who likes westlake monitors? AKA "i don't like adams"

[u b k]

had a chance to hear a pair (bbsm 6 i think?) in action hooked up to prism converters. what i heard was the phase coherency and extreme low-mid detail akin to adams and atc's, but an overall vibe that made me happy to be listening to it.

the thing is, while i recognize the extreme utility and accuracy of adams and their ilk for mixing and producing, i've been balking at buying a pair because i just don't enjoy the experience of listening to them. so while they've got the carrot of easier-to-build mixes, i got this clinical sounding stick whacking me over the head saying "this is not fun!"

the westlakes SEEM to offer both, but i don't know as i've never mixed on them. anyone here who can testify to their accuracy and honesty, and to the portability of mixes made on them? does a monitor exist that is enjoyable to listen to, and that reveals what needs to be done effortlessly?

that's my holy grail.


gregoire
del ubik

[Tetness]

You should look into Barefoot MM12. They're expensive, but from what I have been told, they will give you all that you want. Great to listen to. Translate the mix perfectly. Very well made. Bryson amps... I want to get a pair. 11,000.

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by Tetness

You should look into Barefoot MM12. They're expensive, but from what I have been told, they will give you all that you want. Great to listen to. Translate the mix perfectly. Very well made. Bryson amps... I want to get a pair. 11,000.

Are the Bryston amps a seperate purchase?

It sounds by your post that they are included.

[alphajerk]

westlakes give me a MASSIVE headache after a few hours.

[DrDeltaM]

Originally Posted by u b i k

does a monitor exist that is enjoyable to listen to, and that reveals what needs to be done effortlessly?

It's all a matter of taste probably. I like PMC's tho, very natural and detailed. They sell most of the models both as studio version (black finish) and as hifi version (wood finish). Could be what you're after maybe?

[wwittman]

i LOVE the bigger Westlakes.

BBSM 10, 12, or 15

we made all of the Joan Osborne record on BBSM 10's; start to finish.


I find them very easy to work on.
But they DO need a Bryston or other good quality power amp (or two!)

[robmix]

I always liked BBSM8's with Bryston's. Well balanced, great image, and able to crank when you need it. To me they don't translate as well as the ADAM's but they are more enjoyable.

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by u b i k

had a chance to hear a pair (bbsm 6 i think?) in action hooked up to prism converters. what i heard was the phase coherency and extreme low-mid detail akin to adams and atc's, but an overall vibe that made me happy to be listening to it.

the thing is, while i recognize the extreme utility and accuracy of adams and their ilk for mixing and producing, i've been balking at buying a pair because i just don't enjoy the experience of listening to them. so while they've got the carrot of easier-to-build mixes, i got this clinical sounding stick whacking me over the head saying "this is not fun!"

the westlakes SEEM to offer both, but i don't know as i've never mixed on them. anyone here who can testify to their accuracy and honesty, and to the portability of mixes made on them? does a monitor exist that is enjoyable to listen to, and that reveals what needs to be done effortlessly?

that's my holy grail.


gregoire
del ubik

You know i had a pair of the older 6's but could never get used to the mid bump on them.

They were to my ears better for TV mixing than music.

They were power hogs(you have to biamp them)in order to get them sounding right.

The bigger one's were easier to handle.

I briefly heard their newer models and liked what i heard.

[DBarbarulo]

we own a pair of westlake's lc 6.75 ( in the same facility we have pmc, genelec, b&w...)
no joy, just a great tool.

DB

[AnthonyV]

Originally Posted by Tetness

You should look into Barefoot MM12. They're expensive, but from what I have been told, they will give you all that you want. Great to listen to. Translate the mix perfectly. Very well made. Bryson amps... I want to get a pair. 11,000.

Originally Posted by thethrillfactor

Are the Bryston amps a seperate purchase?

It sounds by your post that they are included.

No, the amps are integrated yet removable. They are included in the price.

Still waiting for mine.

[Rick Sutton]

The time that I've spent on Westlakes I was very distracted by a definite hump right at 800 cycles. Not subtle and seemed to color the vocal to the point of making it difficult to figure volume relationships. To be fair, the board, a "Burger King" Neve, also seemed to have some of that sound built in. Glad I was only tracking and not mixing.

[Tetness]

Originally Posted by thethrillfactor

Are the Bryston amps a seperate purchase?

It sounds by your post that they are included.

MiniMain™12 Specifications
Tweeter: 1" soft dome, rear chamber with aerodynamic venting.
Midbass: dual 5" polymer, critically damped alignment, sealed waveguide chambers.
Sub: 12" aluminum, ±1" linear excursion, sealed chamber, active low frequency alignment, Q=0.707, shallow 12bB/octave roll off.
Crossovers: 2kHz minimum phase passive, 110Hz minimum phase active
HF Amplification: Powered by Bryston SST ™ 250W, discreet circuitry, independent power supply.
LF Amplification: Powered by Bryston SST ™ 250W, discreet circuitry, independent power supply.
Frequency Response: ±1.5dB 38Hz-20kHz, -3dB @32Hz.
Minimalist Controls: Input level stepped attenuator from 0dB to -15dB, Baffle Step Compensation Filter™ to adjust low frequency acoustic loading.

Footprint: 17.5"x20"x16.5" (445x4508x419mm)
Weight: 120 lbs (54.5 Kg)

Pricing
Main12 bookmatched pair: $10,250 US

[songisking]

I've been on BBSM-6's since '97 or '98. Being raised on UREI's and JBL's, they were very easy to transition to without missing a beat. They're the smallest format 3-way monitor I've heard that's still as useful right over the meter bridge as when I roll back into the mid-field.
I do agree they aren't going to translate directly to your typical "hole at the x-over point" consumer speakers without some awareness on the operators part of that fact. I use them from tracking through mixing and had them flight-cased for moving from room to room. I do listen to whatever else is in the room during mixdown, but I seldom get any surprises.

[Bob Ross]

Originally Posted by u b i k

does a monitor exist that is enjoyable to listen to, and that reveals what needs to be done effortlessly?

Not quite in the same league as ADAM S3's or Westlake BBSM-10's, but that's the exact combination I found with the $1000/pair Truth Audio TA-1P's: a revealling analytical tool I could trust & whose mixes were reliably transportable, but that was fun as hell to listen to. They're allegedly making a larger 3-way midfield version (TA-3P) that, if it exhibits the same qualities as the smaller TA-1P, should be a real contender.

Of course, they've been promising the TA-3P for 2 or 3 years now...

[Tetness]

I finally did it and got myself some MM12s. Can't wait.

[Jan Folkson]

I wouldn't mix a drink on westlakes...but that's just me.

[Ribbonmicguy]

I tried to like adams as well, but couldn't like them. I chose KH O300D and happy with the decision.

I'd love to listen to some PMC that is famous for the mid detail.

[Igotsoul4u]

I get the same bad vibe you get from Adams when listening to Genelec speakers except i think its worse. I hear your pain.

Originally Posted by u b i k
does a monitor exist that is enjoyable to listen to, and that reveals what needs to be done effortlessly?

The most satisfying speaker experience I have ever had was listening to a pair of Proac studio 100's powered by a Bryston amp. My first comment was that they made me feel "happy." Everything sounded better. That's all I can say. Everything was better in every aspect. It was just pure joy to hear these things. The bass was deep and tight. The highs were super smooth and the mids were nice and flat. i have been dying to get a pair and run them thru the paces but i spent my money on genelecs because I rent my spot out and need to please the masses. We all make mistakes. Anyway. I just feel like I had the exact response that you are looking for when I heard the proacs. Give em a shot. If you don't like them just ship them to me. Haha

[krid]

Originally Posted by Tetness

I finally did it and got myself some MM12s. Can't wait.

Did you had a contact with Thomas Barefoot these last weeks ?

It's been 2 weeks that I am trying to contact him by email without any answer.
I have a pair of Barefoot Micromain27 on order and they should be done by now but I have no news from Thomas Barefoot ...

[lclyman]

Originally Posted by Bob Ross

Not quite in the same league as ADAM S3's or Westlake BBSM-10's, but that's the exact combination I found with the $1000/pair Truth Audio TA-1P's: a revealling analytical tool I could trust & whose mixes were reliably transportable, but that was fun as hell to listen to. They're allegedly making a larger 3-way midfield version (TA-3P) that, if it exhibits the same qualities as the smaller TA-1P, should be a real contender.

Of course, they've been promising the TA-3P for 2 or 3 years now...

I'll second Bob on everything he said about the Truth Audio monitors...I've got the TA-1A's ..the active versions...$1400/pair...killer translation and not fatiguing in the least....!

[natpub]

I was interested that GM went with the ATCs. I hadn't heard much chat about them for a while. I have not heard them myself. Any comments or comparrisons?

[Brad Lunde]

Originally Posted by natpub

I was interested that GM went with the ATCs. I hadn't heard much chat about them for a while. I have not heard them myself. Any comments or comparrisons?

We've been very busy......we've sold a lot, but not to many Gearslutz members. Not sure why that is.

Will you be at AES? Come find me at Audio Underground 800 Aisle and we'll go to the ATC demo room. Its usually one of the most interesting demo rooms of AES. We have some new speakers there this year too.

Brad

[Tetness]

Bought mine used. No contact with thomas, sorry.

[AnthonyV]

Originally Posted by krid

Did you had a contact with Thomas Barefoot these last weeks ?

It's been 2 weeks that I am trying to contact him by email without any answer.
I have a pair of Barefoot Micromain27 on order and they should be done by now but I have no news from Thomas Barefoot ...

Thomas is having medical issues right now. I'll PM you the email he sent out to people a few weeks ago.

[Westlake HR1]

I have a pair of these and simply love them. I have owned many large format mains over the years but these out perform them all. However, you better have high quality electronics because these will show all sins. They are an active 4-way system. A twenty amp dedicated power source is a must have.

SS amps with high damping factors for the dual 2235H bottoms and maybe tube or very high end SS for the horns and mid bass. Boulder, Perreaux, Manley Tube amps drive these beautifully.

Here is a photo of my setup. I use a Westlake HRX crossover as well. I have not found anything that will match the sound quality of this xover (at least on these monitors). With a wide deep soundstage and pinpoint imaging, they sound great at high as well as low SPL's.

Hope this answers your question re the larger format Westlakes. The only one's bigger than these are the SM1 5 way system at 100k (mains) and 13k for the HRX Crossover. You can get HR1's for only 60k new or find a used pair in the 15 to 30k range depending on what components are installed in them. Mine were completely redone 4 years ago with all new components. Forgive me if I offend anyone, but most of the self powered &^%* made today won't hold a candle to these or a good pair of George Augspurger designed JBL's. Lets see if I get smacked for that opinion??

[jdunn]

Excuse another South Park reference, but "Jesus Christ Dude!"

That's one hell of a nice little setup.

I think you should get a nice glass open case for the components though. I don't like how they're stacked on the floor.

This is the "I don't like" thread, right?

BTW, I heard some speakers a few weeks ago that really kicked my ass. They are an audiophile speaker from Denmark called DALI. They have some floorstanding models as well as bookshelf units.

There are two especially interesting things about them, one which also stands out in comparison with the ADAM's.

1) They have a ribbon tweeter (non-folded) that goes up to around 15 khz, and then a soft dome handles the frequencies above that.

2) They use the drivers with wood pulp imbedded in them. I believe they're made by SEAS. Very nice sounding.

The crossovers are all in separate enclosures within the cabinet. They have nice finishes and curves too of course. The ones I was listening to were the DALI Helicon 800's. I expected they would be really expensive, so I was surprised that the retail price was only $6,500 a pair.

These are large floor standing speakers with something like (2) 7" woofers, (1) 5" mid, and the two tweeters, ribbon and soft dome. They're passive, so you'll need a nice power amp. I'm absolutely loving my new Chord SPA 608, but for these I'd get the 1032.

Here's a link.

DALI Loudspeakers

They would be great for both mixing and mastering rooms. I heard them in a very good listening room and was quite impressed.

Acoustic Image

[Westlake HR1]

Thanks

Yes, its a nice system for sure. the reason some gear is stacked on the floor is a lack of space in the rack cabs under the HR1's. Not the clearest picture, but they are full of amps and outboard gear. The two amps under the plasma on the floor (black ones) are recently aquired Boulder 102AE's and I am waiting for the rack ears to get here. The unit with the round windows is a TAD Signature 150 Pre Amp using Telefunken matched and balanced 12AT7 tubes. I love this preamp! I have a black 19" faceplate being made for it as we speak. All will be off the floor then.

So much gear, so little time.

I will check those Danish speakers out.

Thanks

[3rd world order]

Originally Posted by Igotsoul4u

The most satisfying speaker experience I have ever had was listening to a pair of Proac studio 100's powered by a Bryston amp. My first comment was that they made me feel "happy." Everything sounded better. That's all I can say. Everything was better in every aspect. It was just pure joy to hear these things. The bass was deep and tight. The highs were super smooth and the mids were nice and flat.

I found them to be the most boring speakers I ever heard in my life... but it's a "useful" boring... if you don't like "hype" these are definitely cool...

but they come with a WARNING, all the guys I've ever seen use them turned into extreme gear slutz... 20 or so channels of vintage compressors and mic pres.. etc etc... I'm thinking it's not a coincidence.

if you like em with a Bryston 4b, try a Krell KSA-250 or Mark Levinson...

for Pure Joy™ I like Wilson WATT puppies http://wilsonaudio.com/products/wattpuppy/index.html

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by 3rd world order

I found them to be the most boring speakers I ever heard in my life... but it's a "useful" boring... if you don't like "hype" these are definitely cool...

I think the issue with the ProAcs 100's is the ported bass.


The bass doesn't come across as solid.


You definitely would need a sub with a pair.


The bigger Proacs while bigger sounding and more pleasant to the ear probably wouldn't be ideal in a studio.

[Bob Ross]

Originally Posted by 3rd world order

for Pure Joy™ I like Wilson WATT puppies[/url]

Ever heard the Wilson Alexandria X-2? It makes the WATT/Puppy look like a toy in comparison. I heard a pair once, wasn't even in a well treated room, but man, I was ready to renounce my Childless By Choice membership just so I could have a passel of kids and sell them on the black market to afford those X-2's.