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Fletcher
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22nd July 2004
Old 22nd July 2004
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Liquid Impressions

So Micahel Wagener and I are hanging just outside of beuatiful downtown Nashvegas at WireWorld doing the MOAW workshop. As we were setting up Lynn Fuston dropped by with a Focusrite Liquid Channel... we both wanted to try it, but frankly we were at best apprehensive.

As the workshop rolled along we were getting such amazing sounds we both were loathe to try the Liquid Channel on product, but now the workshop is over... the project is coming out so cool that Michael and I decided we should do an extra day of recording with the band.

So this morning Michael had to be at the studio at 10 because the tent for the WireWorld BBQ was being delivered [our usual start time has been 11... it's 11 now and the band isn't here yet].

So with an hour to kill and a right powerful curiousity we figured this was a good time to give the Liquid Channel a shot. We had a DI guitar track we could use for 're-amping' [which was our source material]. This particular guitar sound is seriously lush with all kinds of depth and harmonic content... we thought it would be a good test.

The first thing we recorded was Michael's usual guitar setup, a Royer R-121 to a Chandler TG-2 pre-amp. Like I said, the sound is seriously lush and full of harmonics. So we threw the 121 into the Liquid Channel on it's "Flat" setting.

Eh. It was kinda 'flat' sounding but that's what they said it was supposed to sound like... so we tried the "3124hot" setting. Now I know API's pretty well, and I know the sound of running an API 3124+ pretty hot... this wasn't it, but hey, we didn't have one sitting next to it for comparison so that's really an invalid test.

We moved on to trying the VT2 setting. I've been living with D.W. Fearn stuff for over a decade now... the one thing it doesn't do is make stuff sound smaller... however, it's emulation did. Turning the "harmonics" on was a big mistake as the tone got smaller still. OK, we didn't have a real Fearn sitting here for comparison... invalid test number two was out of the way.

Next came the "VIPRE"... we had one of those. We were just about to check the two next to each other when we thought about trying a new master clock... so we tried a new master clock. The sound with the new clock seemed a bit bigger and clearer... not enough to write home about nor enough to really convince me that it wasn't the mind playing a trick on me but I thought it sounded bigger and clearer none the less.

So now we recorded the Vipre emulation next to the Vipre. Same level. When we went to match the levels for real [you know... phase reverse one of them, move the fader to you pretty much run out of audio]... we realize that wasn't happening with the current state of affairs. We had this 3ms / 149 sample latency between the Liquid Channel and the Vipre. The latency was only 148 samples running on it's internal clock, and frankly this might actually be good for guitar players as they're often early and could stand to slow down a bit... but abso-****in-lutely un****ing acceptable in any form of a drum application. What? I'm supposed to record a drummer then wait for playback to slide the snare drum to where it's supposed to be in the kit? I don't ****ing think so... but I digress.

So we put the two VIPRE's next to each other. Recorded them both, 100% level matched so no unit had an unfair advantage. Both Michael and I were fully cognizant that we had walked into this prejudiced, both Michael and I were fully cognizant that we needed to give the Liquid Channel every possible opportunity to shine... and I'm pretty sure we did [like putting a better clock on the thing... which I'm pretty sure did help it].

So as we listened to the Liquid Channel VIPRE next to the real VIPRE we both came to the same conclusion... the Liquid Channel VIPRE was 2 dimensional in comparison, and had this kind of annoying upper midrange "gank" to the vowel of the guitar sound. The real VIPRE just sang and rang... it was large, full, and opulent sounding... the Liquid Channel was not.

Now Michael has been jokingly pissed at me for the past few days about ****ing up his vacation by bringing a bunch of toys to his studio... but this time he looked at me kind of seriously, pointed to the Liquid Channel ruffled his brow, and said "3 and a half thousand dollars for that?" then pointed to the Quartet II and said "4 and a half thousand dollars for that? ... you bastard".

I was a bit more disparaging... my reaction was "yeah, it's Liquid alright... ya know that blue shit soup at the bottom of a 'porta-john'... that's the liquid in this channel".

I'm sure this thing is going to appeal to the crap converter crowd that can't hear the difference between good and not good because of their conversion... and it will really appeal to those "POD people" who seem to crave 2 dimensional audio like a narcotic... but for anyone that is into something that sounds like music, this thing is complete shit.

The band's here, and I've devoted 90 minutes of my life to this piece of shit. Gotta go... oh, and as always... YMMV.
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22nd July 2004
Old 22nd July 2004
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Quote:
I was a bit more disparaging... my reaction was "yeah, it's Liquid alright... ya know that blue shit soup at the bottom of a 'porta-john'... that's the liquid in this channel".

I'm sure this thing is going to appeal to the crap converter crowd that can't hear the difference between good and not good because of their conversion... and it will really appeal to those "POD people" who seem to crave 2 dimensional audio like a narcotic... but for anyone that is into something that sounds like music, this thing is complete shit.

The band's here, and I've devoted 90 minutes of my life to this piece of shit. Gotta go... oh, and as always... YMMV.
HAHAHAHAHA! This is the funniest Shit I've read all week!
#3
22nd July 2004
Old 22nd July 2004
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That's an interesting take and the porto-analogy is greatness! OTOH, Joel Hamilton really liked it and is reviewing it soon in tapeop. Ah, disagreements

-Jake
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22nd July 2004
Old 22nd July 2004
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Re: Liquid Impressions

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
The latency was only 148 samples running on it's internal clock, and frankly this might actually be good for guitar players as they're often early and could stand to slow down a bit...
now THAT was funny!
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Very interesting indeed.

Thanks for the detailed post!
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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damn...

I had a feeling it was going to turn out like this...

Oh well.....Ill pick some up on EBay in a year or so for 40%...
They DO have cool LEDs...


-S0nguy
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#7
23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Response to Fletcher

Fletcher,
No offense to your "Glowing" review
of the Liquid Channel whic took about
3 1/2 years to develop and only 90 minutes to destroy, not a bad ratio. I noticed thought that you are not listed as a Focusrite dealer and will probably have a numner of requests from potential clients inquiring about LC and of course they will get to hear your "unbiased" in depth detailed review and be able to make a proper judgement call. Works for me.
(BTW I am a focusrite dealer out of the country
so it does not affect my business in any way.)

Regards
GAK
#8
23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Re: Liquid Impressions

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
... but this time he looked at me kind of seriously, pointed to the Liquid Channel ruffled his brow, and said "3 and a half thousand dollars for that?" then pointed to the Quartet II and said "4 and a half thousand dollars for that? ... you bastard".
I don't getcha on this one, Fletch.

Are you saying Michael was saying the Quartet II was overpriced?

Or are you being your usual convoluted self (no pun intended, per the LC), and saying Michael was saying the Quartet was in the same cost ballpark, yet blew away the LC (for versatility and musicality)?

I am assuming my second interpretation of Fletcherspeak (TM) is correct until I hear otherwise.


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#9
23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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I still wanna try this thing out myself some day although I must admit that the general posts I've read about it make me less 'hot' for it then I was when this thing was first announced.

FWIW, I think the whole idea of comparing the original stuff to the emulated stuff is wrong to start with.

Well, in a way at least ... it's right because it states that it emulates all those fine things .... it's wrong because everyone knows the whole emulation thing is just marketing hype.

Been that way with plugins / softs since the very start .... I only recently compared what was supposed to be the impulse responses for the lexicon 960 for altiverb with the real machine. Almost dfegad my pants laughin when I did.

Anyhow, the real and only question imho should be wether the things / presets / settings actually sound good or not. I mean, so what if it doesn't sound API / Urei / Chandler / or whatever ... does the compressor hold up in the real world or is it unusable ?

Sure , a LA2A is a cool compressor but I wouldn't even think of using it on certain things. The amek 9098 dual compressor maybe sucks on a lot of things but it still beats the compressing hell out of most plugins and is quite usable in the real world. In the same way I've found a 'real deal' to be often useless where the 'emulator' did exactly the thing I wanted on that particular track at that particular point in time.

All is relative .... but there's good toys and bad toys .... ones you can use and ones you would never ever use ...... so which one is this .... if one would forget about the names on the presets ? ..... does it hold up with all the possibilities it offers or does it still suck ?
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Fletcher
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Natpub- I was quoting Michael... his meaning was that he was digging the Q-II but not digging the LC. I thought it was an amusing quote so I included it. I am certainly not comparing one to the other, but I was amused by the quote.

GAK-- we're not a Focusrite dealer by choice. We don't pimp a lot of things by choice. I consider Phil Dudderidge a friend, we have dinner when he's in town, we don't deal the stuff made by his company because no one at M-A thinks it's very good... in other words there is nothing personal here, this a purely professional set of observations.

In all honesty, I take serious offense to your intimation that my, or Michael Wagener's observations were anything but professional... not that you would give a shit that I take offense to your intimation, however, if you notice I do post with my name and professional affiliation rather than the anonymous fashion, in which you have posted I would say my refute of your inference holds far greater credibility.
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher
Natpub- I was quoting Michael... his meaning was that he was digging the Q-II but not digging the LC. I thought it was an amusing quote so I included it. I am certainly not comparing one to the other, but I was amused by the quote.
Gotcha! Kidding ya on the rest, of course

As you already know, I have a serious case of QII lust!
#12
23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Re: Re: Liquid Impressions

Quote:
Originally posted by natpub
I don't getcha on this one, Fletch.

Are you saying Michael was saying the Quartet II was overpriced?

Or are you being your usual convoluted self (no pun intended, per the LC), and saying Michael was saying the Quartet was in the same cost ballpark, yet blew away the LC (for versatility and musicality)?

I am assuming my second interpretation of Fletcherspeak (TM) is correct until I hear otherwise.


--KT
KT
The thought behind this was that I'd rather pay $4,500 for one great mic pre/comp/eq combo than $3,500 for a unit with a whole bunch of "not so great sounding" plug-ins. I was checking out the Quartett II on a whole variety of sources during the course of the MOAW recording session, and I have to say I am extremely impressed with that unit. We could easily make it sound great on every source we tried it on. Believe me, I didn't want to like it, because the last thing I need is spending 4.5K on another piece of gear right now (the above mentioned vacation $$), but it just blew my mind. As did the new GreatRiver EQ and the Josephson 22 mics on toms.

Chris

On our search for a certain sound in this particular situation, I would have not stopped searching after hearing the LC, no matter what the preset name said. There was a flatness to the sound which reminded me of the difference between the POD versus a real tube amp, it might sound ok, but you have this uneasy feeling that something is missing and then you hear it directly compared to the real thing. My biggest problem with the LC was the latency of about 3ms (148 samples @ 48K) for an analog in - analog out path, very hard to deal with on a snare mic for instance.
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Re: Re: Re: Liquid Impressions

Quote:
Originally posted by mwagener
KT
The thought behind this was that I'd rather pay $4,500 for one great mic pre/comp/eq combo than $3,500 for a unit with a whole bunch of "not so great sounding" plug-ins. I was checking out the Quartett II on a whole variety of sources during the course of the MOAW recording session, and I have to say I am extremely impressed with that unit. We could easily make it sound great on every source we tried it on. Believe me, I didn't want to like it, because the last thing I need is spending 4.5K on another piece of gear right now (the above mentioned vacation $$), but it just blew my mind. As did the new GreatRiver EQ and the Josephson 22 mics on toms.
Thanks Michael, you confirmed my understanding of the exchange, and reaffirmed my lust for a QII!!
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Re: Liquid Impressions

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher

We moved on to trying the VT2 setting. I've been living with D.W. Fearn stuff for over a decade now... the one thing it doesn't do is make stuff sound smaller... however, it's emulation did. Turning the "harmonics" on was a big mistake as the tone got smaller still. OK, we didn't have a real Fearn sitting here for comparison... invalid test number two was out of the way.
It is hard to truly replicate any gear. Beside electronic structure, all kind of effects like used transformers etc has to be duplicated into a model to be accurate. And that is not easy to do. grudge

I have been working on a Dim D replica and am closing in. And no transformers in it beside the power transformer... But it took a lot of time to rebuild it. When I saw the large list of replicated gear, I knew every setting/ model can't be replicated with great detail. It just takes too much time.

It is cool for a small studio to have a box that is near the original set of compressors/preamps. But I am not waiting for a machine that does not do it right. I'd rather buy a lot of the real machines....

Harrie
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Re: Re: Liquid Impressions

Quote:
Originally posted by Froombosch
It is cool for a small studio to have a box that is near the original set of compressors/preamps.
Not if you're into serious recording. I'd say forget about the LC and get the TG-2 and another cleaner preamp and for the same price you can do some serious recording.

Disclaimer: I haven't heart the LC, but I trust MW's and Fletchers review. If you ever heard the platinum focusrite stuff, you'll understand the 2D-ness that comes from those units...

Greetings,
Dirk
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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I've been reading a lot of user reviews on the liquid channel, and this is the first one that mentioned the latency issue! With everyone focusing on the sound, I keep hearing it is "almost" like the originals, sounds great, etc. To me, it seemed very cool (going solely from what everyone was saying about it). A decent sounding, somewhat versatile pre for $3.5k.

But the latency issue-- wow. Who would want to deal with a delay in your preamp? I thought the digital revolution was supposed to solve all our problems and make things super easy and fast.... Instead we have a whole new set of problems to think about that never had to cross our minds before.

This is the first really PRACTICAL review I have seen so far.
Thanks Fletcher! Thanks Michael!

Todd
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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GAK

If you are representing a UK dealer with the same initials as your "nickname" do me courtesy of listing the other pro audio brands you hold in stock ( emphasis on hold in stock ) and what your demo policies are, if you are not ignore this post.

Jam
#18
23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Interesting repport, thanks !
Just a few questions to Fletcher :

Did you where monitoring analog ?
Does the HW virpre were converted to digital also ? using wich converter ?

I'm trying to see if the liquid channel were not with a ADDA penalty (wich traduce by more flatness), or if the flatness indeed comes from the gear itself.

Also, it worth mentionning that important part of the latency comes from the ADDA process.


Salvator
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jam
GAK

If you are representing a UK dealer with the same initials as your "nickname" do me courtesy of listing the other pro audio brands you hold in stock ( emphasis on hold in stock ) and what your demo policies are, if you are not ignore this post.

Jam


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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by ToddP

But the latency issue-- wow. Who would want to deal with a delay in your preamp? I thought the digital revolution was supposed to solve all our problems and make things super easy and fast.... Instead we have a whole new set of problems to think about that never had to cross our minds before.
very DSP based unit has some soprt of small delay. You need some time to sample the analog and convert it to digital and visa versa. Also DSP processing needs time. Al digital effect processors have it and you have to correct it in time when you use it in parallel with the original signal. At 96 k it will be 2 times faster...


#21
23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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#1 Any box that tries to be all things to all people fails to be one thing the anyone.

#2 Any box that 'emulates' is full of hot air, unless you are all digital and in Pod-land, in which case ... it all sounds like shit compared to real audio anyway.

#3 Focusrite gear is mostly crap, or overpriced mid-fi .. only the old Blue line is interesting to me, and not very interesting at that.



from their website:

"With Focusrite’s Liquid technology currently sending tidal waves throughout the audio world a large crowd was ensured (although doubtless the night-long free bar and stylish pan-oriental nibbles did little to keep folks away…) { mmm... do ya think?}


Recording luminaries present included producers such as Robin Millar (Big Country, Tom Robinson, The Style Council, The Christians), Mike Nielson (Jamiroquai, Craig David, Underworld), Pip Williams (Status Quo, Moody Blues, Uriah Heep) Steve Levine (Culture Club, Beach Boys, Gary Moore), and Ali Staton (Daniel Bedingfield, Jesus Jones, Stereo MCs) to name but a few.

{yup ... "luminaries" every one ...}


Following the obligatory grazing, imbibing and networking, Focusrite’s Rob Jones took The Liquid Channel through its paces, finishing with a full audio demo and a Q and A session which even satisfied those with a thirst for the most arcane technical details. With Jo Dudderidge (son of Phil) playing guitar and singing in front of a BLUE Bottle mic in the Studio 1 control room, the enormous versatility of mic-pre and compressor replicas within The Liquid Channel were ably explored, peppered with ‘favourite device’ requests from the assembled masses."


And they compared the presets to ???
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23rd July 2004
Old 23rd July 2004
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I've got a Liquid channel today here for testing for a week...

As for now... I'm not impressed!

Today I only tested pre/comp presets of gear that I own in my studio.. and .. NOT EVEN CLOSE!

Maybe it emulates (not so well) the compression curves but what's missing is the sound, the colors, the nuances of emulated gear!

I think POD did much better for guitars...

Tomorrow I'll try it with some acoustic gtrs...

Ciao!

Michele
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#23
24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by salvator
Interesting repport, thanks !
Just a few questions to Fletcher :
OK

Quote:
Did you where monitoring analog ?
Do you know another way to monitor?

I listen to the car stereo in the analog domain. I listen to my studio monitors in the analog domain. In fact, I can't hear binary code so I reckon I hear all music in the analog domain.

How do you listen to music?

Quote:
Does the HW virpre were converted to digital also ? using wich converter ?
I really have no idea what the fukk that sentence was allegedly intended to mean... but if you were asking how the real "Vipre" was converted, it was through one of Michael's "Euphonix" converters [or so I would assume as we listened to both units as returns from his Euphonix R-1].

If you're asking if we were listening to an analog Vipre vs. the "Liquid Channel" digital mic pre? The answer is no. Both the real and the silicone Vipre's had to go through Michael's converters as everything he records is in the digital domain.

Quote:
I'm trying to see if the liquid channel were not with a ADDA penalty (wich traduce by more flatness), or if the flatness indeed comes from the gear itself.
Well, yes and no.

The "Liquid Channel" had it's A/D on the front of it, both shared the same D/A. That would say that the "repro" path was the same, but the A/D path was different. I suppose we could have run into the "Liquid Channel" digitally, through the same converters as were used to bring the real "Vipre" to the party... but somehow I don't see how using a different pre-amp and known excellent converter set would have helped. I mean, should we have used the real Vipre through the Euphonix converters to go into the Liquid Channel? Kinda would have defeated the purpose... at least it seems that way to me.

Quote:
Also, it worth mentionning that important part of the latency comes from the ADDA process.
Not 148-149 samples.

That's totally fukking unacceptable. Even MOTU shit has less latency delay than that.

You find me some other pre/converter set with 148-149 [3ms] delay and I'll show you a piece of flaming shit.

OUTSTANDING!!!
#24
24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
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Quote:
Originally posted by lucey
#1 Any box that tries to be all things to all people fails to be one thing the anyone.

#2 Any box that 'emulates' is full of hot air, unless you are all digital and in Pod-land, in which case ... it all sounds like shit compared to real audio anyway.

#3 Focusrite gear is mostly crap, or overpriced mid-fi .. only the old Blue line is interesting to me, and not very interesting at that.



What about the Distressor and the Trakker?

The ISA 215 and the Blue 230 when used in the right context are uncomparable.
Jam
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24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
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Mr Geffel

I might have been being a bit obtuse I know guitar amp and keyboard center quite well and although they are good regular music store I wouldn't define them as a pro audio dealer in the same sense as Mercenary. So I thought is was a tad silly of GAK if he/she is from guitar amp and keyboard center to dismiss Fletcher's well thought out reasonably scientific post with "your not a dealer" and "it took a long time to develop" when if you look at the the guitar amp and keyboard center website you realise they probably spend more time A/Bing Mackie vs Alesis than Cransong vs Manley.

Jam
#26
24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
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Fletcher,

Sure my english is rather poor. But you are quite rude and impolite in your response.

The liquid channel is an interesting technologgy.
I didn't had an opportunity to try one by myself, so I'm documentating and asking questions that can help me to rate this gear more precisely.

Also, i said important part of the 148 samples comes from the ADA process. The key word is "important". The convolution itself induce delay depending on how the filter are implemented (it CAN be near zero).

But now that I have a better understanding on the config in wich you tried the LC. And it seem that the 148 samples were only due to the convolution since the vipre too had been converted. (I think latency in differnet AD's remain "quite" similar, in the range of 1 ms or so)

I didn't know if you were converting ADDA the vipre, or if you were monitoring straight the analog chain.

BTW ; my TC 6000 converters have 1.44ms delay for AD & 1.56ms delay for DA. That's make excaclty 3 ms for the whole loop @ 44.1khz...

Anyway thanks for you response and thanks for the interesting repport.
I think I'll pass on this one :-)

Salvator
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#27
24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
  #27
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Many sounds out of one box

Sorry about Fletcher, he really is a nice chap. He is just very direct and does not try to be eligent. He just tells it like it is. (This causes you to get hit between the eyes for the nuts and bolts).

In trying out the LC myself, I can say it gives you a lot of different sounds out of the one unit. This makes it more verstile than any other mic pre box. However with my test, it does not sound the same as the real thing, but it is a good copy. So if you want the real API sound, call Mercenary Audio and order it. If you want the flexibility to get different sounds, and your budget is limited, the LC may be a good option.
Fletcher
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#28
24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
  #28
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Re: Many sounds out of one box

Quote:
Originally posted by Revelation
If you want the flexibility to get different sounds, and your budget is limited, the LC may be a good option.
Ahhhh, different sounds? Yeah, much in the way that Behringer pre's sound different from Alesis pre's, which sound different from Mackie pre's... which sound different from Mackie pre's when the console has a mix going through it than it did when the pre's were auditioned accapella.

I didn't find the LC to be a great sounding pre(s) in any form, they're very flat and two dimensional sounding with an upper midrange vowel to the sound that I find musically unpleasant, or at least on the sound on which we tried the LC the midrange "gank" was musically unpleasant. This "vowel" from the LC was universal through all of the settings/"emulations" we tried. More than the "emulations" being off, the overall lack of depth and dimension to the audio is my main problem with the unit.

While I haven't made a record with Berhringer pre's I'm sure it's been done, done well, and done sucessfully. That said, I'm sure the LC could be used to make a record that was done well, and done sucessfully. I remember back in like '96 [maybe '97] on rec.audio.pro how many times I was admonished for disrespecting the Tascam M-3500 console... I mean that was the board that made "The Macarena" the huge hit that it was and who the fukk was I to disparage it.

Yes, the LC will move music through a wire... but for $3k or whatever the thing costs, I would expect it to sound better than it does. Take away the emulations thing and at the end of the day WhaddaWeGot? A mediocre pre attached to some other digital compression emulation functions with a digital equalizer. Great. No, we didn't touch on the digital compression thing... that's for somebody else to examine.

salvator; my bad on not noticing you were from Paris when I responded to your post. Interesting that you have 3ms of latency from input signal to output signal with your t.c. 6000. I have only seen that box used for reverb and such, so I'm guessing that like the KSP-8, it can be used as an A/D-D/A converter? 3ms seems a lot to me in terms of latency. In this particular case you had 3ms worth of latency over and above whatever latency occurs when you go into and out of an R-1.

We did come out of the LC analog to record it's signal to the Euphonix R-1 [nice sounding recorder BTW] as if we were recording in a project studio environment or to an analog deck. The latency issue is still a very real issue.

Unless you plan on recording every track through one of these things (which would be pretty unlikely if you were recording a full on basics session) there is no way I know of to correct this kind of latency if recording in the analog domain... the phase issues alone will be a rather serious problem.

It may have taken 3 1/2 years to develop to this point, but it's got a good way to go. I'm sure one day there will be pretty close to the requisite computing power to indeed be able to "sample" the character of a unit... hell they figured out how to clone sheep, why not mic-pre's... I would think sheep to be a more complex machine than a mic-pre, I guess it's just a question of R&D budget.

If they had labeled the pre's as "1", "2", "3", "4" without referencing what they were supposed to be "emulating" it still wouldn't have worked for me as a unit.

As always, YMMV
#29
24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
  #29
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Re: Liquid Impressions

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletcher ...but for anyone that is into something that sounds like music, this thing is complete shit.
This is why I dig Fletcher.
#30
24th July 2004
Old 24th July 2004
  #30
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...just to clarify:

the LC was hooked up analog in and out and used as an analog unit to compare it to the VIPRE. Both the VIPRE and the LC were converted using the Euphonix A/MADI converter (my favorite A/D converter at this time)
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