>> Test AD / DA converter whit your HELP <<
SoniA
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#1
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #1
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>> Test AD / DA converter whit your HELP <<

Well, I have read many 3Ds about converter and I think that it's a very useful to have a 3D with tests to compare different converters. I start this 3D with this purpose... Come on guys, with your help we can make a good archive for the community, let's take only 5 minutes of time.

Run the original wave through your converter, without any process, and send it back.

44.1Khz / 24bit 80bps

It would be interesting to have:
- Apogee Rosetta 200
- Lavry Blue AD / DA
- UA2192
- Prism
- Lynx
- etc.

This can help to choose the gear
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here RME ADI-2.


Thanks
#2
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #2
hm.. if I own a Weiss ADC, and clock it with a Bigben, DA with a RME mutliface...

how do you wanna check the reality?
SoniA
Thread Starter
#3
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #3
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Thread Starter
I believe that any setup is interesting, for the community
#4
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #4
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wildpark's Avatar
 

grüzi

DA with a RME mutliface...

i never heard that craze combination you might post the ad rme signal that we can hear what

a weiss signal will be then .

gruss patrick
SoniA
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#5
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #5
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As these... I've read more and more post on this forum but... Why don't to make a little test in five minutes instead write and write criticisms ?
This isn't a competition or comparison but it would like to be something of useful for everybody...
DAH
#6
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #6
DAH
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DAH's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoniA View Post
Well, I have read many 3Ds about converter and I think that it's a very useful to have a 3D with tests to compare different converters. I start this 3D with this purpose... Come on guys, with your help we can make a good archive for the community, let's take only 5 minutes of time.

Run the original wave through your converter, without any process, and send it back.

44.1Khz / 24bit 80bps

It would be interesting to have:
- Apogee Rosetta 200
- Lavry Blue AD / DA
- Prism
- Lynx
- etc.

This can help to choose the gear
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here RME ADI-2.


Thanks
It`s kinda senseless as the file prior to AD conversion has to be played back through a DAC . Considering the fact AD-DA sets are individual for every forum user, this test makes NO SENSE, as here we have not the only ADC imparting the signal, but the DAC as well.
Meine null null zwo Roubels
SoniA
Thread Starter
#7
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAH View Post
It`s kinda senseless as the file prior to AD conversion has to be played back through a DAC . Considering the fact AD-DA sets are individual for every forum user, this test makes NO SENSE, as here we have not the only ADC imparting the signal, but the DAC as well.
Meine null null zwo Roubels
I think YES !!

As title " AD / DA" and not only AD or DA... In this way you can valuate how good is the unit, ALL the unit as Rosetta 200, UA2196 ecc.
If you don't like it, please don't wrote...
#8
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #8
it makes no sense this way
#9
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #9
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wildpark's Avatar
 

georg this make sense for somebody how need too listen too a file processed with

your weiss

so if the maschiene is on why could you not run some short file


too be a gentleman for this nice chic e

patrick
SoniA
Thread Starter
#10
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #10
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Thread Starter
[provocation mode ON] bla bla blaaaaaaa... maybe there is the terror to discover that difference between entry level converter and hi-end converter is not so great [provocation mode OFF]

The Sense ? Well... As says Mr. Bob Katz here, if we want to pass the entire stereo mix through outboard with good converter and record it in new track, we need to hear how it sounds. It's simple...
... And I think that this 3D help for the choose....

Sonia
#11
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #11
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slaves666's Avatar
I agree that it would be an interesting test, but in the end, once you play it back on your system, aren't you using your DA one more time, hence coloring it?

Maybe you should just list your AD/DA, and ask people what you should upgrade to.
#12
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #12
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by slaves666 View Post
I agree that it would be an interesting test, but in the end, once you play it back on your system, aren't you using your DA one more time, hence coloring it?
But won't there be a difference between the files as well. So you will be able to see how the signal is altered by the da/ad-convertion?
#13
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #13
Lives for gear
 

Unless the levels are perfectly matched for the resulting files, then the results will be easily misinterpreted.

As someone who has done some testing over the years, I think the chances of getting invalid data are pretty great with this scenario.

The first thing to remember when you are comparing two items is that you must have a single variable test. Just one. When you have more than one variable (D/A and A/D), then it is impossible to tell which one is causing the difference.
SoniA
Thread Starter
#14
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #14
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Thread Starter
The "original" .wav file to process is free of AD / DA. It's only recorded with stellar gear into hi-pro recording studio... It's the referred file.
I have take this ones and process with my unit for to see how the signal is altered by the da/ad-convertion of my RME.

The classic scenario is : I have one converter and I want upgrade my system, so I process the "original" file with my converter and after I can compare with the other in this 3D that other guys have put in the same way. In this way I can hear how good is my converter compared to other. And choose the better for my purpose.

In my case, between the "original" file and my RME-ADI2 ones the difference in details and deep is very notable... This make me think that RME-ADI2 is an entry level converter... But... How work other converter that wanna be "hi-end" ?

I hope to have been more clear now...
#15
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #15
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slaves666's Avatar
I realize that the original is the reference.......

Once we all process using our AD/DA, there will be tons of different files, correct?
If we all listen to them on our own systems, OUR DA will once again be a factor, as will our speakers, cables and listening environment; therefore, making it difficult to hear the difference......

Example......

I have an RME Fireface.....If person A inputs and outputs his file with a "better" AD/DA, then I listen to it with my "inferior" Fireface, my system will color his file....hence I might not hear the difference is quality.

Conversely, If Person B has a Tascam US428 (as I did) and he listens to My Fireface file, and Person C's Apogee DX16, he can't hear much cuz the ADDA in the US428 is crap.

Does this make it clearer?
SoniA
Thread Starter
#16
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #16
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Thread Starter
Yes, BUT into A/B/C ecc. listen referred to all file and the original, you can hear always with any convertor the differences. All depend by ears...

I have made the same thing with E-MU 1212m and despite has the Digidesign converters, the EMU file sounds horrible compared to RME.
#17
24th September 2007
Old 24th September 2007
  #17
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Mats's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by slaves666 View Post
I realize that the original is the reference.......

Once we all process using our AD/DA, there will be tons of different files, correct?
If we all listen to them on our own systems, OUR DA will once again be a factor, as will our speakers, cables and listening environment; therefore, making it difficult to hear the difference......
But won´t you have the same DA reference in whatever file you listens to? That´s what matters right? Why doesn´t this make sence?
SoniA
Thread Starter
#18
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mats View Post
But won´t you have the same DA reference in whatever file you listens to? That´s what matters right? Why doesn´t this make sence?
I'm glad to see that someone understand...


19 answers, 265 readings and nobody has found five minutes to do this simple thing
dzn
#19
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #19
dzn
Gear interested
 

reading that my 1820m converters are that horrible compared to rme was like a punch into my stomach. so miss klitschko can u upload both files and finish me off...
SoniA
Thread Starter
#20
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #20
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Thread Starter
You can make it by yourself with original .wav and post it here
#21
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #21
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slaves666's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mats View Post
But won´t you have the same DA reference in whatever file you listens to? That´s what matters right? Why doesn´t this make sence?
Like I said... If your DA is inferior, ie. Mbox, US428, Firepod you won't notice as much difference to the files.

Basically what I am saying is that the test is probably only valid to those with already good AD/DA.
#22
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #22
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theblotted's Avatar
 

i'll play.

may not be an ideal comparison, so this's for the books. i'm using RME FF800, straight out & in.



btw, if you can give me feedback for a similar test in my other thread, i'd appreciate it too:

RME FF800 vs. Apogee AD16x (AD only)



.
Attached Files
File Type: wav RMEFF800.wav (3.03 MB, 68 views)
#23
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #23
Gear maniac
 

Why the hec can't someone or a dealer or manufacturers just make some ligit sound files of the different converters out there? I know Lyn Fuston did but unfortanutely it's very outdated and missing a lot of new popular gear. This seems like a no brainer for a dealer.
#24
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brokemusician3 View Post
Why the hec can't someone or a dealer or manufacturers just make some ligit sound files of the different converters out there? I know Lyn Fuston did but unfortanutely it's very outdated and missing a lot of new popular gear. This seems like a no brainer for a dealer.
The reason a manufacturer won't do it is because people might listen to the files and not like theirs the best, so they might be selling units for their competitors. Also, if a mfr. performs the tests and offers the soundfiles, there's always the suspicion that the tests were skewed in favor of their own gear.

Also, it seems really easy until you get down to the brass tacks and try to do it correctly. The AD comparison was the most difficult project I ever attempted and succeeded in recording.
SoniA
Thread Starter
#25
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #25
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Thread Starter
RME FF800 seems to be a bit different to ADI-2
#26
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #26
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Mats's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by slaves666 View Post
Like I said... If your DA is inferior, ie. Mbox, US428, Firepod you won't notice as much difference to the files.

Basically what I am saying is that the test is probably only valid to those with already good AD/DA.
And why´s that? You´ll have the same reference to all the different files.
And sure if your sitting on a soundblaster card it might influence the sound too much. Well do you...punk.
#27
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #27
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Schaap's Avatar
 

Another thing what comes in mind: eg. converter A is used by a person with a setup of horrible mains power and shitty cables etc. and it compares with converter B of another person that is hooked after an Equitech/balanced power, decent cabling etc. The different circumstances of testing can give a biased result.


Henk
SoniA
Thread Starter
#28
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #28
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Thread Starter
In the same way that I go into "pro" recording studio for my song and there is an idiot eng. with bad ears and he is a "volume war" fan
#29
25th September 2007
Old 25th September 2007
  #29
Gear Head
 

#30
26th September 2007
Old 26th September 2007
  #30
Gear maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lynn Fuston View Post
The reason a manufacturer won't do it is because people might listen to the files and not like theirs the best, so they might be selling units for their competitors. .
I can understand this to a point but if they're product isn't holding up they should only be inspired and encouraged to get back to the lab. I have to credit Mytek for having the courage to put their converters up against a couple that i thought sounded better than their own on their website, but I still bought the Mytek because they were good at the price point.


.[/QUOTE]
Also, it seems really easy until you get down to the brass tacks and try to do it correctly. The AD comparison was the most difficult project I ever attempted and succeeded in recording.[/QUOTE]

I assume this must be so difficult because you're trying to match levels perfectly, which I of course applaude but also I believe there is enough sonic difference between different converters that you can hear certain characteristic differences inspite of line levels not being perfectly calibrated from one manufacture to another. Unless I'm wrong and there's some other difficulty I'm not aware of?
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