Has Lexicon PCM91 Jumped the Shark?

[Riad]

Is the pcm91 still a respected reverb, or is Lexicon not what it used to be?

Who's the 800lb gorilla on the reverb block now?

[C.Lambrechts]

lexicon and TC electronics for me ... others will definately add the likes of Eventide and Kurzweil and maybe even some yamaha's and sony's.

I think most will agree that the first four mentioned without a doubt are 'gorilla's' as you like to call them ... PCM-91 is definately a small female gorilla, The 960 would be the young Male, 480 maybe the older group leader, 224 etc ... council of old wise men.

Plugins ..... hmmmmm ..... chimpansees at best,...... imho of course.

[Riad]

Originally posted by C.Lambrechts
lexicon and TC electronics for me ... others will definately add the likes of Eventide and Kurzweil and maybe even some yamaha's and sony's.

I think most will agree that the first four mentioned without a doubt are 'gorilla's' as you like to call them ... PCM-91 is definately a small female gorilla, The 960 would be the young Male, 480 maybe the older group leader, 224 etc ... council of old wise men.

Plugins ..... hmmmmm ..... chimpansees at best,...... imho of course.

My feeling as well, I've yet to work with a plug-in that really does it for me, although I've heard good things about the TL-Space TDM but I haven't used it.

I'm looking to add a Silverback to my gear...

Thanks for the input

[audiofreak77]

i really liked the pcm91 but i cant stand the operating system on it.

[Verbs R Us]

Have to ditto that operating system. I didn't even look at the manual except to run through presets for the first few weeks.

Used to own a 91 but it's been gone a long time and I haven't had any gearslut pangs to repurchase. I've said this many times before but when you move up the Lex ladder to the 300 you bring along some of the same operating system hassle but the sound fills in where the 91 always seemed to have holes, not the right word but the 300 just sounded smoother and complete.

I agree with the gorilla line. Still like the 480 the best with the classic cart. One thing the 91 brings to the table is lots of presets to mess with but in the end I only had about a dozen that I would use with any regularity.

In retrospect I would probably hold on to the PCM70 and save my dollars to jump the shark.

[Riad]

Originally posted by Verbs R Us
Have to ditto that operating system. I didn't even look at the manual except to run through presets for the first few weeks.

Used to own a 91 but it's been gone a long time and I haven't had any gearslut pangs to repurchase. I've said this many times before but when you move up the Lex ladder to the 300 you bring along some of the same operating system hassle but the sound fills in where the 91 always seemed to have holes, not the right word but the 300 just sounded smoother and complete.

I agree with the gorilla line. Still like the 480 the best with the classic cart. One thing the 91 brings to the table is lots of presets to mess with but in the end I only had about a dozen that I would use with any regularity.

In retrospect I would probably hold on to the PCM70 and save my dollars to jump the shark.

You have to listen to someone with the monikor Verbs R Us... haha... thanks for the feeback, it's appreciated.

[Jules]

"Jumped the shark" is a Austrailian / Kiwi expression isnt it?

What does it mean again?

[De chromium cob]

Originally posted by Jules
"Jumped the shark" is a Austrailian / Kiwi expression isnt it?

What does it mean again?

Jumped the Shark comes from the Happy Daze episode where Fonzie jumped over a shark tank- People use it to mean something (usually a TV show) has peaked and is now in decline....

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by De chromium cob
Jumped the Shark comes from the Happy Daze episode where Fonzie jumped over a shark tank- People use it to mean something has peaked and is now in decline....

Another popular expression from Happy Days is a "Malachi Crunch".

[chadly]

Originally posted by De chromium cob
Jumped the Shark comes from the Happy Daze episode where Fonzie jumped over a shark tank- People use it to mean something (usually a TV show) has peaked and is now in decline....

Completely off topic, but this was also the name of the X-Files episode where the Lone Gunman died. The description completely fits! Their own show had just went off the season before, and the X-Files only had 3 episodes or so left.

[studjo]

I'm a big Lexicon lover, but I hate to say it I don't really like the PCM series except the PCM70. The 480 is wonderful the 300 very useful - but no PCM90/97/80 could give me the same satisfaction.

The PCM70 is another story - doesn't sound that good solo'ed but in the mix it's just perfect.

Jo

[Kestral]

No one wants to talk about the PCM 60?

[studjo]

sorry dunno that old fuuucker

[TER]

Admitted reverb junkie here...

I do like (own 2) the PCM60...no options, just really good sounding verb. I love the Lexicon M300 (only have one)...almost always sounds great on things. I have one of those Sony convolution verbs (DRE S-777) which is amazing on real spaces and plates. The older Sony units are nice, too...R7, MUR201...both get used here regularly. I'm not a huge TC fan. I still like and use the Yamaha REV7...sounds great on electric guitar, hammond...things which need no zing on the top of the verb. The Yamaha PRO-R3 is still the right thing here, too.

They're all different flavors...and as time passes I don't find that any newer boxes do everything so well that I'd get rid of any of them. They all fit the right source, just like microphones.

-tom

[toledo3]

Originally posted by thethrillfactor
Another popular expression from Happy Days is a "Malachi Crunch".

...and who could forget Leather Tuskedero?

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by toledo3
...and who could forget Leather Tuskedero?

thumbsup


I think the other popular term i hear alot when it comes to fixing messed up gear(like computers and tube gear) is "why don't you give it a Fonzie".

[Riad]

Originally posted by TER
Admitted reverb junkie here...

I do like (own 2) the PCM60...no options, just really good sounding verb. I love the Lexicon M300 (only have one)...almost always sounds great on things. I have one of those Sony convolution verbs (DRE S-777) which is amazing on real spaces and plates. The older Sony units are nice, too...R7, MUR201...both get used here regularly. I'm not a huge TC fan. I still like and use the Yamaha REV7...sounds great on electric guitar, hammond...things which need no zing on the top of the verb. The Yamaha PRO-R3 is still the right thing here, too.

They're all different flavors...and as time passes I don't find that any newer boxes do everything so well that I'd get rid of any of them. They all fit the right source, just like microphones.

-tom

Good info, thanks Tom.

How about the Lexicon 960L? if you have one of these, it's already Christmas for you

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by studjo
I'm a big Lexicon lover, but I hate to say it I don't really like the PCM series except the PCM70. The 480 is wonderful the 300 very useful - but no PCM90/97/80 could give me the same satisfaction.

The PCM70 is another story - doesn't sound that good solo'ed but in the mix it's just perfect.

Jo

I would say the one exception is the PCM 80.

I find the reverbs useful because even though it only has one engine devoted for reverb, it has another more powerful one for doing modulation processing.

And we know when it comes to mixing the secret to make certain things sound reverbed is to add modulation to the tails.

The PCM 91 because of its dual reverb engine sounds less like a Lexicon, more like a TC unit.

[Riad]

Originally posted by thethrillfactor
I would say the one exception is the PCM 80.

I find the reverbs useful because even though it only has one engine devoted for reverb, it has another more powerful one for doing modulation processing.

And we know when it comes to mixing the secret to make certain things sound reverbed is to add modulation to the tails.

The PCM 91 because of its dual reverb engine sounds less like a Lexicon, more like a TC unit.

That's very interesting...

[entropy]

Originally posted by Riad
Is the pcm91 still a respected reverb, or is Lexicon not what it used to be?

Who's the 800lb gorilla on the reverb block now?

mmmmm. Strangely enough, I used to refer to gear by Simian values as well. If I remember right, in the UK, a monkey was £100, so we applied similar logic to different bits of kit. £2000 would get you a half descent pre/comp/eq so was referred to as a gorilla, £1500 was a gibbon and a £1000 was a chimp.

[Lexicondonn]

Heeeeeee Fonzyyyyyy I loved that show. I just love things from the past. Ya like my
PCM 91......and the Hooper triplets. Hoa!

Hey I still have those Happy Days stickers on my old Drum kit.

Cool or what ?

Peace










dfegad

[Riad]

I'm just glad I'm not the only one old enough to have actually watched Happy Days.

And these reverb tips are really helping me out! Aaaaaaaaaaeeeeeehhhhhh

[ISedlacek]

I have PCM 91 (which sounds quite good to my ears). Recently I was tempted to get a second hand 480 L but was told by several people that if I consider only reverbs (I am not interested in oher effects) the sound difference is that small that it is not at all worth the (big) extra money

[Riad]

Originally posted by ISedlacek
I have PCM 91 (which sounds quite good to my ears). Recently I was tempted to get a second hand 480 L but was told by several people that if I consider only reverbs (I am not interested in oher effects) the sound difference is that small that it is not at all worth the (big) extra money

What system do you run? How would you compare it to plug-ins?

[studjo]

Ivo listen to a 480 for yourself and decide - people told me that the 300 is half a 480 dfegad - I dunno where they lost their ears

Jo

[5down1up]

would be COOL if my 91 would sound like a 480 ... no way

still it sounds way better compared to the plugs i know

thats how it is :

if u know all reverb units ... pcm91 sucks
if u know just the spx90 ... youll love it

[ISedlacek]

I basically need just one good long universal reverb, nothing very special. I usually use Large Hall, Deep Blue, Small Church or Gothic Hall on PCM-91. PCM-91 sounds very good, smooth and makes a nice illusion of a rich space. I wonder whether you would AB recognise the same solo instrument using the same Large Hall setting on PCM-91 and 480.
As for plugins, they do not sound serious comparing to PCM-91.

[Riad]

I'm a very firm believer in less is more. I utilize reverb, any effects for that matter, very sparingly.

A 'vanilla' outboard reverb may be very good for me.

Some of the other high end processors do more than just reverb, like the Eventide... I know I would spend hours playing with all the setting and not get anything done. ADD?

So perhaps I can find a pcm91 for sale and give it a go... wading toe deep in the reverb pool to get me started

[Leo Goler]

1. Real spaces when apropriate
2. Real plates
3. TC M4000 and up
4. Lex 480, 960

91 isn't quite there.

[JohnMcD]

I use a PCM91 and an Eventide Orville. I've had both for almost a year now and am always surprised at what I find. Prior to this, I worked with a TC System 6000. The System 6000 sounded
somewhat unnatural to me. Yeah, crazy, I know. But it was so damn good, it gave me this uncanny feeling when applying it to mixes. Sometimes the reverb literally dissapeared in the mixes
because it was so natural!

Now the Orville always had this sweet spot. This little "slur" to the reverb when applied to vox. You could minniumize it, but I felt it was always there regardless.

Now to the PCM91. At first I thought it was junk. I really did. I used like two presets after auditioning ten for vocals. Flimsy junk. Then one day, I needed something a little different.
So I found a "multi" preset, and this time, I recorded it onto multiple tracks. I panned them and voila! It has been gold for me since. It just goes to show that sometimes you
just gotta live in it to see how it feels. (An analogy to a mix)

-John