Beginner needs help

[Bruce Dickenson]

Hello,

Just so you know, I'm a complete newbie to soldering, and would love to learn how to do some basic DIY on some audio gear.

I've got a test subject I'm currently working on, and my goal is to learn how to swap some dual opamps and replace them with 8-pin sockets.

Sadly to report, my progress has been slow. I've removed the original opamps by cutting the leads with diagonal cutters, and have managed to pull most of the legs free from the PCB board using a soldering iron and some needle-nose pliers.

Where I'm running in to difficulty is in clearing the orignal solder from the pin holes in the board. These things are just so damn tiny, and there's just such a small amount of solder. I've actually had some success by simply heating up the orignal solder and then poking a toothpick through the pin holes ... and later used the end of a safety pin with some success as well.

However, it's been very very slow going using this method. I could work on it all day before I get one of these pins or toothpicks through these tiny holes, as the toothpicks are continually breaking and the safety pins bending. :D Don't laugh! Alright, you can laugh. Go ahead. Now keeping in mind that I am a completely incompetend dufus at this ... does anyone have any suggestions on a tool that I might use that would allow me to clear these holes out easier. Again, I like the idea of using a sharp, narrow object like a pin or a toothpick ... but then I would need something much stronger, sturdier and easier to handle if I wanted to get anywhere with it.

Does such a tool exist? Or is there a better way to clear these tiny little holes out so that I can install the new 8-pin sockets? My goal is to learn, and I consider this to be nothing more serious than a science project. My guinnea pig / Frankenstein is an old, non-working Symetrix 208 compressor if this helps. Thans so much, in advance.


.

[Thumper]

You are looking for a solder sucker or desoldering braid. Both of which can be found at the local Radio Shack for about $5. I would suggest the pencil type solder sucker, over the bulb type, they've seemed easier to clean out.

Think the little blue sucking bulb that your mom used to clean out your snotty little nose when you were a baby... yeah, those are the bulb kind, but it gives you an idea of what I'm talking about.

Note: DON'T use the little blue sucking bulb that your mom used to clean out your snotty little nose when you were a baby... They melt easily, and smell bad when they do. Hey!!! It was an emergency!!! Leave me alone!!!

[Harley-OIART]

Here is my Desoldering Tool. Just push the plunger in then hit the button to suck up hot solder. $3 at Electronics Store.

[Thumper]

Where is it?

[Bruce Dickenson]

Hey, thanks so much for the suggestions guys. Really appreciate it.

Unfortunately, I've already tried the solder-suck to no avail. I've come to realize the holes are just too small, as is the amount of solder.

The toothpick / pin method has actually been more successful ... which isn't really saying much at all. Really, if there was some sort of sharp, pointy object similar to a pin, but strong enough to where it would't bend when heat/pressure was applied to it, I think I'd be all set. When heated, the solder softens to the point that a small pointy object will poke right through with some pressure, but there's just no way that I can get a solder-sucker to finish the job. The amount of solder in there is just too small, and too lodged inside the hole.

Again, I appreciate it, guys.

.

[lang_dave]

Hi - with respect - you need some desoldering braid. Honest. I'm a total novice as well, but I've been recapping some channel strips in my old Yamaha board and it works. Here's a link to some products @ Digikey. If you go to your local electronics type store and ask for desoldering braid they will help you. It's a very common thing.

http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea...S&Cat=35521226

Good luck with your project, and thanks for asking a question I can actually answer!

dave

[dementedchord]

this is why it probably wasn't a good firstproject... but too late for that... if your haveing trouble useing the braided wire wicker there's a chance your tools not hot enough.... awright shut up in the cheap seats... but be careful.. the fact that you chose to cut the thing out first is part of the problem... granted it wasn't going to be that much of a heat sink but now you run the chance of lifting a trace... if you have to use a tooth pick or something to poke them try this... use a resistor... the leads are pretinned and if you heat them as you poke they'll hopefully take the solder with it... welcome to a larger world...

[Harley-OIART]

Originally Posted by Thumper

Where is it?

Now its there =)

[KingDaddyO]

A few rules of thumb:
- Make sure you have good lighting directly overhead the work area (otherwise you will get shadows, when & where you don't want them, and at the wrong time).

- Secure your work piece firmly, using a circuit board vise or 'helping hand' alligator clamp tool (Radio Shack has em') etc. You cannot perform good work if the parts are a moving during this process.

- If you don't have a variable temperature solder station, then make sure you have a good iron (at least 45 watts) with several different sizes of replaceable tips.

- Make sure you have a damp sponge, or cloth pad next to the work area, so that you can immediately clean your tip in between joints, and also so that you can fling any excess solder off of the tip.

- Soldering braid is good for some jobs, but IMO it takes a lot more experience to use braid properly, than it does to become proficient with a quality solder sucker.

If you are having a problem removing all traces of solder from a hole, it might help to follow these steps: NOTE: You should read through these steps and visualize them before trying to follow them one at a time - they are meant to describe the process as I perform it without thinking about it (like driving a car). It is important to get comfortable with the sequence and positioning of tools, before attempting this for real on your equipment. Try some sacrificial circuit boards first and see if these steps will work for you.


1) Cock the solder sucker and place it into a position where you can grab it the instant you let go of the solder supply
2) Reheat the area you want to clean, and add a tiny dab of more solder to the work area (this will cause the whole area to heat the solder rapidly, thereby minimizing the amount of time you will have to apply heat and risk lifting traces).
3) Let go of the solder and IMMEDIATELY pick up the solder sucker... NOTE that the iron tip is STILL touching the work area, since you want the solder flow to stay liquid for the next step.
4) Position the sucker tip as close to the circuit board hole as possible, at a diagonal angle (something like 45 degrees). Make sure the tip is firmly positioned and release the plunger.

If you have done all of these tasks correctly you should have removed about 95% of the solder. Any remaining traces can sometimes be persuaded to melt onto the circuit traces, by briefly reheating the trace or rim of the hole, and adding an infinitesimal bit of solder, so that the undesireable remnants flow together and assume the shape of trace.

It's probably also worth mentioning to try not to breathe the fumes directly.

Good Luck!

[KingDaddyO]

The system kept kicking me out before I could add this to the above suggestions:

- Make sure also, that you sweat the tip before use (apply a dab of solder to the heated tip), and after the job is completed. Tips should cool down with a thin fresh coating of solder on them.

[the scum]

Unfortunately, I've already tried the solder-suck to no avail. I've come to realize the holes are just too small, as is the amount of solder.

I'm actually a huge fan of my solder sucker, and could use it all day to clean out opamp holes.

Did you get a good one? The cheap little aluminum jobbies aren't very good. Spend the money and get a good one...the "Sodapullt" brand ones are consistently good, and the bigger the better.

My recipe for cleaning out holes:
1> position the board in the vise, vertically. Make it so one hand can get to the top, and the other can get to the bottom.
2> cock the sucker, and position it right over the hole to be cleaned. Leave as little clearance as possible.
3> pick up the iron (and Mr. DaddyO's iron tips are all quite valid) in the other hand. Use it to heat to board opposite the sucker.
4> when the solder melts, hit the trigger. You'll suck the solder through the hole. If it really doesn't come clean, hit it again.

Try to avoid getting stuff too hot, or leaving the heat on too long. Both can cause the traces to come up with the solder.

And I'll admit that I'm not a big fan of braid. When I started DIYing, I had the chance to try both at the same time...I couldn't get the braid to work well at all, and the sucker worked the first time I tried it. I know other people who gravitated the other way...brilliant with braid, and they find the sucker unusable. Try both, and keep the one that works for you.

Byron Jacquot

[Geoff_T]

Originally Posted by the scum

And I'll admit that I'm not a big fan of braid. When I started DIYing, I had the chance to try both at the same time...I couldn't get the braid to work well at all, and the sucker worked the first time I tried it. I know other people who gravitated the other way...brilliant with braid, and they find the sucker unusable. Try both, and keep the one that works for you.

Byron Jacquot

Hi

The problem with braid is that you have to have the correct width for the task at hand... about 1/8" tops for IC holes... and there's no point in having a bone dry wick and solder tip as all the wick does is waste heat from the iron.

I often add a small amount of solder to the hole and, when I put the wick over the hole and hold the iron against it, I may add a tiny amount of solder to the top of the wick.

You see the solder coated section of the wick suddenly expand and, when you lift the wick up, it's a >90% certainty that the hole(s) is clear of any remnants of solder.

[Minion]

What I do when I have Solder clogging the Holes so I can"t put in Parts I simply Grab my Trusty dremmel and a Mini drill bit and simply drill the hole out, It works and it is Fast and you don"t risk heating the Board so much that the Traces become seperated from the Board, If that happens your Humped.....

For areas were you can get at the solder and were there is a lot of it the Copper Solder wicks work pretty good....


Cheers

[Geoff_T]

Originally Posted by Minion

What I do when I have Solder clogging the Holes so I can"t put in Parts I simply Grab my Trusty dremmel and a Mini drill bit and simply drill the hole out, It works and it is Fast and you don"t risk heating the Board so much that the Traces become seperated from the Board, If that happens your Humped.....

For areas were you can get at the solder and were there is a lot of it the Copper Solder wicks work pretty good....


Cheers

Hi

I can't recommend that practice because it's too brutal. The reason the solder won't come out is because it's stuck in the plated through copper lining inside the hole. If you drill the hole out, you are similarly humped if the component you are putting in there (like a relay or IC socket) restricts your top access to the pad so that you can't use the component leg with a top and bottom solder to replace the ripped out pth.

The reason the solder can't come out is because it's below the surface of the board, stuck in the middle of the pth. That's why I suggested that you add MORE solder to the hole so that, when heated with an iron and solderwick, it can flow up into the wick. It won't jump up to the wick easily without that extra dob of solder and, yes, too much heating in the attempt will lift the pad.

Drilling is not really the best answer... perseverance is.

[max cooper]

Originally Posted by the scum

Did you get a good one? The cheap little aluminum jobbies aren't very good. Spend the money and get a good one...the "Sodapullt" brand ones are consistently good, and the bigger the better.

This is crucial.

[brianroth]

The best bet is a "sucker" with an external **powered** vacuum source.

Not a "zit sucker" or "braid".

Bri

[Geoff_T]

Originally Posted by brianroth

The best bet is a "sucker" with an external **powered** vacuum source.

Not a "zit sucker" or "braid".

Bri

Hi Brian

Absolutely right... but pro tools have pro prices that are probably more than the original poster is spending on his project!

[Bruce Dickenson]

Hey guys ...

Just wanted to say thanks for all the great suggestions and help.


After some more practice, I realize it was all just a matter of putting the board in a vice so that it would hold still, and then accessing it from both sides of the board simultaneously (duh!). Stick the soldering iron on one side for a few seconds, put the sucker on the other side, hit the button and Zap! Solder's gone. Thanks for the tip, Scum! In those few instance where that wasn't enough, I just used a metal pick that I was able to get at an art supplies store (the kind used for engraving and chiseling clay sculptures), and that would usually do the trick.

By about my 4th IC, I was zapping each hole in less than 10 seconds, and had all holes cleaned out in less than 5 minutes time.

Again, thanks. I couldn't have done it without you guys.

.

[amorris]

welcome to the club bruce! thats a respectable speed for rework.