What pedals have you got that were disappointing to the hype?

[Anadrolic]

To tell you the truth I was disappointed from most pedals I've tried. There are maybe 5 pedals that I actually like most of the other that I have tried simply sucked. I always preferred a high end multi effect. If I could I would replace all my equipment with an AxeFx and maybe 1-2 pedals that I like for that extra touch.

[darkhorse]

The Fractal is a good unit, not sure of its loop issues for integration.
The Eleven Rack is supposed to be good as well.
I tried a HD500 POD, was a horrendous waste of money. Might be OK for someone who has no effects or knowledge of them which only leads to some god awful user presets and there are thousands on the L6 website.
I am sure the higher cost and quality of the Fractal or Eleven makes a difference but I would hate to drop a couple thousand on a unit only to find major disappointment. I know Mega used the Fractal for a period or the lead guitarist still does. It has some good references.
I've had like 4 multi units and I am done w that experiment. I do not play live anymore so I have no concerns for hauling my rig what a relief and freedom that is.

[Jazz Noise]

I've never digged Multi FX units. It might seem like a generalisation and, well, it is, but even sound aside interfaces are important. Menu based systems drive me crazy!

[darkhorse]

Too true. Now I would go for that Fractal unit, or perhaps the Eleven amp, even the TC system but that is getting into the bucks, especially that Fractal, it better sound good for that much bucks.
The HD POD was $500 and I suppose it is not a bad multi unit but having had well configured pedal boards, I just miss them so much and the pedal quality verses some of the cheese mimics in the POD is just a deal kill.
Why they bother with modeling "classic" cheese pedals is beyond me.

How about working on just a few great units like a Klon or a more boutique overdrive instead of pedals I never liked in the first place.
L6 only seems to be concerned about amp models and they do nothing to improve or fix the effect side of things.
What good is a Whammy mimic that you cannot set an in tune interval on the expression pedal? Useless for me. I'll take the new polyphonic tracking Whammy. How about a Metal Zone mimic using std tone controls without the units stacked 4 band parametric EQ, is that really how some think a Metal Zone is supposed to sound? No wonder they get such a bad name. The Keeley mod I had of that pedal killed but you have to know how to adjust it.

After I get my board redone I plan to give the pedal side a rest, maybe build a new guitar.

[Silent Sound]

Digitech Wammy. The rocker pedal doesn't always return to zero and stay there, so it can detune my guitar on it's own from time to time. Also the effect itself sounds cheap.

Boss TR-2. A good clean tremolo, but nothing special. Lacks mojo and character. It's just an auto volume knob. Some people may like it for those reasons, but for me, it was just disappointing.

Boss OC-2. It's does some things well, and I still have it on my board. But overall, the octave sounds are kinda bland and there's no octave up (but it wasn't designed to have an octave up, so I guess I shouldn't complain about that). I did the "nintendo" mod to it, and it's more usable now as a strange synth effect.

Boss Metal Zone. To me it didn't sound very metal. Or maybe it sounded too old school metal. I don't know. I was expecting something more dangerous sounding and less soft.

I've got a lot of Boss pedals on my list, but I think the reason for that is because there are so many Boss pedals that I do like, so I keep coming back to that brand. They can't all be winners.

Pretty much any multi-effect pedal. Maybe some of the more expensive ones are better, but all the ones I've tried had one or two effects that were passable at best, and none ever had anything that made me happy. Plus I like messing with the order of effects and some of the cheaper units don't allow you to do that.

I understand all the disappointment on the Big Muff. But to me, it is its own pedal with its own sound and that's what I like about it. I would suggest to anyone who isn't digging on it too much to search the internet for some Big Muff mods. There are hundreds out there and it's a fairly easy circuit to work on (the box is huge and there's not a lot going on inside them and the circuit isn't cramped at all) and there are tons of ways to customize it to get it to sound the way you like. I HIGHLY recommend the Mid control knob. Easy and cheap to do and it really makes it cut better in a dense mix. I've modded mine six ways to Sunday, and while it doesn't really sound like a Big Muff anymore, it does sound better than any distortion/fuzz pedal I've ever heard, at least to me.

I'm also not digging on my Flashback X4 at the moment. I just got it the other day to replace my DL4, but I can't say I like it any better. I'll have to spend some more time with it before I make a final judgement. Often times I feel one way about a pedal only to do a 180 on it after spending some significant time with it. It's certainly not bad. I just haven't noticed a night and day difference in tone yet and the DL4 has some extra tweaking capabilities. I'll A/B them after the new year when I get some free time to experiment and by then I'll have a better picture of what I'm dealing with.

[chaosgow]

Originally Posted by Silent Sound

Digitech Wammy. The rocker pedal doesn't always return to zero and stay there, so it can detune my guitar on it's own from time to time. Also the effect itself sounds cheap.

Boss TR-2. A good clean tremolo, but nothing special. Lacks mojo and character. It's just an auto volume knob. Some people may like it for those reasons, but for me, it was just disappointing.

Boss OC-2. It's does some things well, and I still have it on my board. But overall, the octave sounds are kinda bland and there's no octave up (but it wasn't designed to have an octave up, so I guess I shouldn't complain about that). I did the "nintendo" mod to it, and it's more usable now as a strange synth effect.

Boss Metal Zone. To me it didn't sound very metal. Or maybe it sounded too old school metal. I don't know. I was expecting something more dangerous sounding and less soft.

I've got a lot of Boss pedals on my list, but I think the reason for that is because there are so many Boss pedals that I do like, so I keep coming back to that brand. They can't all be winners.

Pretty much any multi-effect pedal. Maybe some of the more expensive ones are better, but all the ones I've tried had one or two effects that were passable at best, and none ever had anything that made me happy. Plus I like messing with the order of effects and some of the cheaper units don't allow you to do that.

I understand all the disappointment on the Big Muff. But to me, it is its own pedal with its own sound and that's what I like about it. I would suggest to anyone who isn't digging on it too much to search the internet for some Big Muff mods. There are hundreds out there and it's a fairly easy circuit to work on (the box is huge and there's not a lot going on inside them and the circuit isn't cramped at all) and there are tons of ways to customize it to get it to sound the way you like. I HIGHLY recommend the Mid control knob. Easy and cheap to do and it really makes it cut better in a dense mix. I've modded mine six ways to Sunday, and while it doesn't really sound like a Big Muff anymore, it does sound better than any distortion/fuzz pedal I've ever heard, at least to me.

I'm also not digging on my Flashback X4 at the moment. I just got it the other day to replace my DL4, but I can't say I like it any better. I'll have to spend some more time with it before I make a final judgement. Often times I feel one way about a pedal only to do a 180 on it after spending some significant time with it. It's certainly not bad. I just haven't noticed a night and day difference in tone yet and the DL4 has some extra tweaking capabilities. I'll A/B them after the new year when I get some free time to experiment and by then I'll have a better picture of what I'm dealing with.

I'm with you on BOSS. A lot of what I've tried are awesome at what they do. Some of them are complete dogs, but some have some real pleasing mojo. I don't get all the hate.

The biggest disappointment I've ever had pedal wise was the Boss TU-2. I know it's just a tuner but I just couldn't live with the tone suck. Exact same with the Boss Noise Suppressor. I use a Pitchblack on its own dedicated and isolated out now so no worries about that and I have no need for a gate anymore. My singer broke my NS2, did me a favor.

Other disappointments include a lot of the Fulltone boosts/ODs, stock Tube Screamers and a few more. Mostly disappointed by drive and distortion pedals.

I guess drive sounds are all down to individual tastes so it's hard to find the right one for you. I'm lucky enough to have found my perfect partner really early in my playing "career". A Keeley modded TS808 which really punches my gut in the best possible way. But I've had great experieces with other modded TSs and their clones.

Other the other side of that coin, I've had some huge supprises from pedals I thought would be dogs but turned out to be real winners. The Digitech Whammy is a good example of that. Some of the revisions have been less than perfect, but the latest gen tracks and sounds great (When used in moderation ofc). Korg Pitchblack is another, really cheap and really clean bypass.

Lastly my biggest surprise would be the Line 6 relay series wireless setups. I own a G50 (the larger pedalboard model) and it sounds better than I ever thought a wireless could. Really clear and the signal never breaks.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by Silent Sound

Digitech Wammy. The rocker pedal doesn't always return to zero and stay there, so it can detune my guitar on it's own from time to time. Also the effect itself sounds cheap.

Boss TR-2. A good clean tremolo, but nothing special. Lacks mojo and character. It's just an auto volume knob. Some people may like it for those reasons, but for me, it was just disappointing.

Boss OC-2. It's does some things well, and I still have it on my board. But overall, the octave sounds are kinda bland and there's no octave up (but it wasn't designed to have an octave up, so I guess I shouldn't complain about that). I did the "nintendo" mod to it, and it's more usable now as a strange synth effect.

Boss Metal Zone. To me it didn't sound very metal. Or maybe it sounded too old school metal. I don't know. I was expecting something more dangerous sounding and less soft.

I've got a lot of Boss pedals on my list, but I think the reason for that is because there are so many Boss pedals that I do like, so I keep coming back to that brand. They can't all be winners.

Pretty much any multi-effect pedal. Maybe some of the more expensive ones are better, but all the ones I've tried had one or two effects that were passable at best, and none ever had anything that made me happy. Plus I like messing with the order of effects and some of the cheaper units don't allow you to do that.

I understand all the disappointment on the Big Muff. But to me, it is its own pedal with its own sound and that's what I like about it. I would suggest to anyone who isn't digging on it too much to search the internet for some Big Muff mods. There are hundreds out there and it's a fairly easy circuit to work on (the box is huge and there's not a lot going on inside them and the circuit isn't cramped at all) and there are tons of ways to customize it to get it to sound the way you like. I HIGHLY recommend the Mid control knob. Easy and cheap to do and it really makes it cut better in a dense mix. I've modded mine six ways to Sunday, and while it doesn't really sound like a Big Muff anymore, it does sound better than any distortion/fuzz pedal I've ever heard, at least to me.

I'm also not digging on my Flashback X4 at the moment. I just got it the other day to replace my DL4, but I can't say I like it any better. I'll have to spend some more time with it before I make a final judgement. Often times I feel one way about a pedal only to do a 180 on it after spending some significant time with it. It's certainly not bad. I just haven't noticed a night and day difference in tone yet and the DL4 has some extra tweaking capabilities. I'll A/B them after the new year when I get some free time to experiment and by then I'll have a better picture of what I'm dealing with.

You need to set the pedal cal on the Whammy by placing a pick under the down and up positions, I find this technique holds the calibration better and the pedal never fails to hit tuning. The first one I had lost cal quite a bit, the 2nd one was much better (3rd generation). I do not care much about the drop tuning thing on the new double pedal I just like the harmonizer modes and sometimes the octave shift. Does a killer 4th or 5th without having to stick to a set key and scale. I was never a big fan of the overused weeeeoooo effect most use on this pedal. The harmonizer modes are much better. Gilmour used this very tastefully much better than any I have seen. Jimmy Page had 2 Whammy's in his last Led Zep rig which was before the new polyphonic version V came out. If you're having trouble with the pedal cal you might try the pick trick.

My POD has all the DL4 delays and more and it was OK. I was excited about the HD POD at first, took a few months to really learn it well. There is a - 4-6 db drop on levels on the effects loop and main outs which was a deal kill for me when I tried to use external pedals. That made my 3rd multi unit and my last one unless someone I run across a Fractal AxeFX. Pedals are just much better perhaps super much more expensive but tone quality is important to me.

I got away from Boss myself, had some Keeley mods that were better. The problem with Boss is they are not bypass wired. You can easy fix the cap loading and signal degrade of a lot bypass pedals but having too many buffers is another issue. Can't think of 1 Boss I really miss. The Keeley Metal Zone was a bit of fun. Hated the "classic" DS-1 everyone seems to like.

I've been through a lot of delay pedals in the last years. I find the X4 really good for the bucks but in general I have little use for all the "star" toneprints, only a few are useful. Tc is missing the boat not allowing a public editor release so more advanced players can customize the pedal to their personal tastes.
I have lost some of the opinion I had with T-Rex and as well with L6 they just seem to have more hype than quality. For $250 the X4 is a great delay for me. Took me a while to really understand the looper which is superb. The ability to put delay modes in the loops is pretty cool. I also like how the straight signal is analog pass-through it never colors or messes with your straight tone. I am sure a Strymon is better and all but nothing in the price range beats it and I am not so sure even the Eventide is that superior. With 7secs delay range and long loop time its got a lot of features. Seems like everyone wants tape mimics and analog lo fi delays. It does all that but it is hard to match the 2290 modes for really quality delays.

[tazman]

OCD

[darkhorse]

Ditto on the OCD thing. Besides being too gainy for me much above 9:00, it lacks a lot in ability to adjust it, no game changing toggle options or even real tone controls. Fulltone's "tone" control is a treble roll off. Give me a drive with some options and useful tone control capability. Now I do still like my Fulltone DejaVibe but I doubt if I would ever venture another Fulltone for my use. Not to say they are outright crapola they are certainly what I would consider better than Boss and such. And at least bypass wired.

I find it so odd that I often see "name" players using pedals I had long ago replaced for better. I suppose one has the assumption a "legendary" player certainly must have a magic savy of gear, I find that assumption often sadly misplaced. Quite a few, not all of course, are completely clueless as to what are the better pedals. Old school guys have a hard time accepting and coming up to pace with the fantastic modern tech we have these days. Trying to use stuff like it was 50yrs ago is a snipe hunt. Like Gilmour put it, "What used to work does not work the same any more, I had to find different approaches." (paraphrased from an interview).

Sort of befuddles the notion so often used in the hype and sale these days of "star" presets and tones for various units. I always find that notion completely lacking in reality. A bad assumption to use something because who-ever is using it. Not always, some know what quality pedals are.
Many years ago I stated the axiom that an experienced player can make anything sound decent and locate a sweet spot, a poor player can make the best of pedals sound bad.

It's often a hoot to watch various name players "create" a tone for a pedal. TC has been most enlightening in that regard. Easy to see most have little to no clue as to what they are doing. And why I find pretty much none of the famous "toneprints" to be of any use other than getting at some more of the internal params and try to tweak them. The joke w tc is that they obviously think players are too stupid to use the editor to customize their own pedal, not that they are completely wrong in that assumption but a great many experienced players need that ability, that is pretty much a marketing hit and they are missing the boat entirely. Holding to a lower brow less educated customer base might be a plan but ones reputation and reviews are going to suffer.

[tazman]

I do like the Fulldrive, it sounds great with my amp and I am not much into true bypass, cause I find I like to have some buffered pedals.

The OCD is nice on some of my amps, but not in my current setup.

[darkhorse]

Buffer circuits are a must but the issue is more complicated than it seems.
A lot of things are not told to the public lest we ruin the myth and lore that is so popular.

Here is the skinny. It is easy to correct the loading signal degrade of a lot of true bypass pedals by simply adding a front of chain buffer, but, too many always on buffer pedals can befuddle ones true tone and dynamics. You cannot fix too many buffers on at one time.
Now here is the mind blower, few get, virtually ANY modern circuit pedal BECOMES a low impedance buffer pedal when ON. The output on any true bypass pedal becomes a buffer circuit when on. A simple fact of physics.

So given a chain of true bypass when one of the pedals is ON, there is a buffer circuit in the chain lifting all signal degrade and cap loading. Now having too many pedals with always on buffers can be a problem, sometimes in the mixing of pedals an ideal configuration is not possible.

But in general true bypass is desired because when anything is on the load is lifted but too many buffers on can mess with the true guitar tone. WHICH is only an issue when all pedal are OFF. Having a stand alone always on buffer pedal keeps ones straight tone from suffering any signal degrade or cap loading effect. So buffer issues are not so much an issue as one might be have been told.
If you have a pedal near the front of your chain, when on, it becomes a buffer and all is well.
One can easy overcome the loading of a chain of true by pass but having too many buffer pedals always on can become an issue.
The shear simple truth is the whole myth and lore is not much of an issue as many claim.
Pedal on, buffer is induced, all issues moot.
A buffer circuit is used on a lot of pedals just because they need to, in order to keep the noise of the circuit down in their designs.

I run a large board and have a mix of buffered and bypass through my chain.
A solution for me to get control over the mix is to add a switching system like the Carl Martin which will pull all pedals out of the chain into true bypass loops. Despite I use a Radial PB-1 which is an always on high end buffer it is not essential one do this. But given a choice of bypass or buffered pedals I would pick the bypass wired as the loading is easily compensated but having too many buffers can befuddle your true straight tone and dynamic response.

[tazman]

In my case I have 2-3 Boss pedals and a Danecho on my pedalboard besides the true bypass ones. To be honest, at band volume, I cannot really tell THAT much difference. Yes, I do lose some high end, but I compensate with the amp treble control. I like the pedals and need them for my sound so I deal with it. A lot of guitar players with great tones use wireless systems, which I would assume also somewhat degrade the sound compared to a cable straight to the amp. It's all tools used for a job.

[chaosgow]

Originally Posted by tazman

In my case I have 2-3 Boss pedals and a Danecho on my pedalboard besides the true bypass ones. To be honest, at band volume, I cannot really tell THAT much difference. Yes, I do lose some high end, but I compensate with the amp treble control. I like the pedals and need them for my sound so I deal with it. A lot of guitar players with great tones use wireless systems, which I would assume also somewhat degrade the sound compared to a cable straight to the amp. It's all tools used for a job.

I actually prefer my wireless kit over a cable. I've found that compared to whatever cables I use, my g50 gives me a lot of clarity as well as freedom. I was really skeptical when I tried it out, but now I'm a believer!

[tazman]

I have been wanting to get a wireless. That may be my next expense :-)

[chaosgow]

Originally Posted by tazman

I have been wanting to get a wireless. That may be my next expense :-)

Consider me a very happy Line 6 Relay g50 customer Wasn't overly happy with the G30 that I borrowed but I gave the g50 a chance with my own cash and I've had it for nearly a year now and couldn't be happier! I suggest you try it yourself as you may feel different though, everyone hears things differently.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by tazman

In my case I have 2-3 Boss pedals and a Danecho on my pedalboard besides the true bypass ones. To be honest, at band volume, I cannot really tell THAT much difference. Yes, I do lose some high end, but I compensate with the amp treble control. I like the pedals and need them for my sound so I deal with it. A lot of guitar players with great tones use wireless systems, which I would assume also somewhat degrade the sound compared to a cable straight to the amp. It's all tools used for a job.

Ir's a confusing subject which gets too much myth and lore.

Any modern tech pedal when "on" becomes a buffer circuit. That is why true bypass are inherently better when one bypass is on, presto its buffer low Z output lifts the loading from the whole chain. In general, in a ideal world, it is better to use true bypass pedals if possible, that is not always possible, so do not worry about the mixing chances are it is not an issue.

Having too many buffers can screw up the straight tone of the guitar's dynamics and response. You cannot fix too many buffers but true bypass is only an issue if you have a large chain of bypass, your straight tone can load down your signal and cap load the high end. Once one of the pedals is on, there is no issue.

Basically having one buffer pedal preferably close to the front of the chain fixes all issue w the straight guitar tone. Once any bypass pedal is kicked on its output is technically a buffered low impedance output signal and anything after it becomes invisible to the signal loading. So if one has a large chain and say use a compressor more up front, once on that pedal is "on" it is buffering the chain and there is no loading degrade issue.


Having a few pedals of mixed bypass and buffer probably makes no real difference.

They used to call non bypass pedals "tone suckers" which started the whole bypass fad. I have yet to hear one pedal maker simply admit when any pedal is on it serves as a buffer.

You can easy compensate for having a large number of true bypass but having a larger number of differing buffer circuit pedals cannot be compensated. Short of using a switching system to take them out of chain when not being used.

Chances are on the average pedal chain there will be little if any problems or issues with buffer or no buffer pedal mixes.
If one does feel like like their straight tone is being compromised then it is merely one has too many active buffers going, which is probably doubtful or you have a large number of true bypass and they are all off, click one "on", like a more front end compressor or clean boost, overdrive and presto load is lifted.
Now if you are one of those players who runs an entire chain of buffered circuit pedals like Boss when they are all "off" (because the dry signal is always being cycled through the buffer) your straight tone is not going to be very natural and a lot of buffers can induce noise into the signal.

A few things to take away from all this is just simple 101 physics:
1.) any modern tech pedal becomes a buffer circuit output when "on". Presto chain is now buffered.
2.) too many buffer circuit pedals can become a problem, a lot of true bypass pedals is little to no problem.
3.) having one buffer pedal that is always active near front of chain removes all loading effect from a chain of true bypass and is the best of all worlds.
4.) if too many buffered circuit pedals are "tonesucking" your signal quality the only fix is using a switching system which isolates the pedals in a by pass loop.
5.) unless you are running a massive pedal board there is probably little concern if you have a mixed board of different pedals in no particular order.

[tazman]

In the end, for me, it's about whether or not I like my tone. I used to fret over all that stuff, but now I just plug things in, set it all up and listen. If it sounds good, it is good :-)

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by tazman

In the end, for me, it's about whether or not I like my tone. I used to fret over all that stuff, but now I just plug things in, set it all up and listen. If it sounds good, it is good :-)

That is entirely the point, the issue is of little importance as it is doubtful most players rigs will have issues of buffer or loading. Just trying to clear the air on the issue as one hears so much bunk all the time. Ever hear any pedal maker offer the truth that when any modern tech pedal is on it is producing a buffered low impedance output?
Unless your pedal board is massive and complex there will probably be no issue to worry about.

The reason true bypass is preferred is simply any issues of chain size are negated when any pedal is "on". Chances are your board is a mix of bypass and buffer circuit pedals and each cancels the other out. If you are not running large chain of say Boss or other buffer circuit pedals there is little chance you may have too many buffers. One simply wants the signal of their straight guitar to retain all the dynamics and bandwidth it would have going into the amp.

There was an issue in the old days before we had such marvelous tech and insight into electrical physics that players would often intentionally capacitance load their signal to change the high end roll off on the guitar, sort of like a tone control effect.
They say Jimi used that 20ft curly cord to add cap load to his guitar signal to roll off the high end of the guiar which was pretty bright and trebley back then. Sort of low brow these days as there are better ways to deal with such issues. Jimi only had a few pedals to deal with and contrary to often claimed yada he did not use a CryBaby with the Fuzz Face, he had to use a Vox due to the buffering effect coming off the CryBaby which the Fuzz did not like. Anyway, just FYI.

For other players like myself who tend to use large pedal boards the issue becomes somewhat relative to make sure your tone is optimal at all times and conditions. The optimum chain is to have an always on buffer at the front of the chain with true bypass in the middle and a closing buffer if you have a fairly long cable back to the amp. My rig is a mix of different buffer circuit pedals and true bypass, it is not ideal as things seldom work out ideally. I plan to add a Carl Martin Octa-switch to my amp-in chain to take everything out of line in bypass loops unless it is used.

Usually with most players pedals these days, quality cables and quality power supplies are more an issue of importance. I run into a lot of players using bad power supplies trying to choke off ground loop hum and noise floor using an NR pedal which is ludicrousness. Never hurts to understand things and how to fix noise issues or signal degrade when it comes up.

[Silent Sound]

Just an update. I had a New Year's Eve gig and decided to take along my new pedal. I'm starting to come around on the TC Electronic Flashback X4. I won't say it's night and day better than the Line 6 DL-4, but it does sound a bit better. It's got a bit more clarity to it, which is noticeable, but not revelatory. The toneprints are interesting, and it seems to be a bit more versatile, if that's even possible, but it does lack controls for the modulations, which I doesn't bother me that much, as I don't use the modulation settings. The tap tempo button is always flashing, which can be a good thing, but it also can be a bit annoying (like when you see it out of the corner of your eye and you think "there shouldn't be any pedal on right now"). One other complaint, and I'm not sure if maybe I did something wrong here or just didn't notice it, but it seems as though you can't engage the pedal with expression pedal fully depressed. I often set my expression pedal to control feedback and I seem to remember setting the toe on the expression pedal all the way down to set it to infinite repeats and then turning on the pedal, thinking it would just start oscillating right there, but instead it just came on as if the expression pedal was set to heel down, with just a minimal amount of repeats. I'll have to play with it some more. These pedals take a good bit of getting used to. In any case, I do like it better than my DL-4 now, but I'd have to say if the X4 got lost or stolen, I'd have no problem just going back to my DL-4 and saving the money.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by Silent Sound

Just an update. I had a New Year's Eve gig and decided to take along my new pedal. I'm starting to come around on the TC Electronic Flashback X4. I won't say it's night and day better than the Line 6 DL-4, but it does sound a bit better. It's got a bit more clarity to it, which is noticeable, but not revelatory. The toneprints are interesting, and it seems to be a bit more versatile, if that's even possible, but it does lack controls for the modulations, which I doesn't bother me that much, as I don't use the modulation settings. The tap tempo button is always flashing, which can be a good thing, but it also can be a bit annoying (like when you see it out of the corner of your eye and you think "there shouldn't be any pedal on right now"). One other complaint, and I'm not sure if maybe I did something wrong here or just didn't notice it, but it seems as though you can't engage the pedal with expression pedal fully depressed. I often set my expression pedal to control feedback and I seem to remember setting the toe on the expression pedal all the way down to set it to infinite repeats and then turning on the pedal, thinking it would just start oscillating right there, but instead it just came on as if the expression pedal was set to heel down, with just a minimal amount of repeats. I'll have to play with it some more. These pedals take a good bit of getting used to. In any case, I do like it better than my DL-4 now, but I'd have to say if the X4 got lost or stolen, I'd have no problem just going back to my DL-4 and saving the money.

Beats me I have not rigged an expression pedal yet.
Is your pot ohm value compatible? I think its suppose to be like a 25. Been trying to get Mission pedals to tell me the value of mine but apparently they speak another language. Anytime someone tells me to try it and see I want to hit them with the pedal.

Have fun asking tc, those guys had me hitting my head on a rock.
No wonder they won't release the editor software, they think most players are stupid, they seem to hire on that basis. Cust service are some real potato heads.

I can take or leave toneprints, really only useful to be able to get at some more of the internal params and tweak them some, I seldom run across any that really floor me. Everyone seems to be a modulation craze and tape thing. I like some of the EP3 and Joe Perry has a nice one, most are not usable for me. I prefer to just set up my own. What a delay pedal that would be if we could have the editor to customize the pedal personally. They are missing the boat on that one worrying about getting players to create toneprints, such a waste of time, just give us the editor. Like its too complicated? Maybe for some.

No better delay than the 2290 modes. I do not any more consider tc to be grail quality pedals but for the bucks the X4 is quite a nice delay unit and has features others do not have at much more bucks. Been messing with the looper and it is quite interesting, I love how they made two separate engines for the loop and delay so you can loop lock delays as a part of the sound.
I would have to go Strymon or Eventide from here and they have limitations, and not sure they are worth twice the bucks. It's only a delay, certainly not the core of my tone, just a little ear candy add on for me.

[BOWIE]

I think any of them can work well in the right application but a few that I couldn't get rid of fast enough were;

-Fulltone Fulldrive2; I just didn't hear any type of usable "fulness".

-EH Memory Man (older version); Fun for a really old-school vibe, but I didn't feel a genuine sense of depth and the noise was just too much. I prefer a Roland Space Echo if I'm going to deal with that kind of noise.

-Klon Centaur; Not necessarily a bad tone, but I didn't appreciate paying $700 for $200 worth of tone.

-Boss DS1; I still don't get it. I respect that they are well-loved but my ears find them to be repellent. Anytime I get a guitarist coming in with one of these it takes almost no convincing to get them to record with a different OD after a little experimentation.

-Honorable mention to Line 6 delays. I've never purchased one but have had them in the studio many times. They just sound flat to me, like most other Line 6 effects.

As I say though, it's simply a matter of the user and the application. I don't think any truly "suck", but there are some that just don't work for my style.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by tazman

In my case I have 2-3 Boss pedals and a Danecho on my pedalboard besides the true bypass ones. To be honest, at band volume, I cannot really tell THAT much difference. Yes, I do lose some high end, but I compensate with the amp treble control. I like the pedals and need them for my sound so I deal with it. A lot of guitar players with great tones use wireless systems, which I would assume also somewhat degrade the sound compared to a cable straight to the amp. It's all tools used for a job.

It's not an issue running a few pedals, get into a board with perhaps a dozen and it become an issue. A huge board can be a complicated deal but a labor of love for those of us who like having an infinity of options at hand.
Buffers and bypass are not a concern with just a few pedals. I would think cables and power supplies become an issue before too many buffers or bypass pedals. Just saying true bypass is the preferred, if one has a choice, as it is easy to correct the loading on a ton of bypass pedals but not so easy to fix too many buffer circuits.

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by BOWIE

I think any of them can work well in the right application but a few that I couldn't get rid of fast enough were;

-Fulltone Fulldrive2; I just didn't hear any type of usable "fulness".

-EH Memory Man (older version); Fun for a really old-school vibe, but I didn't feel a genuine sense of depth and the noise was just too much. I prefer a Roland Space Echo if I'm going to deal with that kind of noise.

-Klon Centaur; Not necessarily a bad tone, but I didn't appreciate paying $700 for $200 worth of tone.

-Boss DS1; I still don't get it. I respect that they are well-loved but my ears find them to be repellent. Anytime I get a guitarist coming in with one of these it takes almost no convincing to get them to record with a different OD after a little experimentation.

-Honorable mention to Line 6 delays. I've never purchased one but have had them in the studio many times. They just sound flat to me, like most other Line 6 effects.

As I say though, it's simply a matter of the user and the application. I don't think any truly "suck", but there are some that just don't work for my style.

With you on these but I like the new KTR Klon, not sure it is worth the money, but what is. I had a DS-1 mod'ed by Keeley, better, but try as I may I could never see what was great about that pedal. I just do not mess with Boss any more these days. My Fulltone DejaVibe is a great pedal but a couple OCD's, Fulldrive and such went bye bye. I try to avoid EH pedals in general, way too much hype, memory man, still do not get why that is such a loved delay. I have a micro POG but that is awaiting replacement as well. So not worth $210.

I have had so many pedals in the last 5 years of constant pedal board swaps. If I had to call on one line that never gets kicked off it would be Wampler.
There's a few from various lines that hold but no consistency like Wampler as an always win result.

[oneworldclub]

Originally Posted by darkhorse

I realized a long time back that any pedal can sound good or bad depending
on the player, the guitar, the amp, and more so how it is used.

Thank you for saying it out loud ! Not a very 'popular' opinion,
but it's so true... How often have we seen/heard clips of
expensive gear with out of tune guitars, no timing, no feel for
playing music ?!? I'll shut up again....

[darkhorse]

Originally Posted by oneworldclub

Thank you for saying it out loud ! Not a very 'popular' opinion,
but it's so true... How often have we seen/heard clips of
expensive gear with out of tune guitars, no timing, no feel for
playing music ?!? I'll shut up again....

An experienced player versed in pedals and tweaking can make anything sound decent, a poor player or a hack can make the best of gear sound like crap.

Trying to make an assessment of pedals via video demos usually falls in 2 directions, they have managed to make it sound better than it will ever sound on your rig, or, they have no idea how to adjust anything. Really hard to decide on giving a pedal a shot. I learned to unpack things and save everything to repackage as delivered in case a return is in order, I hate to do that but man I have been burned lately by overpriced hype and "how do they make it sound so good on demos".
Major let downs: Bogner
Always delivers the goods: Wampler

[dubmunkey]

Originally Posted by darkhorse

Major let downs: Bogner
Always delivers the goods: Wampler

And i actually owe for the euphoria recommendation, i felt i'd covered my OD and whilst the demos for it were good it was your review that made me try it and it is now my de facto go to OD

Funny thing is if i wanted a bogner sound i would have bought the pedal but mutltiple accounts the euphoria is better...in fact isnt called the euphoria because bogner sued?

Anyway should pick up my mobius today :D

Am definitely done now although the wampler chorus pedal sounds amazing even on YT

Sent from my GT-I8190 using Tapatalk

[darkhorse]

Chorus is bloody good, on my next buy list.
Brian send out an email for a new pedal coming out, a dual overdrive using the Euphoria and Paisley with switchable order. Called the Fusion no idea on release or cost. Doubt it will make the Euphoria obsolete as surely it will not have all the modes the single unit has. Really is the best drive. I learned to keep the bass lower than I was used to doing and it sounded even better. No drive has been able to push that one off the board. I still find new tones with it messing with tweaking.

I am after a new Whammy which is now polyphonic and bypass plus they have the dual detuner type mobius thing in the larger unit. Been contemplating if I want to get that one. I love the Whammy harmonizer modes myself and the new better tracking is amazing. On my next but list.

[chaosgow]

new fusion up close, in case you haven't seen it

[dubmunkey]

Originally Posted by chaosgow

new fusion up close, in case you haven't seen it

Drool...

Sent from my GT-I8190 using Tapatalk

[darkhorse]

Wondering what it costs. I have collection of drives at the moment I wonder if I should just get a Paisley and side by side it with my Ecstasy/Euphoria.
For some time I have been pondering pairing with the Paisley, '57 or Tweed pedals.
Glad to see he kept my fav modes from the E drive.
This has to be the killer drive package of all time.
Anyone who has used Wampler Pedals knows they deliver the goods.
I am guessing it is going to be around $300 which is a great buy for both these great overdrives at $200 ea.