Pair of overheads

[ddanyboy]

hello
im lookng for a pair of small condenser microphone to use as drum overheads mainly, but also to mic the strings acoustic guitar while using my at4060 or gefell um70.

my budget is 500-600$. is it better to save some more or can i get decent (used) stuff for this price? Any ideas? Is ribbon a good choice?
i were thinking of sm81:s, how are they? I can also get a new pair of Milab vm-44 for this money, please tell me what you think about those.
Thanks!

[SLy_drums]

I have a pair of SM81 and they are sweet as overheads, though they are very "cold sounding" and sometimes agressive in the upper-mids when used with the bad pre. If you have a nice tube preamp to use with them, it will be fine ! They are very detailed (close to the real source) but you won't get a big drum sound as large capsule mics can (oh yes I prefer my C414 ULS !).

If you want to use them on strings too, SM81 do the job, but they do not deliver very clear high frequencies. For that stuff, I love a pair of Oktava MK012 (the real ones, not the chinese copies) which will bring you a smooth, non-agressive and musical top end. They fit very well on acoustic guitars, toms (love them), snare, hats, overheads...and they cost half the price of the 81s ! Get a pair, and you'll see thumbsup (some say close to the Neumann KM84).

Maybe a pair of Rode mics can make it well but i do not know those mics.

You suggested ribbons, and maybe it can be one of the right ways to go ! Check out those Nady or Apex 210 ribbon mics. I'm sure they will match to what you are attempting to get. It's very colored (as a ribbon), so listen to them before.

My choice would be :

1) Oktava MK012
2) Shure SM81
3) Apex 210 ribbon
... depends on what you want

[Solunaris]

For that price I'd check out the Avenson STO-2. They are small diaphragm omni's that are great on drum overheads, acoustic guitars, room mics, or anything else that you want to sound super natural and ultra detailed. Great little mics for about $500 a pair. If you have a little more for some reason, check out the Josephson C42MP for $950. Also Violet mics has some cool small diaphragms called the Black Finger which can be had for about 200 hundred something a piece. I haven't heard those myself but if they sound as good as my other Violet mic then I'm sure they rock.

Justin

[Reggie Love]

If you like Gefells a pair of M300 could be found second hand for around US$600...

I've also sent you a PM.

[ddanyboy]

ive heard much about those josephsons. should i go for omni or Cardiod for drum overheads?

[baron von]

I just got a pair of the chinese made Oktava MC012s for 140 bucks at Guitar Center. I typically hate the place, but it's just about the only place you can get them and I couldn't pass up the price. Good as drum OHs and I tried them as a stereo pair on acoustic guitar and they were equally as pleasing. Unfortunately the chinese ones don't come with the 10db pad and only have cardioid capsules. I wouldn't use omni capsules for OH anyhow.

[DirkB]

Originally Posted by ddanyboy

ive heard much about those josephsons. should i go for omni or Cardiod for drum overheads?

In a not too bright room I really like the Josephson C42's. Very nice transient respons and full sounding to my ears. I use them most of the time in ORTF, works great.

Greetings,
Dirk

[Joel Hamilton]

Sm81 is a great mic for AC guitar. It is actually a great all 'round condenser.
In a medium size room i wind up using earthworks TC30's as overheads quite a bit.

I like the OH to sound like the whole kit, with some air around it, not just cymbal mic type OH... so that is why i like omni's up there unless the room is really too big or funky sounding for omni's as OH...

[ddanyboy]

thanks all!
BTW, im going to use them with 2 trident 80 preamp/eqs for drumoverhead and a 1073 neve pre with 1081 Eq (vintage design clone) to ac. guitar. (3 different martins).
Rather a "soft" sound than a "hard", but still a clear open sound..
Mostly for alternative rock/pop drums and sing&songwriter stuff. no dance, radio pop etc..
if you see any good cheap suggestions anywhere dont hesitate to pm me.
Thanks again!!

[toomanyorgans]

What about vintage AKG 451s? You should have no problem picking up a pair for around $700 and they sound great on both acoustics and drum ohs. You can always add a pair of blue capsules later for a totally different sound too.

[ddanyboy]

is there a big difference between vintage 451 and the new reissue?
blue capsules? whats that? you mean from the company blue!? please explain

[RCM - Ronan]

They are actually medium diaphram condensors, but the Shure KSM32's are my favorite overhead mics at any price point.

[ddanyboy]

ok, i think i read about that in som other post around here. have you guys seen any oh mics for a good price somewhere btw? (used that is)

[ddanyboy]

havent heard anything about that microphone.. im not sure about cad either. is it a chinese, cheap co?

[dale116dot7]

Originally Posted by ddanyboy

is there a big difference between vintage 451 and the new reissue?
blue capsules? whats that? you mean from the company blue!? please explain

The new reissue has a fixed back-electret capsule and transformerless output. The acoustics of the capsule is the same but it does sound different. You can't use an aftermarket capsule on the new C451B. The new capsule is still made by AKG. Blue does (or did?) offer lolipop capsules to fit on a C451EB body. Those won't work on the new C451B. The Blue capsules were essentially a large-diaphragm condensor capsule and a screw thread that would fit into an existing amplifier.

Before slagging AKG for making this mic an electret, a back-electret does not have the diaphragm limitations of earlier electrets - the diaphragm assembly is the same as the old C451. The backplate is now coated with a thin layer of electret material.

You can get a similar sound to a vintage C451EB+CK1 if you take the highs and roll them off about 3 or 4 dB on a nice EQ - something like a Neve pre+eq or that sort of thing.

I actually like the new C451's for overheads, but they are bright. They are, however, a clean bright, which does give you the option of using a bit of EQ to darken them if you want. But do that analog if you can, before your converters.

I like the vintage ones better but the new ones are pretty good if you don't consider them a re-issue but a different - slightly brighter - mic.

[C/G]

Originally Posted by ddanyboy

is there a big difference between vintage 451 and the new reissue?
blue capsules? whats that? you mean from the company blue!? please explain

The older 451's had a removeable capsule so can use omni, cardioid ect on the same mic amplifier body. I have the BLUE lollipop capsule, which is a large diaphragm capsule they make, that threads onto the old, not new, 451 body. I think they sound bloody fantastic.

[seawell]

A pair of Audio Technica 4040's would fit your budget. I like them a lot on overheads. They aren't small diaphragm condensers though.

[henryrobinett]

Peluso CEMC-6 I prefer over the Oktava and the SM81

[lucey]

Originally Posted by henryrobinett

Peluso CEMC-6 I prefer over the Oktava and the SM81

those look nice ... what's the curve?


(i like the warm-onmi Avensons $500 and the C12-ish C42s $900)

[ddanyboy]

i bought a pir of c451 b (new). 600us incl shipping to sweden. ok price? Ill tell you what i think when ive tried em.

[vudoo]

I have the chance to pick up a C 451 EB + CK1 and was just wondering what is a decent price for it ???

Also, i have an old C 451 EB ( have no idea what is the capsule ) that needs repairm ( it sometimes works if you jerk-rotate the inside as it bacame loose over the years ) . Can i actually get this old mic fixed and anyone knows a good place to get it repaired ( i'm in Montreal ). Thanks

[vudoo]

Damn, sorry about this post. I meant to start a new post for it..moderator please feel free to delete it. Thanks

[peter-pan]

No body as mention the Fostex MC10ST.
A stereo match pair with shock mount and the x/y bracket for stereo recording…
And you can buy for about $100.00.
Try it, for the price it’s very hard to beat.

JFN

[mltamisin]

The Octava's sound pretty good in that price range. I've A/B'd them against the Peluso's for rock OH's and preferred the Octava's. As did the other engineer. It wasn't even close really. I've yet to see a pair of Gefells M300's used for $600 but if you can find them snag em. I'd suggest saving around $300 more and it'll put you in another bracket as far as options. The $1000 bracket offers more options that are well worth the cost. A couple more hundred and the Josephson's are in reach.