Loudness

[basement]

Lookin' for more loudness. This is probably a really dumb question, but when I mix on PT LE and then burn a CD thru CD Architect on my PC, the end result is generally substantially quieter than the typical store-bought CD. Not looking for ridiculous volume -- just want my CDs to sound professional-volume-level.

I have been able to crank out a few that sound comparably loud to store-bought CDs, but usually that's a result of really turning up the faders on all tracks, running really hot going into my outboard masterer (dbx Quantum) and then pushing the master fader to the limit w/o clipping. That seems strange to me -- I figured if I had the master volume at near clipping, it wouldn't matter what I did prior to that stage. I thought was like the overall volume control.

I use the L2, which pumps up the volume a little. I don't want it to get overly squashed. I know this is very newbie, but I'd like any suggestions I can get from you wonderful people. THANKS!

[basement]

One other thing -- on CD Architect I haven't really worked with it much. I think it's got a mastering section that can probably juice the volume a little, but I haven't figured it out (the manual's pretty lame). If anyone has any tips on using that product, that'd be great! THANKS AGAIN!

[basement]

OK, one final dumb question. When I bought the CD Architect, I was told that it would allow me to get my CDs up to "redbook" standards, whatever that means. I assumed that was some sort of volume standard. Anyone know how to do the redbook thing w/CD Architect? Sorry for all the pesky newbie questions . . .

[nlc201]

Whoah.....OK......we should sort some stuff out here! It is now time for learning my son!



First of all...."Red Book" refers to an Audio CD standard in terms of how audio data is put on to a CD. When a program claims to make CDs that are "red book" compatible, they are saying that their CDs can be read by most all consumer CD players (as if they were manufactured CDs). This has nothing to do with volume and is not terribly important although it's good your program supports it.


Second. In the race for loudness, don't forget your basic gain structuring. There is no need to mix with the faders at +6 just to get louder, in fact, that's quite bad to do. Mix as you normally do with the faders around unity. Then look at the master fader. If you are going into the red, bring it back a little bit until you're a few dB under it and never hitting red, even on the loudest peaks. Your mix is now at a good level to go to "faux" mastering. I assume you run digitally into your DBX. Get your mastering algorithm going. This may be all you need as it should provide some sort of input gain into its limiter. If you find it's still a little low coming back into PT, try increasing the input gain in the DBX (I don't know how this is done). You should make sure the gain is pre-limiter or you're going to start to clip. If it's still to low after being brought back into PT, insert an L2 after the DBX. On the L2, set your "Out Ceiling" to read -0.3. Then, slowly begin to lower the "threshold". You should see the audio hitting the top and the "Attenuation" meter should start going. I would recommend no more than 4-6 dB on the attenuation. The limiter should be taking off the peaks nicely but you shouldn't really be riding in permanent Attenuation all the time unless your really know what you're doing. Listen to the audio (very important!) and try to hear the gain reduction. When you have it set right, it should be fairly inaudible although the music will seem a bit less dynamic (that's the point!). If you start to get pumping, lower the release time a bit. If you get distortion, rasie the release time.

By now, your mix should be pretty darn hot. It's highly unlikely you'll get it as hot as commercial CDs. That's not a bad thing, and remember those mastering guys get paid a lot of money to make it that loud. Also, be sure you don't kill all your dynamic range or your mix will lose life and get nasty. But, you can easily get a CD that's pretty close to a pro CD in terms of level. NOTE: An overabundance of low end will wreak havoc on the limiter. If you notice things getting too distorted too fast, you may want to re-evaluate how you're mixing your bass.


Experiment. Try cranking the shit out of it on the L2 and see what happens. You really have to finesse the controls to find the right balance. And don't foret to check the louder spots of your mix! Make sure that your gain structure is sound and that nothing is clipping. Even though your output maybe screamin hot, it shouldn't be clipping. Do this and you shall have louder CDs.....for what that's worth.........yeah........

[jbuntz]

I usually find mixes are ruined after much more than 3 dB of reduction on the L2. Things get mushy really fast. A bus compressor could get you a few extra dB of RMS.

[jazzius II]

IMO loudness (whatever that means) comes from having the energy in your track in the right place...

...i don't really know how to explain it but you've got this space....from around 30hz to 18k and you've got to know how to use it.....where to put stuff.......spread the energy out....400hz, 1k, 51hz, whatever......it is all a different kind of energy......sorry to be a bit airy fairy about it but that's how i think about it.....

......certain tracks just sound louder then others and it's all down to the way the track's put together.......

[Buddhaman]

I very often squash the shit out of a Mix that has very good dynamics to start with...

I use the software L2...I run the mix thru TWICE...once to really limit Hard (taking off 3 to 5 db)

then I run it through again and take of another 1-2db

I find this is healthier for a mix than running it thru ONCE and smashing it all at once.

Mind you this is Modern Rock/Radio Rock stuff....my demo clients want to hear the Mix smashed so flat its titties look like mosquitobites...your clients may be looking for something else entirely.

Buddhaman

[5down1up]

how to explain ? where to start ?

let us know what you know about levels , it looks like you are missing something there !