I want Console Opinions

[Lexinator]

Some of you guys already know that I've recently embarked on an expedition in the to unknown, to that mysterious "hole full of money..." building my own recording studio.

First: I'm not an engineer, I'm a guitarist.

Second: I have a great designer in my camp. Wes Lachot. I needed the sharpest pencil in the box. I have "unusual needs." Enough said.

Third: I already have a building, and it's undergoing modification as we speak.

Fourth: With studios closing right and left (again) the promise of "outside work" looms large. I've been around a while, and I know a lot of people. The Man Cave" will draw some gigs, and it'll keep the rooms busy...

Here's my questions for you guys;

If you had your choice between an SSL 9000j series console, and a SSL Duality, which one would you choose, and why?

Previous to this, we had an SSL AWS 900+, but it's been sold. It just wasn't up to the job.

And question number two;

Does anybody know of a source for information (besides each and every product manual) that has a compilation of power consumption requirements for studio gear?

I have a lot of "vintage gear" that I may not even deploy, because it's "newer" counterparts are more "power efficient."

Maybe I'll build a "mobile" with the old stuff... Hmmm...

On the farm where this studio will exist, we make our own power using PV panels and generators.

I'm told that the Duality uses about half the power of the 9000j.

If I could get a good number on power demand, that might just define which console I use.

(After all, would you rather spend countless thousands of dollars beefing up your power grid, or use that money on a less "power-hungry" board that costs more money. In the end, it'll be a wash, I suspect. If I'm guessing right, I might as well just buy the Duality, and have that newer, cooler [and more importantly "still" supported by SSL] board in my CR.)

Thanks for the opinions.

[raal]

Originally Posted by Lexinator

If you had your choice between an SSL 9000j series console, and a SSL Duality, which one would you choose, and why?

a tech who has commissioned/de-commissioned more than a few SSLs told me that the J was upgraded over the entire span of it's production and that once it had stabilized, they went to the new computer and changed the model designation; that there are many differences between the first and the last J, while the last J and first K were pretty much the same, except for the computer and some changes in the center section for surround.

the 1st Js were extremely quiet but weren't known for generous amounts of headroom, while Ks are known to have a lot more headroom, so depending on what J you're considering, this could be a factor.

the J obviously has more features than Duality as a console, but a J has no DAW control, and all the routing flexibility of a J may not be necessary if you're using a DAW, so that's a consideration too. you've already mentioned several points that favor the Duality (current tech support and less power consumption), but the price you're being offered the J for, would be an obvious factor.

good luck and i hope this helps some. post some pics when you're done!

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by Lexinator

If you had your choice between an SSL 9000j series console, and a SSL Duality, which one would you choose, and why?

I looked hard at a similar choice: 9000K vs. Duality, and the Duality won hands-down:

1. Lower power was a "nice" green feature (especially with respect to A/C).
2. Integrated power supply meant a lot more room in the machine room: "nice"
3. Duality's surround capability is a "very nice"
4. A good (but not best) DAW solution: "nice"
5. Multi-operator recall: "nice"
6. Current support from SSL: "must have"

Even with a price difference of nearly $100K, the duality won that shootout.

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by Clueless

I looked hard at a similar choice: 9000K vs. Duality, and the Duality won hands-down:

1. Lower power was a "nice" green feature (especially with respect to A/C).
2. Integrated power supply meant a lot more room in the machine room: "nice"
3. Duality's surround capability is a "very nice"
4. A good (but not best) DAW solution: "nice"
5. Multi-operator recall: "nice"
6. Current support from SSL: "must have"

Even with a price difference of nearly $100K, the duality won that shootout.

Thanks for the intel! I'm torn, Wes wants me to buy this 9048 (it's a real good deal) but it'll sit crated for almost 8 months. In that amount of time, I could possibly raise enough to buy the Duality.

And, that would really depend on a few things, I suppose. The studio will be for "hire" (special projects only), so I have to consider other users. We'll always be building our own power, so any big power requirement changes will affect us immediately. Although the 9048j does a few more tricks, the Duality has a better DAW interface, not to mention self contained power supplies.

It's all so confusing... I think I'm getting a headache! Maybe I need to take a quick crash course in sound engineering at onna them geek schools...

Lexx

[dangoudie]

I can't say that I have used any other SSL but the Duality is a pleasure to work with and sounds fantastic. There's a few additions to the dynamics section which are great and not on other consoles. It has a split channel design and so is a lot shallower front-to-back than other consoles giving you more room. There were teething problems with the DAW control but sorted with software updates. It's a heck of a lot of money but if you can afford it then it sounds great, looks great, works great...

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by raal

a tech who has commissioned/de-commissioned more than a few SSLs told me that the J was upgraded over the entire span of it's production and that once it had stabilized, they went to the new computer and changed the model designation; that there are many differences between the first and the last J, while the last J and first K were pretty much the same, except for the computer and some changes in the center section for surround.

the 1st Js were extremely quiet but weren't known for generous amounts of headroom, while Ks are known to have a lot more headroom, so depending on what J you're considering, this could be a factor.

the J obviously has more features than Duality as a console, but a J has no DAW control, and all the routing flexibility of a J may not be necessary if you're using a DAW, so that's a consideration too. you've already mentioned several points that favor the Duality (current tech support and less power consumption), but the price you're being offered the J for, would be an obvious factor.

good luck and i hope this helps some. post some pics when you're done!

Thanks for the information! It's appreciated.

The biggest dilemma for me is in the fact that I'm a musician, and not an engineer. So, I'm looking at these board like they were Ferraris...

We'll being doing a LOT of 2" tape (Studer), and some digital as well. We'll use ProTools to keep the masses happy, but I suspect that a lot of the time, it's all analog...

The 9048j is a real bargain, and the ONLY thing that scares me is that it'll sit for 8 months before it gets commissioned. In that time, it's value will drop, it will become more obsolete, and the Duality will become more affordable (due to time passage). If the Duality is a better solution, uses less power, and will be supported longer (under warranties), it might be the way to go.

How is DAW control accomplished with a 9048j?

I trust my designer a LOT, but I need to make sure I'm making the right move here, because I won't get another shot at it.

Thanks for your input!

Lexx

[raal]

Originally Posted by Lexinator

Thanks for the intel! I'm torn, Wes wants me to buy this 9048 (it's a real good deal) but it'll sit crated for almost 8 months. In that amount of time, I could possibly raise enough to buy the Duality.

... and in that amount of time it'll probably depreciate some more.

Originally Posted by Lexinator

How is DAW control accomplished with a 9048j?

with an external controller.

if you're on PT maybe a small D.Command, or these are popular and they work with all DAWs: Euphonix :: MC Systems

these huge boards are going for pennies on the $ these days and the trend isn't likely to reverse, but if you're getting it at a steal it may be worth it. it seems you're aware of the pitfalls (green factors, decomissioning/recomissioning, no DAW control, lack of support, etc.)... when i'm in a dilemma like that i sometimes flip a coin.... 2 out of three is the winner.

but it always feel better to have thought things out and arrive at a conclusion i'm fairly sure about. good luck on your decision pro. thumbsup

[speakercoil]

I've worked on a 9000 before and they are nice. They have two at Blackbird Studios, however does it have to be an SSL?

It all depends on what you are looking for. Is it for efficiency or sound quality? The SSL is an amazing board as far as functionality (all SSL's are), however I am not a huge fan of their sound... Especially their pre's. They are nice and clean and quiet, but they lack character to me.

So if it is sound you are interested in... I suggest getting an old Helios board if you can find one... Also API's have a lot of character and so do Neve's... I prefer both of these over SSL.

SSL's are great for mixing, but I am just not a fan of them for tracking.

A list of some great used boards can be found here.

Consoles and Mixers | Used | VintageKing.com

Also they have a new console section here:
Audio Recording Consoles | VintageKing.com

If you do get an SSL... Make sure you have ample outboard pre's for color. I suggest once again Helios, some old RCA's, and maybe some Chandler's. Thinking of that... I wish Chandler would just make a whole board.

The Wunder Audio stuff all sounds pretty lush as well, but the price tag is hefty.

For an idea of what my ears have heard... I have worked on or heard the following.

Neve 8078: (beautiful pre's and very effective board... It's in the A room at Blackbird, and John McBride uses that room for pretty much everything he does)

Neve 88 RS: is a wonderful board, and sounds great. Though I do not it was actually designed by Rupert Neve, it is still a great board.

Amek 9098i: very difficult board to get used to, but very powerful if you can master it... Decent sounding, but not spectacular by neve standards... Oh yeah this WAS designed by Rupert Neve.

Neve 8128: This was the first major format console I ever got to work on and it sounded f'in awesome... I highly recomend these boards. Though it runs on Flying Faders I beleve, so you need to get an OLD school comp to run the automation

API Legacy: I've heard two of these before and they sound fabulous and they look amazing. Pretty functional too for automation.

Tident 32: Not horrible sounding, but kind of a pain to work with. Nothing to write home about, but decent for starting studios.

SSL 4000: Not a bad board, pretty functional, easy to use.

SSL 9000XL and K: Wonderfully functional... Impressive looking... Easy to use... But the pre's and compressors are just a bit bland for me.

Things to note if you MUST go with SSL:
George Massenburg has a 9000 in his room at Blackbird... He used to have a Digidesign ICON.
They are a dream to mix on, but to me pretty stale to record with.
VERY easy to use... Every SSL I have used has been easy to understand.

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by dangoudie

I can't say that I have used any other SSL but the Duality is a pleasure to work with and sounds fantastic. There's a few additions to the dynamics section which are great and not on other consoles. It has a split channel design and so is a lot shallower front-to-back than other consoles giving you more room. There were teething problems with the DAW control but sorted with software updates. It's a heck of a lot of money but if you can afford it then it sounds great, looks great, works great...

Hey thanks for the info!

I know it's a lot of cash, but I think it'll pay off. If I was staying "solo" I could probably cut some corners, but since I plan to "let" the space out, I need really good gear, that's easily understandable.

The hardest part of this is that although I've spent most of my life in studios, I've always been on the other side of that glass, the majority of the time. The learning curve here is significant. And I am NOT getting any younger, let me tell you!

One thing I like about the SSL's is that they are usually set up to be really user friendly. I'm going to need that feature desperately. We'll bring in a "geek" to laugh at us for a while, but sooner or later I'm gonna have to fly that thing myself.

And I need to consider the fact that we'll go back and forth between tape and digital, constantly. 2" and Jazz, are like surf and turf...

One of the things I like about the Duality is that it's compact, and relatively self-contained. That's gonna save me money both in CR design and installation.

I appreciate the way you guys have jumped in to help. It's sincerely appreciated!

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by raal

... and in that amount of time it'll probably depreciate some more.

with an external controller.

if you're on PT maybe a small D.Command, or these are popular and they work with all DAWs: Euphonix :: MC Systems

these huge boards are going for pennies on the $ these days and the trend isn't likely to reverse, but if you're getting it at a steal it may be worth it. it seems you're aware of the pitfalls (green factors, decomissioning/recomissioning, no DAW control, lack of support, etc.)... when i'm in a dilemma like that i sometimes flip a coin.... 2 out of three is the winner.

but it always feel better to have thought things out and arrive at a conclusion i'm fairly sure about. good luck on your decision pro. thumbsup

I'm leaning toward the Duality at this point, but I can't tell you how many private messages I've gotten telling me to just go ProTools, and forget a console altogether. In a "working studio" is this really even possible?

I know things are changing, but man... if that were true, wouldn't I be seeing that in the studios I carry my sorry butt in and out of, now?

So much to learn... so few years left before senility kicks in...

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by speakercoil

I've worked on a 9000 before and they are nice. They have two at Blackbird Studios, however does it have to be an SSL?

It all depends on what you are looking for. Is it for efficiency or sound quality? The SSL is an amazing board as far as functionality (all SSL's are), however I am not a huge fan of their sound... Especially their pre's. They are nice and clean and quiet, but they lack character to me.

So if it is sound you are interested in... I suggest getting an old Helios board if you can find one... Also API's have a lot of character and so do Neve's... I prefer both of these over SSL.

SSL's are great for mixing, but I am just not a fan of them for tracking.

A list of some great used boards can be found here.

Consoles and Mixers | Used | VintageKing.com

Also they have a new console section here:
Audio Recording Consoles | VintageKing.com

If you do get an SSL... Make sure you have ample outboard pre's for color. I suggest once again Helios, some old RCA's, and maybe some Chandler's. Thinking of that... I wish Chandler would just make a whole board.

The Wunder Audio stuff all sounds pretty lush as well, but the price tag is hefty.

For an idea of what my ears have heard... I have worked on or heard the following.

Neve 8078: (beautiful pre's and very effective board... It's in the A room at Blackbird, and John McBride uses that room for pretty much everything he does)

Neve 88 RS: is a wonderful board, and sounds great. Though I do not it was actually designed by Rupert Neve, it is still a great board.

Amek 9098i: very difficult board to get used to, but very powerful if you can master it... Decent sounding, but not spectacular by neve standards... Oh yeah this WAS designed by Rupert Neve.

Neve 8128: This was the first major format console I ever got to work on and it sounded f'in awesome... I highly recomend these boards. Though it runs on Flying Faders I beleve, so you need to get an OLD school comp to run the automation

API Legacy: I've heard two of these before and they sound fabulous and they look amazing. Pretty functional too for automation.

Tident 32: Not horrible sounding, but kind of a pain to work with. Nothing to write home about, but decent for starting studios.

SSL 4000: Not a bad board, pretty functional, easy to use.

SSL 9000XL and K: Wonderfully functional... Impressive looking... Easy to use... But the pre's and compressors are just a bit bland for me.

Things to note if you MUST go with SSL:
George Massenburg has a 9000 in his room at Blackbird... He used to have a Digidesign ICON.
They are a dream to mix on, but to me pretty stale to record with.
VERY easy to use... Every SSL I have used has been easy to understand.

Wow... ask for opinions, and get a book lesson! Thanks! Honest!

The hardest part of this is figuring out the path thru the woods. And when you get info like you just dropped, it's a big help, let me tell you!

We thought to stay with SSL because we've "lived there" all of our performing lives, practically. We got the 900+ by happenstance, and when it got sold, we started where we left off... with SSL. They do build good product, and much of what you say is being repeated to us almost verbatim by other pros.

I'd toyed with the idea of buying an API early on. I've owned Neve's off and on, with other "partner projects."

Here's what I've figured out;

I know that the increased functionality and ease of use of the SSL will help us dramatically. I know that pre's are an issue, although I'm begin told that with Duality, they got better. I know that they "mix" well... But I'm in the music business, and in the end, it'll come down to "sound." Nobody gives a hoot about how it' mixed. They only care about how it sounds in their iPod.

I know I'm probably going to need plenty of outboard pre's for "color," as you've noted, if Duality hasn't gotten any better in that department.

Beyond that, I'm just stumbling thru the forest, trying to find my way. And you guys are a big help. Much thanks!thumbsup

Lexx

[unit7]

I've been teaching at a school for ten years. This year they went from SSL4000 to Duality. Huge improvement! Everything come's out more open and natural. I was sceptical about the low energy thing, but now I don't know. I haven't worked much with the 9000 though. Only project was about nine years ago. Loved that.

I recently bought an analog console myself, and while checking around I decided that I didn't want to go for DAW control. Since this is a tool I hope to use for 10-20 years I'm pretty sure that the design DAW's will change drastically over that period making DAW control systems outdated, so I just didn't want to pay for that. Maybe I'm wrong and Dualitys etc will be updated, but I just didn't want to take the risk.

Good luck with your decision!

[raal]

Originally Posted by Lexinator

I'm leaning toward the Duality at this point, but I can't tell you how many private messages I've gotten telling me to just go ProTools, and forget a console altogether. In a "working studio" is this really even possible?

I know things are changing, but man... if that were true, wouldn't I be seeing that in the studios I carry my sorry butt in and out of, now?

So much to learn... so few years left before senility kicks in...

if all is needed is a PT rig, why would anyone go to a studio when they could stay home and use their DAW? when the guy with his PT LE realizes that you need a good room to make a good recording (unless it's all synth based stuff) he'll probably do the needful, which could mean hiring a real studio, or making his own room which can be an expensive proposition. this applies equally to studios that mix only. you said you're in and out of studios all the time, so you or your clients must have a need for something other than a DAW rig.

it depends what you're after. if you already have a client base, a commercial place might work. but if you make a new facility with hopes of running a profitable business because you have some gear and nice room, it's not going to be easy these days. if it's for your own use and anything else that comes in is gravy, that could be an option too, but then you have to deal with around the clock maintenance, receptionists, hard to please clients, etc.

again it really depends what you're after.

[teo]

Originally Posted by Lexinator

I'm leaning toward the Duality at this point, but I can't tell you how many private messages I've gotten telling me to just go ProTools, and forget a console altogether. In a "working studio" is this really even possible?

I don't think so...it can be a large format analog consolle, a digital desk, an Icon, but I cannot immagine a large session in a professional studio being done with just a keyboard, a trackball and a D-command. Routing, cues, grabbing faders quickly to ride levels to tape, setting up a balance for playback...I wouldn't want to do all that with 8 faders.

Mixing, it would be a pain and not as quick, but I mixed stuff on MacBook with a mouse, it can be done (sort of). Recording anything more than one-mic overdubs...no thanks.

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by teo

I don't think so...it can be a large format analog consolle, a digital desk, an Icon, but I cannot immagine a large session in a professional studio being done with just a keyboard, a trackball and a D-command. Routing, cues, grabbing faders quickly to ride levels to tape, setting up a balance for playback...I wouldn't want to do all that with 8 faders.

Mixing, it would be a pain and not as quick, but I mixed stuff on MacBook with a mouse, it can be done (sort of). Recording anything more than one-mic overdubs...no thanks.

See? That's what I thought too. I could just imagine some "Sound Monkey with a Mac" (No offense, you sound guys!) with his hand fulla mouse, flying all over the place looking like he was trying to have an anuerysm.

ProTools, especially SE sounds like a great solution for the guy at home trying to cut a demo, but for profit, or even professional performance? Nahhhh!

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by raal

if all is needed is a PT rig, why would anyone go to a studio when they could stay home and use their DAW? when the guy with his PT LE realizes that you need a good room to make a good recording (unless it's all synth based stuff) he'll probably do the needful, which could mean hiring a real studio,

That's what I thought, too.

...or making his own room which can be an expensive proposition. this applies equally to studios that mix only. you said you're in and out of studios all the time, so you or your clients must have a need for something other than a DAW rig.

Exactly. I think that part of this, for me as a guitarist and not a dedicated "sound engineer" is that it's actually hard to get your head to wrap around all the things that you have to accomplish, to actually build a good studio. All I ever hear is that "this or that" is obsolete.

it depends what you're after. if you already have a client base, a commercial place might work. but if you make a new facility with hopes of running a profitable business because you have some gear and nice room, it's not going to be easy these days. if you use it for your own use and anything else that comes in is gravy, that could be an option too, but then you have to deal with an around the clock maintenance, receptionists, hard to please clients, etc.

This isn't a "spec" job, at all. I can't even begin to imagine how foolhardy it would be to try and open up a new facility in this economy. (All I can say is that the guys who ARE trying that, have more guts that me!) I have enough work to keep a room busy for at least half a year. I have a University (actually two) who want to send interns, to use the gear in an OJT situation. Their instructors will also lend a hand. (And I'll get a "subsidy" from that.)

Between music, film, and ad work, we'll stay busy. Plus, after 3 decades in the soup, I have a lot of "friends" (imagine that... me...friends... who'd a thought?) that are already asking when we'll be "up." So I'm sure we'll see projects come in.

But it's being built on a tight budget (ths is not, nor will it ever be, a "million dollar build"), so that we don't NEED outside cash to stay up. It's not the build that kills you, it's the cashflow. We'll only need to staff it during outside projects, and we're thinking about that long and hard. Plus, nobody will just walk in. The dogs would eat them... and then the alligators would eat what's left.

again it really depends what you're after.

I'd like 48 channels of magic, a crew that gets along... an IQ large enogh to learn all this stuff without hemmoraging Tylenols, world peace... an end to hunger... and oh yeah...

Thanks for sharing your wisdom with me. It's appreciated.

Lexx

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by 529 Pro Audio

Out of curiosity, have you considered building up an SSL Matrix with outboard preamps, eq's, and dynamics? Probably not any cheaper in the long run, but might be a good way to go if you want an SSL for mixing but non necessarily for the onboard preamps.

We thought about that early on. It gets too expensive for our budget to actually accomplish it.

With the integrated patchbay, it looks like a really slick solution for integrating and using your outboard equipment, and would provide infinite tonal possibilities since you could pair it with API, Neve, etc...

It does sound fetching, don't it?

Though it does have recall and onboard automation, I think it is somewhat limited for those used to mixing on a large console, but might be a worthy option as a hybrid solution and certainly preferable to just going ITB.

And there's the rub. We could learn to work around it, but anyone coming in from outside might have difficulty. And we're gonna "let" it out about 20 weeks a year, for other projects. So we have to find that "happy place" in the middle.

I love "out of the box" ideas! Seriously! Thanks Chris!

[studjo]

Originally Posted by 529 Pro Audio

With the integrated patchbay, it looks like a really slick solution for integrating and using your outboard equipment, and would provide infinite tonal possibilities since you could pair it with API, Neve, etc...

another nice ad for SSL and that patchbay has 16 points IIRC and who on earth thinks 16 points in a patch is enough for anything?

[raal]

Originally Posted by Lexinator

I'd like 48 channels of magic, a crew that gets along... an IQ large enogh to learn all this stuff without hemmoraging Tylenols, world peace... an end to hunger...

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by raal

Perhaps I should make that my signature? (After I fix all the damned typos?)

[PhilE]

Duality.
The reasons you state about the j dropping in value all the time and also the Duality's 'future proof' nature for me make it a winner.
I've been looking at the possibility of putting one in my room and I am convinced it's the only thing out there that I'd consider a genuine step up.

[Lexinator]

Originally Posted by PhilE

Duality.
The reasons you state about the j dropping in value all the time and also the Duality's 'future proof' nature for me make it a winner.
I've been looking at the possibility of putting one in my room and I am convinced it's the only thing out there that I'd consider a genuine step up.

Thanks, Phil. The more I hear, the more I seem to be leaning that way, too.

Now all I gotta do is have a patchbay built...

I'm sure it will make my designer stare at me, but I think it's the right move, so far...

[bforest4]

One more vote for Duality for the ultimate centerpiece that will also get you business. One possibility is to get a 24 fader to save around $100,000 and put that into outboard. If it was my own personal setup, I would go that way, but for outside business, you might lose some clients.

$100,000 for outboard could get you 8 AMS Neve(or BAE to save cash) 1084's, 8 API EQ's and Pre's, API 2500 comp, Retro Sta Level, 2 Retro 176's, UA 1176, 2 Distressor's, Shadow Hills Mastering Comp, GML 8200 EQ and Pre's, Tubetech CL1B, Chandler Curve Bender, Chandler Zener, Neve 2254 comps, Manley Slam and Massive Passive, and more.

If you have the cash, go 48 fader, but either way, I would recommend all the above for outboard for a dream setup that could do anything and impress anyone. I am building towards the above setup, except for now I have a Digidesign 16 fader Icon which is very cool and much more affordable, yet still looks and functions great as a centerpiece. (Duality will be my last upgrade after I get all the outboard above.) I am currently mixing through an SSL Xrack setup with EQ's, Comp's, and Summing which still gives me the SSL sound.

[JASON GARTE]

We went with Duality 48 as our entry into commercial recording studio expansion from our Radio Production business which has always been based around (and we moved into our B anc C rooms) D-Commands and HD rigs...

So far, very very happy with the board.

DUALITY PHOTO STUDIO A

Check it out mix studios website

[HookedOnHardware]

Originally Posted by JASON GARTE

We went with Duality 48 as our entry into commercial recording studio expansion from our Radio Production business which has always been based around (and we moved into our B anc C rooms) D-Commands and HD rigs...

So far, very very happy with the board.

DUALITY PHOTO STUDIO A

Check it out mix studios website

Sorry OP.

I just wanted to say that you have an amazing facility. Not just in gear, it looks great. The website is very very nice too. Good stuff!!

[Daniel Pampuri]

In my opinion I would go for a Neve with automation!
U will save tons of money on EQS, will have an awesome console to mix AND to record...much easier...if the focus will be on music production only...like albuns, bands...MUCH better go for a Neve in my opinion!

The control surfaces will get obsolete and are nothing but just a luxurios mouse!
if u think sonically, Neve is the shit, u will have like, 48 ch of THE BEST PRES AND EQS! and will pay much less than a new SSL! with this money u can buy an old SSL 4000 to mix in another room AND a Neve to track and production....its just MY opinion!

Hope it helps a little!

All the best!

[The Byre]

Originally Posted by Daniel Pampuri

In my opinion I would go for a Neve with automation!
U will save tons of money on EQS, will have an awesome console to mix AND to record...much easier...if the focus will be on music production only...like albuns, bands...MUCH better go for a Neve in my opinion!

The control surfaces will get obsolete and are nothing but just a luxurios mouse!
if u think sonically, Neve is the shit, u will have like, 48 ch of THE BEST PRES AND EQS! and will pay much less than a new SSL! with this money u can buy an old SSL 4000 to mix in another room AND a Neve to track and production....its just MY opinion!

Hope it helps a little!

All the best!

+1

The old way of doing things was to track on a Neve or a better Amek and mix on an SSL.

And if you want dead easy tracking without all the hassle of learning PT or some other DAW, Radar is the ONLY option. It is so easy to use, one of the sessions we had here could be run by the band's drummer!

Yes, the drummer! Imagine that!

As for earning money - don't hold your breath! The most famous residential studio on Planet Earth is selling days for one quarter of their book price.

And their wall chart is still pretty much empty!

(And I believe each bucket on an SSL uses about 800 Watts, so you can ballpark the power consumption from there.)