Sacrifice!!!

[Amorican]

I'm not very happy about this, but i'm having to possibly ebay my 2 6176's for some cash. I'm thinking about putting more $$ in having all nice pre's and limiting inside Protools(Waves, Bombfactory).
I'm doing mainly roots rock, Dry and forward, Son Volt , Black Crowes,etc.
Am I making a mistake on dumping the 6176's??
I dont care for my focusrite 428 pre wise, but need the ADAT conversion. (Apogee is to much $$ for what it does). I do LOVE my LA610(Keeping). So, any ideas of what I should get? I've done lots of searches on API, Chandler, and Vintech. Opinions are so mixed. The new SSL 4channel w/ VHD looks versatile. I am looking for color. I can use 428 for clean.
Recording Drums, Guitars, Vox
Thanks for your help.
1st time writer, long time reader!!

[Amorican]

No answers , Thank for your help!!!

[AllAboutTone]

API = some C O L O R and a lot of punch

[Amorican]

Thanks Zaza,
Do you think i'm making a mistake on giving up the 6176's and going plug-in??

[shanabit]

Originally Posted by Amorican

Thanks Zaza,
Do you think i'm making a mistake on giving up the 6176's and going plug-in??

Keep the 6176

[Amorican]

I guess that's the question, is it worth having the better pre's and using plugins for limiting?? I can get $3400.00 for the 2 6176's ebay, i could get and API 3124 and still have some $$ left.

[lowfreq33]

Dude, don't do it. API's a great suggestion, but you should find another way to finance it. I'll use plugin comps when I mix, but that's only after tracking with real ones.

[Amorican]

I hear ya, I know there's a reason why every major studio uses them. I'm just really wanting some strong pre's and what I've got just isnt cutting it . The 610's(only 3) are fine but looking for some new colrs on the way in. The 428 is killing me. BORING

[chrispick]

I'd hang on to one of the 6176s, at least for the comp section. Plus, it's a great box for DI'ing bass.

[AllAboutTone]

Originally Posted by Amorican

Thanks Zaza,
Do you think i'm making a mistake on giving up the 6176's and going plug-in??

I don't want to tell you what to do, but i have a slogan that i believe in !!!!
Preamps are the Heart and Soul of the Studio, I use Sintefex and thats not much different than plugins......
good luck...
There is a lot of great preamps out there, API has 4 channels and a great bang for the buck, you want be disappointed if you go that route....But do what you think is a smart move...

[Amorican]

Zaza, thats my exact way of thinking!!!! Pre's to me are the most important thing in the chain. Mics are close, but we all know everything thats been done with a $100.00 sm57. Then you have the age old debate about compressing pre or post. Most guys I know these days believe in post. Im 50/50

[AllAboutTone]

Indeed all is important, but i can take a MXL 990 mic and run it my Studer 089s or 3124 and it will sound tons better than a u87 going thru a mid class focusrite preamp....... to me doing rock and roll and such, i need that harmonic distortion that these high end pres like API deliver, that itself can feel up a mix and help a mix get loud at the same time.

[Amorican]

Zaza your speaking my laungage. That's what im missing especially on my drums. Think Ill dump my 428 and get an open convertor so I can use what i want . API and some Chandlersthumbsup

[AllAboutTone]

Cool , i want to get a Vintech if its just for vocals,(just to have a different flavor) im saving my change right now and paying off some studio bills.

[AllAboutTone]

Originally Posted by Amorican

Zaza your speaking my laungage. That's what im missing especially on my drums. Think Ill dump my 428 and get an open convertor so I can use what i want . API and some Chandlersthumbsup

Your drums and guitars will come to life with a 3124, very aggressive. If you do not know how to use them just do a search.....pad the outputs and run the inputs RED

[Amorican]

Vintechs Thats one of the first things I looked at. Im in Orlando which is about an hour away where they build them , thought I'd check them out first. But dam, they seem to get alot of crap on here from people on the board.

[Amorican]

Yeh , I was hoping the pad was on the output. everybody sounds like they push the hell out of them. Exactly what I want. Thanks for the advice Zaza!!

[chetatkinsdiet]

The vintech's are great too. I do love the api pres, but I'd totally take a lunchbox full of api pres and a vinny dual 72. For your kind of music, a single channel of decent compressor like an 1176 is all you need to track vocals with. Maybe grab a dbx160x or two just in case you don't want the color and you want to just limit...
Everything else should go into pres. If you do splurge outside of that, get an api 560 eq or two. One for drum and kick. They totally make the drums shine as well.

I was running kick and snare and OH on the API and the room mics through the vinny. A touch of 560 on the kick and snare. That's all you need for a great drum sound. No compression needed while tracking.

m

[Amorican]

Originally Posted by chetatkinsdiet

The vintech's are great too. I do love the api pres, but I'd totally take a lunchbox full of api pres and a vinny dual 72. For your kind of music, a single channel of decent compressor like an 1176 is all you need to track vocals with. Maybe grab a dbx160x or two just in case you don't want the color and you want to just limit...
Everything else should go into pres. If you do splurge outside of that, get an api 560 eq or two. One for drum and kick. They totally make the drums shine as well.

I was running kick and snare and OH on the API and the room mics through the vinny. A touch of 560 on the kick and snare. That's all you need for a great drum sound. No compression needed while tracking.

m

Thanks, Great advice. I'm getting more excited over the Vin's and Api's . I was hoping to get away with using the LA610 for Vox, mainly for the La2a part. Wish the unit would split. thumbsup

[ironinthepath]

I am from the Tampa area and have been lucky enough to meet Dallas. He is an awesome guy and is always willing to help. I have a Vintech X73i...and an API3124 and an ISA428...all of which have been mentioned. I think they are all pretty sweet but I still think I use the Vintech equally if not more than the API. Primarily because of the low frequency control with the EQ.

I guess my point is: if you are going to start getting more into the pres give the vintech a shot, I doubt you will dissapointed.

-Chris

[Amorican]

Originally Posted by ironinthepath

I am from the Tampa area and have been lucky enough to meet Dallas. He is an awesome guy and is always willing to help. I have a Vintech X73i...and an API3124 and an ISA428...all of which have been mentioned. I think they are all pretty sweet but I still think I use the Vintech equally if not more than the API. Primarily because of the low frequency control with the EQ.

I guess my point is: if you are going to start getting more into the pres give the vintech a shot, I doubt you will dissapointed.

-Chris

Thanks Chris,
By the way are happy with the 428 pre's ??

[AllAboutTone]

Originally Posted by ironinthepath

I use the Vintech equally if not more than the API. Primarily because of the low frequency control with the EQ.



-Chris

I can see that point, that is one of my favorite things about the Studer 089s is the Killer EQ thats comes with it. Altho i have not used them for drums at all, maybe someday.
I will take that back, i did do a session with 2 089s where i used 2 414 room mics in a drum room (they were the only mics i used on the kit) and really pushed the preamps hard and got that old distorted 70s sound.

[JB3]

If interesting pre's are what you are after (and it will make a difference). Consider looking over the 500 series "lunchbox pre's"...

Lot's of colors (sonically) and styles to choose from, interchangable slots so that if something doesn't meet your style, e-bay the sucker and try another.

Here's a thread to get you started:

List Here - All Lunchbox Modules In API 500 Series Format - Gearslutz.com

Start there before throwing out the BIG bucks...a couple Brent Averill API's will set you back 14 plus the box (lunchbox from ebay), same for A-Design P1, or Ericson-Montessi, Neve'ish MP500 from Great River. Can also add EQ's, Comp/Lim's...

Have box, will travel...sonically.

2¢, YMMV.

...JB

[ironinthepath]

Yes...I am very happy with it. Especially because I found a deal on it for $1400 new. I think it fits well in the company it is in; it is generally not my "go to" pre....but could be. It sounds decent in a professional way (not a mackie way) on just about everything. It doesn't have as much life as the Vintech or as much punch as the api; but I like it on guitar amps and vocals and acoustic guitar...it seems to have a little "air" to it or something, like the track can breathe. I bet it would fair well for close micing drums too...although I haven't spent alot of time doing that because the Api is what I was looking for. I think the variable HPF is useful. Its not as much of a character pre as the x73i or Api. Hope that helps.

I also am interested in getting into the 500 series format, I second the notion that you may want to check that out as well...there just seems to be so much flexibility now.

You said you are in Orlando...right? I once found a company that will rent high end gear there; you may want to look around a bit and see...that would really help you decide.

-Chris

[Amorican]

Originally Posted by JB3

If interesting pre's are what you are after (and it will make a difference). Consider looking over the 500 series "lunchbox pre's"...

Lot's of colors (sonically) and styles to choose from, interchangable slots so that if something doesn't meet your style, e-bay the sucker and try another.

Here's a thread to get you started:

List Here - All Lunchbox Modules In API 500 Series Format - Gearslutz.com

Start there before throwing out the BIG bucks...a couple Brent Averill API's will set you back 14 plus the box (lunchbox from ebay), same for A-Design P1, or Ericson-Montessi, Neve'ish MP500 from Great River. Can also add EQ's, Comp/Lim's...

Have box, will travel...sonically.

2¢, YMMV.

...JB

Thanks Mark,
I'm checking it out now, That is the way to go for versatility for sure.
Am I able to fit a Chandler in there or are they doing their own thing?

[Amorican]

Originally Posted by ironinthepath

Yes...I am very happy with it. Especially because I found a deal on it for $1400 new. I think it fits well in the company it is in; it is generally not my "go to" pre....but could be. It sounds decent in a professional way (not a mackie way) on just about everything. It doesn't have as much life as the Vintech or as much punch as the api; but I like it on guitar amps and vocals and acoustic guitar...it seems to have a little "air" to it or something, like the track can breathe. I bet it would fair well for close micing drums too...although I haven't spent alot of time doing that because the Api is what I was looking for. I think the variable HPF is useful. Its not as much of a character pre as the x73i or Api. Hope that helps.

I also am interested in getting into the 500 series format, I second the notion that you may want to check that out as well...there just seems to be so much flexibility now.

You said you are in Orlando...right? I once found a company that will rent high end gear there; you may want to look around a bit and see...that would really help you decide.

-Chris

Yes, im in Orlando, I think Ill do that with the rental, though the API seems like a slam dunk for drums. I been pricing the lunchbox with 4 512 pre's and it still comes out to be more $$ compared to the 3124, though I know u get the versitility of the lunch box. I'm thinking of maybe sticking with the 3124 and limit/eq in the box. I've heard some good things about the Waves API eq.

[lowfreq33]

Vintage King has a deal right now where if you buy 4 500 series modules (from any manufacturer) you get the lunchbox free. That's only slightly more than the 3124 (if you get all API 512's), and you've got two more slots to play with.

[lowfreq33]

And no, I'm in no way affiliated with vintage king.

[stagefright13]

Don't know if I would give way of the UA stuff for the type of music you do. I don't have the 6176 but I have solo 610's and 1176's. And that gives a kinda "Vynil" sound if ya will. I do have some Eisen API 512ish also. And they really make the drums snap and punch. They are kinda clearer and brighter and punchier. I would think a more rock sound. But that is mainly what I record.

Maybe I would try (For the music you do) trying to optimize the equipment you already own. Which is top shelf btw.

And plugins really are only for slight tweeking if you didn't use the hardware correctly in my opinion...

[stagefright13]

And I wouldn't use ALL 610's to record an album btw. Hate to say this but on a budget I would dump the LA to get a 3124. But keep in mind I have reproductions of the API stuff.