The Cheapest GOOD Converter??

Sput · 28th August 2005

Sounds like a paradox, doesn't it?
I'm considering spending some more bucks in a A/D converter (preferibly 8 or more channel on ADAT).
Any hints on a cheap one?
Any other brands appart from the expensive Apogee worth looking at?

Thanks!

Kenny Gioia · 28th August 2005

I would consider a used 888/24.

You can get them used for about $800.

That's $100 per pre. These were the studio standard.

u b k · 28th August 2005

it'd be helpful if you defined "cheap". what exactly are you looking to spend? $200? $1200?

also, i think you'll get more useful responses to this question on the 'low end' forum, where inexpensive is their specialty.

gregoire
del ubik

jdunn · 28th August 2005

Yeah, some people do use those Behringers. If they turn on when you hit the power switch, I'd say give those a listen!

Seriously, that's the main problem I've had w/ Behringer gear. It doesn't power up. The guy who sells SAW Studio, Bob Lentini uses the Behringers I believe.

RecTechMin · 28th August 2005

i've used the behringers a couple times. they don't sound half bad if you're in a crunch.

Adebar · 28th August 2005

I heard great things about the RME Octamic D. It has mic inpits too but the AD section alone seems to be worth the price.

RainbowStorm · 29th August 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sput

Sounds like a paradox, doesn't it?
I'm considering spending some more bucks in a A/D converter (preferibly 8 or more channel on ADAT).
Any hints on a cheap one?
Any other brands appart from the expensive Apogee worth looking at?

Thanks!

Well I don't know how it's possible to get many channels for a cheap price with a good sounding result. I don't think it's possible. If you want a good sounding converter for cheap, look for a stereo converter.

Ziggy!! · 29th August 2005

Lucid's AD8824 (I think thats the model) can be had for around $1200 used...

fross · 29th August 2005

FWIW I listened to a production recently that was done with the behringers and it sounded relly good.

papawhitehead · 29th August 2005

Yeah, the Lucid 8824 is really good.

88fingerz · 29th August 2005

The Kurzweil Rumour!

Top notch sound, bargain price, Great effects too!

Do a search on this and other forums.

Best of luck!

faeflora · 29th August 2005

The Kurz KSP8 has pretty good converters and ya get an fx unit with it!

u b k · 29th August 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyCrazyMan

I don't think it's possible.

i know it's possible.

gregoire
del ubik

Sput · 29th August 2005

I should have been more specific.

I didn't post this in "Low End" because I wasn't really refering to Berhinger and the like. Just wanted to know if there was something in the middle. You know, not $200, not $3000.

Anyways, thanks for the replies!
Lucid products look nice. I was also considering the Focusrite ISA 428 with the digital ADC. Somebody mentioned it in another thread and seems a good idea to spend the bucks in 2 things at the same time. The price doesn't seem to bad either.
Someone selling one to me..???

jdunn · 29th August 2005

You should get a used Mytek ADC 8x96 for sure then. They've been going for $1,500 around here lately, I'm not sure why. Maybe because the newer Myteks are coming out, or the Apogee X series and Lynx Aurora give you more channels for less.

cletus · 29th August 2005

I'd personally check out the metric halo 2882. 8 channels of good a/d and d/a for around 1,300 bucks. I'll admit that I've never used one but have spoken to people who have including Bob Rice who was involved with R&D for the 2882. It's said that they're way better than the 192's converters and right up there with the apogee ad 16x. It also has 8 pres I believe. Check it out for yourself.

Blazinghammer · 29th August 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdunn

The guy who sells SAW Studio, Bob Lentini uses the Behringers I believe.

He's also the guy who WROTE SAWStudio, BTW

Yeah, he used the Behrrys on his latest projects. Claims they're great bang for buck.

Blessings,

u b k · 29th August 2005

right then... best bang for the buck in that middle place:

metric halo - very open, clean, airy top, the mid rate mytek. non-dsp version is a great buy.

tascam 1884 - vibey, warm, soft like tape. the mid apogee. bonus: great control surface.

rme fireface - in the middle, not too airy, not warm. the mid lavry.

all imo. ymmv. ignore me. etc...

gregoire
del ubik

tsd · 29th August 2005

those bear ringer 8 channel things spin me out. The pres are less than useless, but the AD-DA is great. the studio that i work at uses them as the main converters for an SSL. I couldnt get over it for ages, but they really do sound fine.

My understanding is that the AD-DA is a knock off from an apogee design, but without output transformers on the analogue outs.

dave-G · 29th August 2005

If you look around enough, you might still find some of the discontinued Panasonic/Ramsa WZ-series converters (which are very nice, IMO) .. Very clear and neutral, yet somehow "smooth"

-dg

AjD · 29th August 2005

Ok, regarding something in-between the Behringer ADA8000s and the top-of-the-line stuff... I've been using a pair of Frontier Design Group Tango 24s for the past 4-5 years.

At the time I bought them, they were definitely the "cost effective, good enough" option. Now I suspect they are technologically a bit long in the tooth (only go up to 24 bit & 48khz). (I've also used the Behringers a bunch at another studio - not quite as "wide" a soundfield, but nothing to be ashamed of with those at all.)

Is their anything newer that occupies the "good enough" product tier (say, $600 bucks for 8 AD/DA)? Something with higher bit rates, etc? Don't know, perhaps someone else can chime in here.

In any case, I'm still very happy with my Tangos. Clear, neutral sounding, well-definited bottom end. Clock is solid too (it's my master). They are a good, solid product, and - have to mention this - they will steer you away from having the "Taint of Behringer" staring back at you from your rig (sorry! if anything, there's something psychologically demeaning to many of us about Uli's brand, given all the criticism - IMHO, putting Behringer in your rack is kinda of like having Charlie Brown show up at your cocktail party and then greet all the incoming guests at the door).

Some day, I'll upgrade to the Apogees and their ilk - as well as higher sample rates, and their hungrier hard drive appetites. But that's a long way off for me - given the "last mile" nature of converters.

If I had $3000 or so floating around in my studio back pocket (and wanted to improve the quality of my recordings with that money), I'd be far more likely to put it towards a couple boutique guitar amps, or a used Yamaha studio piano. Even if I wanted "showier" pieces to attract new customers, I'd do the same.

Especially if I wanted to attract new customers, actually. The only people who find converters sexy are recording engineers.

Which, I suppose, you'd probably agree with. Since you started this thread.

Adam

wilkinswp · 29th August 2005

Lots of people seem to like the stuff from Lynx studios. Never heard them myself.

dokushoka · 29th August 2005

I've got the Metric Halo 2882. It does sound quite good, good enough that its not gonna bug you. It does 8 adat in and out, simultaneously, which is pretty worth noting. If you mix OoTB, the plugins can be placed between your DAW on console which is actually quite nice as their limiter is very musical, the EQ is decent, the compressor is ok, etc.

krs · 29th August 2005

Surprised mobody mentioned the Mackie FW cards for the Onyx mixers. Haven't used it (I do have the Onyx w/o card, am very pleased) so I can't attest to the conversion quality - though in the price range they I would guess they should be one of the things to look at

jdunn · 29th August 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blazinghammer

He's also the guy who WROTE SAWStudio, BTW

Yeah, he used the Behrrys on his latest projects. Claims they're great bang for buck.

Blessings,

Yes, I'm aware of this. So the correct sentence should have read something like "The creator of SAW Studio, Bob Lentini uses the Behringers".

I couldn't possibly stand to use Samplitude or SAW Studio, so I'm sticking with my Macs. Something about the graphics looking horrible on a PC really bothers me. I can't look at the screen for long without getting pissed off.

The Panasonic recommendation wasn't bad BTW. I've done albums on a DA7 that sounded pretty decent.

pan60 · 29th August 2005

how is the RME Multiface II, with its pci card?

David R. · 29th August 2005

Check out the Alesis HD24XR. If you buy 24 converters, they throw in a hard disk recorder free!

faeflora · 29th August 2005

Oh hey I know a good one!

$3000!

Never heard Lynx conversion before but supposedly it's great!

http://www.lynxstudio.com/aurora/index.html

RME is sorta bleh imo.

lsn110 · 29th August 2005

I run a Metric Halo 2882 as well as 8 channels of Lucid 8824 for a total of 16 in/out.

The Metric Halo is definitely decent for the $. I've never used the pres on it, so I can't speak to that, but the AD/DA conversion is fine. I like that I can easily take it with me for field projects (hooks up nicely to my laptop).

The Lucid 8824 is my go to converter though. When tracking basics, I fill the Lucid with the essentials and then push the rest (scratch vocals, parts I know are going to be re-tracked) to the Metric Halo. Of course the MH gets full duty on mixdown. It's really good, but the Lucid is just that much better.

norman_nomad · 29th August 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsd

those bear ringer 8 channel things spin me out. The pres are less than useless, but the AD-DA is great. the studio that i work at uses them as the main converters for an SSL. I couldnt get over it for ages, but they really do sound fine.

My understanding is that the AD-DA is a knock off from an apogee design, but without output transformers on the analogue outs.

Damn.. you guys have me thinking of buying the ADA8000 just to check out. I've heard some say that it takes a leap forward when matched with a good clock. Has anyone here actually done any shootouts with ADA8000 placed against some of the higher priced models... or are people just impressed with it for the price??

28th August 2005	#1
Sput Gear addict Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 332 Thread Starter	The Cheapest GOOD Converter?? Sounds like a paradox, doesn't it? I'm considering spending some more bucks in a A/D converter (preferibly 8 or more channel on ADAT). Any hints on a cheap one? Any other brands appart from the expensive Apogee worth looking at? Thanks!

28th August 2005	#2
Kenny Gioia Lives for gear Joined: Jul 2002 Location: NYC Posts: 8,523	I would consider a used 888/24. You can get them used for about $800. That's $100 per pre. These were the studio standard. __________________ It's a journey. Not a destination. Enjoy yours.

29th August 2005	#11
88fingerz Lives for gear Joined: Sep 2002 Location: NYC Posts: 1,123	The Kurzweil Rumour! Top notch sound, bargain price, Great effects too! Do a search on this and other forums. Best of luck! __________________ You Don't Need A Band! http://www.RockgardenMusic.com

29th August 2005	#14
Sput Gear addict Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 332 Thread Starter	Sorry guys... I should have been more specific. I didn't post this in "Low End" because I wasn't really refering to Berhinger and the like. Just wanted to know if there was something in the middle. You know, not $200, not $3000. Anyways, thanks for the replies! Lucid products look nice. I was also considering the Focusrite ISA 428 with the digital ADC. Somebody mentioned it in another thread and seems a good idea to spend the bucks in 2 things at the same time. The price doesn't seem to bad either. Someone selling one to me..???

29th August 2005	#21
AjD Gear addict Joined: Jul 2005 Location: Dexter/Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 312	Ok, regarding something in-between the Behringer ADA8000s and the top-of-the-line stuff... I've been using a pair of Frontier Design Group Tango 24s for the past 4-5 years. At the time I bought them, they were definitely the "cost effective, good enough" option. Now I suspect they are technologically a bit long in the tooth (only go up to 24 bit & 48khz). (I've also used the Behringers a bunch at another studio - not quite as "wide" a soundfield, but nothing to be ashamed of with those at all.) Is their anything newer that occupies the "good enough" product tier (say, $600 bucks for 8 AD/DA)? Something with higher bit rates, etc? Don't know, perhaps someone else can chime in here. In any case, I'm still very happy with my Tangos. Clear, neutral sounding, well-definited bottom end. Clock is solid too (it's my master). They are a good, solid product, and - have to mention this - they will steer you away from having the "Taint of Behringer" staring back at you from your rig (sorry! if anything, there's something psychologically demeaning to many of us about Uli's brand, given all the criticism - IMHO, putting Behringer in your rack is kinda of like having Charlie Brown show up at your cocktail party and then greet all the incoming guests at the door). Some day, I'll upgrade to the Apogees and their ilk - as well as higher sample rates, and their hungrier hard drive appetites. But that's a long way off for me - given the "last mile" nature of converters. If I had $3000 or so floating around in my studio back pocket (and wanted to improve the quality of my recordings with that money), I'd be far more likely to put it towards a couple boutique guitar amps, or a used Yamaha studio piano. Even if I wanted "showier" pieces to attract new customers, I'd do the same. Especially if I wanted to attract new customers, actually. The only people who find converters sexy are recording engineers. Which, I suppose, you'd probably agree with. Since you started this thread. Adam __________________ "(People) believe that solutions emerge from judicious study of discernible reality. That's not the way the world works anymore. We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you're studying that reality - judiciously, as you will - we'll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, & that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors... and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.'' - Senior Bush advisor, NY Times, 10/17/04

28th August 2005	#3
u b k Gear Guru Joined: Oct 2004 Location: The Land of Sunshine Posts: 11,292	it'd be helpful if you defined "cheap". what exactly are you looking to spend? $200? $1200? also, i think you'll get more useful responses to this question on the 'low end' forum, where inexpensive is their specialty. gregoire del ubik

28th August 2005	#4
jdunn Head of Bumping Security (B.S) Joined: Feb 2004 Location: in the hills of Southern California Posts: 2,944	Yeah, some people do use those Behringers. If they turn on when you hit the power switch, I'd say give those a listen! Seriously, that's the main problem I've had w/ Behringer gear. It doesn't power up. The guy who sells SAW Studio, Bob Lentini uses the Behringers I believe.

28th August 2005	#5
RecTechMin Gear Head Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 39	i've used the behringers a couple times. they don't sound half bad if you're in a crunch.

28th August 2005	#6
Adebar Lives for gear Joined: May 2005 Posts: 798	I heard great things about the RME Octamic D. It has mic inpits too but the AD section alone seems to be worth the price.

29th August 2005	#8
Ziggy!! Lives for gear Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,319	Lucid's AD8824 (I think thats the model) can be had for around $1200 used...

29th August 2005	#9
fross Gear addict Joined: Aug 2002 Location: NYC Posts: 494	FWIW I listened to a production recently that was done with the behringers and it sounded relly good.

29th August 2005	#10
papawhitehead Gear maniac Joined: Feb 2005 Location: Austin Posts: 235	Yeah, the Lucid 8824 is really good.

29th August 2005	#12
faeflora Lives for gear Joined: Oct 2002 Location: washington dc Posts: 2,022	The Kurz KSP8 has pretty good converters and ya get an fx unit with it!

29th August 2005	#16
cletus Gear addict Joined: May 2005 Location: Bay Area Posts: 406	I'd personally check out the metric halo 2882. 8 channels of good a/d and d/a for around 1,300 bucks. I'll admit that I've never used one but have spoken to people who have including Bob Rice who was involved with R&D for the 2882. It's said that they're way better than the 192's converters and right up there with the apogee ad 16x. It also has 8 pres I believe. Check it out for yourself.

29th August 2005	#19
tsd Gear maniac Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 174	those bear ringer 8 channel things spin me out. The pres are less than useless, but the AD-DA is great. the studio that i work at uses them as the main converters for an SSL. I couldnt get over it for ages, but they really do sound fine. My understanding is that the AD-DA is a knock off from an apogee design, but without output transformers on the analogue outs.

29th August 2005	#20
dave-G Lives for gear Joined: Jun 2002 Location: Florida Posts: 2,486	If you look around enough, you might still find some of the discontinued Panasonic/Ramsa WZ-series converters (which are very nice, IMO) .. Very clear and neutral, yet somehow "smooth" -dg

29th August 2005	#22
wilkinswp Gear addict Joined: May 2005 Posts: 414	Lots of people seem to like the stuff from Lynx studios. Never heard them myself.

29th August 2005	#23
dokushoka Lives for gear Joined: Sep 2004 Location: San Francisco / L.A. Posts: 1,092	I've got the Metric Halo 2882. It does sound quite good, good enough that its not gonna bug you. It does 8 adat in and out, simultaneously, which is pretty worth noting. If you mix OoTB, the plugins can be placed between your DAW on console which is actually quite nice as their limiter is very musical, the EQ is decent, the compressor is ok, etc. __________________ San Francisco based Mixing and Production http://www.sfrecording.com

29th August 2005	#24
krs Lives for gear Joined: Jun 2004 Posts: 882	Surprised mobody mentioned the Mackie FW cards for the Onyx mixers. Haven't used it (I do have the Onyx w/o card, am very pleased) so I can't attest to the conversion quality - though in the price range they I would guess they should be one of the things to look at

29th August 2005	#26
pan60 500 series nutjob Joined: Nov 2004 Location: 500 series Guru SKANK! ; ) Posts: 10,940	how is the RME Multiface II, with its pci card?

29th August 2005	#27
David R. Lives for gear Joined: Jun 2002 Location: I left my heart, in... Posts: 1,881	Check out the Alesis HD24XR. If you buy 24 converters, they throw in a hard disk recorder free! __________________ -David R. "An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way." - C. Bukowski

29th August 2005	#29
lsn110 Gear Head Joined: Sep 2002 Location: Saratoga Posts: 37	I run a Metric Halo 2882 as well as 8 channels of Lucid 8824 for a total of 16 in/out. The Metric Halo is definitely decent for the $. I've never used the pres on it, so I can't speak to that, but the AD/DA conversion is fine. I like that I can easily take it with me for field projects (hooks up nicely to my laptop). The Lucid 8824 is my go to converter though. When tracking basics, I fill the Lucid with the essentials and then push the rest (scratch vocals, parts I know are going to be re-tracked) to the Metric Halo. Of course the MH gets full duty on mixdown. It's really good, but the Lucid is just that much better.

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