Looking for a solid pair of small condenser microphones.

[atticus]

For cool, versatile mics I'd check ou the T.H.E. mics. They are modular, affordable, and sounds really good.


www.theaudio.com

[squeegybug]

Originally Posted by Gravity8058

Yes, I've used both. The AT 4051 cant take the level nor do they have the openness of the C42s.

Not arguing your experience... but AT4051a is spec'ed at SPL 146 dB vs 135 dB for C42? Self noise of 19 for 4051 vs 21 for C42, so dynamic range is 127 vs 114. And on acoustic instruments like the OP wanted?

Steve

[djui5]

Originally Posted by squeegybug

Not arguing your experience... but AT4051a is spec'ed at SPL 146 dB vs 135 dB for C42? Self noise of 19 for 4051 vs 21 for C42, so dynamic range is 127 vs 114. And on acoustic instruments like the OP wanted?

Steve

I voted for 4051's, and use them quite a lot. I've never used the C42's, so I can't attest to their sound.


What I need to say is that even though the 4051's spec out a 146db, I don't think they'd ever sound anything but horribly unpleasant at these kinda volumes. They do have a "brittle" top end, and I'd imagine could get really nasty at loud volumes.
They may be able to handle SPL's like that, but it dosent' mean they sound good.

Car audio amp's are the same way. They can spec out to 5000 watts, but they won't sound good outputing that kinda power.

It's marketing...

[squeegybug]

Well, I think 146 dB wouldn't work too well for my ears:



The statement was the 4051 "can't take the level".... I don't intend to record any acoustic instruments that loud.

Steve

[Pohaku]

FWIW, you might find this interesting. Covers the 4041s and C42s, as well as schoeps and neumann.

http://emusician.com/mics/emusic_smokin_condensers/

[Youn]

Originally Posted by squeegybug

The statement was the 4051 "can't take the level".... I don't intend to record any acoustic instruments that loud.

Steve

That's what assistants are for, you stay in the control room and have them move the mic around until it sounds best. You may want to warn them to put ear plugs in, or not.


I've used the C42 for a couple years and sometimes find them too bright, or 'glassy' as someone here described them.

Now, the only preamp I've really used them with is the RNP, which may be adding to the top-end sheen - only used it a couple times with API pres, which seems to tame things alot, plus giving it a fuller sound. They've never sounded harsh to me though, and I'm greatful for that.

[paterno]

Originally Posted by john caldwell

Remind me again, what's wrong with KM184's ? This board refers to KM84's whith such frequency that the unsuspecting reader would actually think that the KM84 is available and affordable! Call me unsophisticated whitebread, but I think KM184's are tremendous mics and not similar to the Oktava at all wrt quality. My 2nd pair of new KM184 came from Alto, and they were scarcely over $950, if memory serves.

John-

I think the 184 sounds very good. The big drag is that it has no pad [which the KM 84 has] and that makes it hard to use on things like guitar amps and drum overheads, which are two places i really like to use 84's. The 184's just distort too quickly for a lot of applications that the 84 handles with no problem.

Cheers,
John

[jigsawlogic]

I just picked up a pair of 4051s last week from Full Compass, and am pleased as punch

Lowest prices I've seen on these mics anywhere.

[Gravity8058]

It appears I need to defend my statements. Regarding the 4051's "not taking the level" I'm not just talking about distortion, I'm also refering to the way that certain mics change in character when hit hard. This can occur due to a number of variables.
I should also point out that my experience was using them as drum overheads, which is my primary test for SDCs. The only SDCs I've been happy with on overheads are DPAs and the Josephsons.

[Gravity8058]

Oh yes, and KM 54s, and KM 56s

[djui5]

Originally Posted by Sounds Great

You think they have a brittle high end? Was never my impression.

Not always. I've used them with much success on things like OH's, HH, Ride, high strings on piano and acoustic guitar. But sometimes they just sound a little funny in the top end.

[john caldwell]

Originally Posted by paterno

I think the 184 sounds very good. The big drag is that it has no pad [which the KM 84 has] and that makes it hard to use on things like guitar amps and drum overheads, which are two places i really like to use 84's. The 184's just distort too quickly for a lot of applications that the 84 handles with no problem.

Cheers,
John

Good point about the pad inherent to the Km84. In what situations you you find you distort the KM184 head amplifiers? Not that I disagree or doubt; I'm curious as I never run into mic overload with the KM184 as a drum overhead. As for guitar amps I never have tried a close placement with any scd, so I don't really test them. Here again, though, the folks I'm working with a probably quitet players by contemporary standards.

John-