How will the new SSL AWS affect 'Big' studios?

[Wiggy Neve Slut]

Just a thought i had kicking around today.

With SSL's new 'baby K' coming out soon, how will this affec the larger studios that rely on booking time to mix projects on thier SSL's?

This i guess is also heightened further given that most if not 99% of mixing done in these studios is PT or DAW based... its been a LONG time since i have heard of regular 2" only mixing. So its removing the need for people to go to the 'sound Hotels' or bigger studios with large SSL's to get that 'sound' and mixbuss summing which they are famed for.

Also its now financially within the grasp of a LOT more people so this will add another totally new twist to the arguement. I imagine a lot of RAP/RNB (i hate that genre term!grudge ) producers/artists would be the prime market for the SSL as it will allow many of thier tracks to be summed inside the PT/DAW and then sent out tot he analogue domain for further mixing.

Discuss.. i am interested perhaps we can predict the future impact of this product as im sure its going to turn and change things around in a big way , much more so than the ICON.

Cheers
Wiggy

[C.Lambrechts]

I doubt that. I don't think big rooms will 'suffer' at all under this product simply because it's not a mixing tool imho. You can't mix with it. It's a tracking tool, maybe a summing tool , but not a mixing tool. there's no automation on it. People who go into rooms with big consoles gon int there to MIX on those consoles.

As for tracking, even there I doubt it will offer much competition. The bigger rooms usually go together with good recording spaces.

I see this baby ssl find it's way into project studios who want the ssl tag. For some it will work for sure. People who know better will go to the bigger desks.


Oh right, it's a controller ... doh ... forgot that for a second. Well yes I suppose you could kinda mix on it too then. but you can mix with just a mouse too.

[robdarling]

An SSL without a compressor on every channel is just an ok mixer with ok eq's.

[obostic]

Originally posted by robdarling
An SSL without a compressor on every channel is just an ok mixer with ok eq's.

My guess is when SSL figure out that they screwed up on this one, maybe they'll add the compressor and automation to every channel with a revision.

Then, I would love to have one for my room.

My prediction is stay tuned for a fire sale on these console in the furture. dfegad

[Jam]

I don't think the 900 is aimed at or will compete with big tracking rooms. But If you think about writers/producers with a HD rig who already have some nice outboard I think it makes sense. I guess I'm thinking about the kind of people that may own a Dangerous Two bus etc. Now wether that market will pay this price is a different question but one that I'm mighty interested in.

[atticus]

I think that this Baby SSL's biggest competition will be all of the used 4000's that are on the market right now. Having the controller onboard is nice and all but you could just buy any one of the controllers on the market and pair it up with a refurb'd SSL for close to the same price. It might cost a bit more, but you'd get more functionality. Just my opinion.

[crypticglobe]

SSL with no total recall, no automation, no compressors on every channel at 87K = WAY overpriced. I don't think it's gonna float at all...

[7rojo7]

I liked the Tascam 24fader with transport section + a MartinSound Monitor section, 24 channels of Millennia with DCinput option a Smart compressor or 2, Speck eq's would be OK but there are alot of eq's in the box, and I could still get a 2buss thingy with the money left over if I wanted one.
Whose screen do I have to look at? Both, all 3 or 4. To me it's not enough of anything and too much of what I don't need.
I just recently got the console away from in front of me and the listeng experience is just wonderful. I can't wait to get rid of the control24 and have a real lo mass creating situation. faderbank and transport, midi, alpha-num and trackball, all big boxes in the back or to the sides or in a different room and leave the space for sound.

[juniorhifikit]

Originally posted by atticus
I think that this Baby SSL's biggest competition will be all of the used 4000's that are on the market right now. Having the controller onboard is nice and all but you could just buy any one of the controllers on the market and pair it up with a refurb'd SSL for close to the same price. It might cost a bit more, but you'd get more functionality. Just my opinion.

Agreed.

[shipshape]

I really hope SSL do a revised version of this board.......and quick...or else they are gonna lose the market they are trying to get at with this new console ...'cos I know a lot of people who are on the verge of making a leap into some kind of bigger set-up...and the SSL 900 should be a no brainer instead of a total compromise with a silly price tag.
There is no way in it's current form that the 900 is gonna make a dent in the larger studios mixing time..at least yet .

[djui5]

Originally posted by crypticglobe
SSL with no total recall, no automation, no compressors on every channel at 87K = WAY overpriced. I don't think it's gonna float at all...

If it's a controller then recall would be as simple as opening a sesison correct?


I don't think this will affect the big room's either. There's a big difference in the clientel that would book a large room at Hit Factory or a similar place than a client that would book a mid sized room where one of these would be placed...

It's only has 24 faders......

[thethrillfactor]

It won't affect them at all.

The reason most people mix in the big studios is not just the bigger board, but its for the better acoustics/monitoring.

Most guys who will buy the SSL 900 are producers who have their own project studios and want to bring some freelance mix heavy hitters to their joints to mix(the guys who prefer to mix on a console than in PT itself).

The other guys will probably be the composer types..

Those guys do everything in PT and just use a couple of outboard pieces.

By the way, Guitar Center will be carrying them.

As of next month you will be able to go by a Guitar Center and try it out.

[shipshape]

"If it's a controller then recall would be as simple as opening a sesison correct?"

Unfortunately not correct..........it will bring back the faders yes , but no totall recall...therefore no ability to get your eq back. !!!!!!! big mistake.

[The MPCist]

If there's a revision and with comp/limiters on each track and automation, I'll buy one.

Like it is now, nope.

[chrisso]

I was just looking at a recognised SSL resale dealers site.
Early consoles (with computer) are down to $35,000.
These desks are sold as 'working' and are not dogs, although they are OLD and represent the bottom run of the SSL ladder.
I guess the only other consideration regarding 'baby k' vs 4000, is the space the latter would require. Not in my front bedroom!

[BrianT]

Originally posted by robdarling
An SSL without a compressor on every channel is just an ok mixer with ok eq's.

So true, so true.

[BrianT]

The point about automation and recall is simple. The whole reason for getting a 900 would be it's analog electronics, right? I seriously doubt anyone would buy it as a only DAW controller and not pass audio through it.

And so, anything you do with the analog electronics is either a one time shot, or else you "set-and-forget" a number of channels that always do the same thing. Like a summing bus. Either way, without recall or automation (which is a form of recall, even if snapshot), the utility of the analog electronics is compromised when compared to a "real" SSL. Use the channels and EQ on a mix? Not if you need to recall it. "Total Recall" of analog electronics is much of what made SSL.

Add in the lavish inclusion of two compressors (at least in my understanding), and I cannot imagine why you wouldn't spend the $$$ on some truly great sounding analog gear instead. Which BTW, with the right choices would hold or actually increase it's value.

[Wiggy Neve Slut]

I think with the addition of channel dynamics, TR and the ability to add extra fader packs it would be a real deal breaker but as is.. its a bit of an anchor. Give me a 4000e, which i have seen for as low as 20K UKpounds for a 4048e w/o TR and lotsa tasty outboard to boot with the rest of the $$$. Maintenance would be more but ultimately that would be offset by the functionality.

Cheers
Wiggy

[Jules]

I walked past it MANY times at the AES in Berlin last weekend and I do think they are onto something with it. The idea that folks could have an 'SSL' at home or in a project studio I think WILL apeal to many folks and I have to admit to a twinge of desire for it myself. There was something very cool about the way it looked...

I agree with most of the 'it needs' posts above...

Lets see what happens with it...

[jlotto]

SSL should have just made a 24 channel summing box w/ 2buss comp for about $25k-$35k. they would sell boatloads!

[blackcatdigi]

Originally posted by jlotto
SSL should have just made a 24 channel summing box w/ 2buss comp for about $25k-$35k. they would sell boatloads!

Ya think???

I can't imagine why anyone would pay that kind of money for a comp and summing bus... $25-$35k?!!! Cause it says SSL?

That's a bit high for the device you propose. $5k, maybe...

For that kind of money you can buy (2)D2Bs (32ch summing), AND a SSL comp, AND 33609 comp, AND Varimu comp, AND Smart comp, AND STC8 comp, etc...

BTW, I agree with all the gripes listed.

IMHO, they missed the mark, and it is a fairly useless design. Maybe it's perfect for somebody.

And I'm sure they'll sell a few just on the name.

[jlotto]

Originally posted by blackcatdigi
Ya think???

I can't imagine why anyone would pay that kind of money for a comp and summing bus... $25-$35k?!!! Cause it says SSL?

My music (rap/r&b) relies on that SSL sound, just not the name. I'm spending $ off budgets to mix at Sony, Hit Factory, Right Track, Quad, etc all because of SSL 9000J/K or 4000. Do alot in PT already. If I could just get that SSL touch at my spot, which built by FM and has nice custom mains, that I get at those other spots alot of those budget $ could be directed my way or kept in pocket.

Not sure if execs and artists r ready to hear "I got a Dangerous 2 bus and an SSL comp, we can mix here as opposed to Quad."

If aws 900 is $80k- summing and 2bus comp should fall in around $25k-$30k

[blackcatdigi]

Gotcha.

Labels may not be ready...

Given that, you are one of the folks this console may very well benefit.

Is it not a close call vs. a 4k, though?

[shipshape]

""if there's a revision and with comp/limiters on each track and automation, I'll buy one.""

That revision has been out a while now....and its called a SSL K.
I bet there will be no revisions to the 900 for a looong time.

[dim light]

[IMG]******//www.solid-state-logic.com/news/pr/0404/04041l.jpg[/IMG]

[Ruairi]

I got the demo at the AES and it seems like a really strange kinda half baked product to me. First off I though the DAW integration was actually quite good, if it was just an SSL DAW controller I'd be quite interested. The monitor section looked quite comprehensive. I just kept coming back to the same thing - what am I going to do with 24 channels of non recallable eq and faders with no automation. The analogue end just seems like a very expensive summing box to me.

From what I saw at the AES I'd rather a D-Control, some Dangerous summing and a couple of outboard eqs and comps. Just my 2 cents,

cheers,
Ruairi

[Shaman]

Originally posted by Ruairi


From what I saw at the AES I'd rather a D-Control, some Dangerous summing and a couple of outboard eqs and comps. Just my 2 cents,

Same thoughts here !

[C.Lambrechts]

seeing the picture reminds me of a cool thing I saw at the stand. The armrest is big (deep) enough to hold a full size bluetooth keyboard for example and a bluetooth mouse.

Cool looking mousepad

[thethrillfactor]

Originally posted by obostic
My guess is when SSL figure out that they screwed up on this one, maybe they'll add the compressor and automation to every channel with a revision.

Then, I would love to have one for my room.

My prediction is stay tuned for a fire sale on these console in the furture. dfegad

So you are saying if they decided to add on a comp section at lets say $750-$1k a channel (which would add another $20K to the price) and TR and moving faders section(which adds another $10-15K), the total for the upgrades would push it up to the $150K range.


So how many guys here who are complaining are ready to dish out this kinda dough?

I think everybody here has been spoiled by the whole computer generation mixing ITB thing.

To build consoles(especially good ones for mixing) is still a very expensive proposition.

For example, someone said that it has ok EQs, how many analog consoles do you know that have surgical EQ's with switchable filters on the hi's and low's? With switchable EQ curves?


Answer is not many.

The only ones i know of are the 9000J and K.

And people balk at the price, the last mid sized analog console that was even comparable to this was the Amek Media 5.1 and that was at least $50K.

I know its been a while guys, but there is a reason why the mid size console like the dinosaur has all but disappeared.

[The MPCist]

Originally posted by shipshape
""if there's a revision and with comp/limiters on each track and automation, I'll buy one.""

That revision has been out a while now....and its called a SSL K.
I bet there will be no revisions to the 900 for a looong time.

That isn't a 'revision'. What I'm saying here is if they put out a revision of this 'new 900 thing' with comp/limiters with Recall, I would buy it.

I wasn't talking about their other consoles here.