had a lot of sparkle as I recall. Please post an MP3 when your done.

[Tubthumper]

Originally Posted by Pohaku

OK, I checked. It's a knitting needle (preferably your Mum's) that you need to insert into the speakers of an 8 watt green formica covered amplifier to get the "right" sound.

Slightly OT, sorry, but I have been keen to bastardise an old Celestion speaker in order to see if I can get close to the You Really Got Me/All Day and All of the Night guitar sound.

Anyone have any suggestions for how I go about slashing the speaker? One knitting needle puncture?? In the cone??? Or should I just go berko and slash the cone with a razor blade?

[Steffmo]

I was told about 25 years ago by Andrew Loog Oldham that Page played the solos on You Really Got Me and Hurdy Gurdy Man. What I'm trying to remember is whay Donovan said while we were doing some last overdubs on the Esssence to Essence CD in the US.

[Junkie]

Yeah, so now ofcourse i have to write stuff up!! anyone gimme some info on the equipment that was typically used in the 60's? i.e. 4 or 8 tracks? compressors, techniques etc.

Thanks again!

[chap]

Originally Posted by Steffmo

I was told about 25 years ago by Andrew Loog Oldham that Page played the solos on You Really Got Me and Hurdy Gurdy Man. What I'm trying to remember is whay Donovan said while we were doing some last overdubs on the Esssence to Essence CD in the US.

The simple notion that you remember anything from those days is worthy of
commendation and some sort of medal. Maybe a Golden Screwdriver for
puncturing speakers?
Playing with Velvet in your neighborhood tonight.
be well,
chap