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anguswoodhead
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11th January 2010
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The Bris-Vegas Neve & Neve Clone Shootout

Greetings Gearslutz.
A few of us Brissie (Qld, Aust) slutz organized a little Neve shootout at Rasta Studios on the Northside of Brisbane.
The contenders were -

Vintage Neve 1073 (tested twice on vocals)
RND Portico 5012 (tested in normal and silk mode)
Chandler LTD 1
Amek 9098
ProHarmonic Neve 2-33415
Neve 2 x 3415
ProHarmonic Neve BA283
Chamaleon Labs CL 7602 (stock)
TNC ACMP-73 (stock)

All units were used 'flat' with no EQ and no HPF etc.
This was a test of the pre-amp stage only.

4 vocal examples were recorded for each pre.
The 1073 was recorded twice - first and last in case there was any major variation in the vocal performances.

2 x Mics were used
Sony C800G
Beesneez T1 (U47 clone)

Nicole sang twice - mellow and with a bit of grunt.
Sean sang once
and I did my normal close & intimate, distant shout, average singing and sibilance test.

We also tested Bass Guitar Direct using a Radial DI.
The DI was connected to the Mic in of each Pre and powered by 48v from that pre.

In all the posts the same mic pre has the same number - numbered 1 to 11.
The challenge is to firstly pick which mic pre numbers are the 1073 and then to attempt to correctly pick and name the other pre's.

I will post some photos first to show the contenders and some of the guys involved.

Then I will post each batch of clips in a seperate post.

The clips are not volume matched (sorry) but raw 24 Bit 44.1 k files as tracked straight into Cubase 5.
You will need to import them into your DAW of choice and level match them before critical listening. (if you want to - LOL)

Often in these shootouts the loudest clip will sound the best so I do apologize for the non-matched clips and encourage you to level match before listening.
There are nearly 100 files here and I just don't have time to do it myself.

We had a lot of fun on the day and trust you have fun trying to select the 1073 and naming the other pre's.

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anguswoodhead
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11th January 2010
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Here are the results for those 'researching' Neve style Pre's.

1 - Neve 3415
2 - Neve BA283
3 - Neve 1073 at the end of the day
4 - CLabs 7602
5 - Amek 9098
6 - Neve 33415
7 - Portico 5012 in Silk mode
8 - Chandler LTD-1
9 - Neve 1073 at the beginning of the day
10 - Portico 5012 in normal mode
11 - TNC ACMP-73
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11th January 2010
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Nicole - Mellow singing on the Sony C800G
Attached Files
File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 1) C800G_01.wav (4.36 MB, 290 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 2) C800G_01.wav (3.60 MB, 163 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 3) C800_01.wav (3.64 MB, 299 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 4) C800G_01.wav (3.70 MB, 171 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 5) C800G_01.wav (3.67 MB, 167 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 6) C800G_01.wav (3.65 MB, 141 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 7) C800G_01.wav (3.64 MB, 163 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 8) C800_01.wav (3.75 MB, 150 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 9) C800G_01.wav (3.91 MB, 202 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 10) C800G_02.wav (3.60 MB, 145 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 11) C800G_01.wav (3.74 MB, 227 views)
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11th January 2010
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Sean - singing on the C800G
Attached Files
File Type: wav Sean (Pre 1) C800G_01.wav (3.63 MB, 126 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 2) C800G_01.wav (3.69 MB, 96 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 3) C800_01.wav (3.69 MB, 149 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 4) C800G_01.wav (3.67 MB, 100 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 5) C800G_01.wav (3.69 MB, 117 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 6) C800G_01.wav (3.55 MB, 93 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 7) C800G_01.wav (4.03 MB, 105 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 8) C800_01.wav (3.70 MB, 98 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 9) C800G_02.wav (3.91 MB, 114 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 10) C800G_01.wav (3.70 MB, 113 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 11) C800G_01.wav (3.60 MB, 129 views)
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11th January 2010
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Nicole - Grunty singing on the C800G
Attached Files
File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 1) C800Ga_01.wav (4.83 MB, 100 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 2) C800Ga_01.wav (3.58 MB, 77 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 3) C800Ga_01.wav (4.23 MB, 111 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 4) C800Ga_01.wav (4.57 MB, 83 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 5) C800Ga_01.wav (4.25 MB, 82 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 6) C800Ga_01.wav (4.79 MB, 80 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 7) C800Ga_01.wav (4.20 MB, 80 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 8) C800Ga_01.wav (4.12 MB, 74 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 9) C800Ga_02.wav (4.33 MB, 81 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 10) C800Ga_01.wav (3.60 MB, 86 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 11) C800Ga_01.wav (4.27 MB, 89 views)
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11th January 2010
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Angus - singing on the C800G
Attached Files
File Type: wav Angus (Pre 1) C800G_01.wav (3.85 MB, 86 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 2) C800G_01.wav (3.57 MB, 71 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 3) C800G_01.wav (3.99 MB, 100 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 4) C800G_01.wav (3.64 MB, 77 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 5) C800G_01.wav (3.97 MB, 80 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 6) C800G_01.wav (3.75 MB, 67 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 7) C800G_01.wav (3.90 MB, 73 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 8) C800_01.wav (4.05 MB, 81 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 9) C800G_03.wav (4.07 MB, 91 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 10) C800G_01.wav (3.50 MB, 79 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 11) C800G_01.wav (3.77 MB, 88 views)
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11th January 2010
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Lakland Bass thru a Radial DI into each Mic Pre - played by Dale.
Attached Files
File Type: wav Bass (Pre 1)_03.wav (4.12 MB, 133 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 2)_02.wav (4.18 MB, 122 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 3)_06.wav (4.27 MB, 159 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 4)_01.wav (4.21 MB, 106 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 5)_02.wav (4.19 MB, 148 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 6)_03.wav (4.15 MB, 121 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 7)_03.wav (4.18 MB, 114 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 8)_02.wav (4.12 MB, 118 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 9)_06.wav (4.27 MB, 124 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 10)_02.wav (4.17 MB, 114 views) File Type: wav Bass (Pre 11)_02.wav (4.23 MB, 129 views)
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11th January 2010
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Nicole - Mellow singing on the Beesneez Tribute 1
Attached Files
File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 1) T1_01.wav (3.63 MB, 82 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 2) T1_02.wav (3.59 MB, 64 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 3) T1_01.wav (3.45 MB, 94 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 4) T1_01.wav (3.58 MB, 71 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 5) T1_01.wav (3.86 MB, 79 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 6) T1_01.wav (3.50 MB, 71 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 7) T1_01.wav (3.61 MB, 68 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 8) T1_01.wav (3.67 MB, 72 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 9) T1_01.wav (3.70 MB, 85 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 10) T1_01.wav (3.83 MB, 75 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 11) T1_01.wav (3.63 MB, 81 views)
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11th January 2010
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Sean singing on the Beesneez Tribute 1
Attached Files
File Type: wav Sean (Pre 1) T1_02.wav (3.59 MB, 112 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 2) T1_01.wav (3.68 MB, 66 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 3) T1_01.wav (3.73 MB, 100 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 4) T1_01.wav (3.58 MB, 65 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 5) T1_02.wav (3.68 MB, 87 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 6) T1_01.wav (3.71 MB, 96 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 7) T1_01.wav (3.78 MB, 83 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 8) T1_01.wav (3.58 MB, 81 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 9) T1_03.wav (3.89 MB, 92 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 10) T1_01.wav (4.08 MB, 80 views) File Type: wav Sean (Pre 11) T1_02.wav (3.70 MB, 72 views)
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11th January 2010
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Nicole - Grunty singing on the Beesneez Tribute 1
Attached Files
File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 1) T1a_01.wav (4.59 MB, 80 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 2) T1a_01.wav (3.60 MB, 60 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 3) T1a_01.wav (4.23 MB, 111 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 4) T1a_01.wav (3.66 MB, 71 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 5) T1a_01.wav (3.61 MB, 84 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 6) T1a_01.wav (4.25 MB, 68 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 7) T1a_01.wav (4.54 MB, 82 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 8) T1a_01.wav (4.18 MB, 81 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 9) T1a_01.wav (4.89 MB, 95 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 10) T1a_01.wav (4.29 MB, 74 views) File Type: wav Nicole (Pre 11) T1a_02.wav (4.40 MB, 92 views)
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11th January 2010
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Angus singing on the Beesneez Tribute 1
Attached Files
File Type: wav Angus (Pre 1) T1_01.wav (3.87 MB, 95 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 2) T1_01.wav (3.58 MB, 64 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 3) T1_01.wav (4.09 MB, 113 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 4) T1_01.wav (3.57 MB, 91 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 5) T1_01.wav (4.01 MB, 86 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 6) T1_01.wav (3.82 MB, 87 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 7) T1_01.wav (3.95 MB, 89 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 8) T1_01.wav (4.03 MB, 84 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 9) T1_02.wav (4.11 MB, 91 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 10) T1_01.wav (3.83 MB, 75 views) File Type: wav Angus (Pre 11) T1_01.wav (3.67 MB, 91 views)
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11th January 2010
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Talking

cool deal.. Thx for sharing.
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11th January 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nukmusic View Post
cool deal.. Thx for sharing.
My pleasure Nuk.
Wanna take a guess on which 2 samples are the 1073?
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12th January 2010
Old 12th January 2010
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Feel free to pm me and I will let you know which pre is which.
If you're not game to have a guess.
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14th January 2010
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Anyone want to have a guess?
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14th January 2010
Old 14th January 2010
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Hey Bro,

Thanks mucho for taking the time to put all of those files together As far as guessing, I think because there are so many files to sift through that maybe folks would like to know the answers up front this time- and then go at each other's throats in the true Gearslutz spirit (hee hee). -Jay
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14th January 2010
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OK - I hear ya.
Here are the results - comments?

Mic Pre...
1 - Neve 3415
2 - Neve BA283
3 - Neve 1073 at the end of the day
4 - CLabs 7602
5 - Amek 9098
6 - Neve 33415
7 - Portico 5012 in Silk mode
8 - Chandler LTD-1
9 - Neve 1073 at the beginning of the day
10 - Portico 5012 in normal mode
11 - TNC ACMP-73

#18
15th January 2010
Old 15th January 2010
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Thanks for listing the names! Really no surprises for my preferences: Amek 9098, Chandler TD1 and Neve 1073. The Amek of course sounds "thin" compared to the others, but it stacks well and gives you a very hi-fi sound if that is what you are looking for. I would trust my money with those three choices.

Thanks again- Jay
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19th January 2010
Old 19th January 2010
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Shame we didn't have this at the shootout.
Attached Thumbnails
The Bris-Vegas Neve & Neve Clone Shootout-neve-pic.jpg  
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20th January 2010
Old 20th January 2010
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Dude,

Take that key down!

The entire purpose of these shootouts is to listen with objectivity.

There won't be a single person in the free world who will pick one of the lesser pres.
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20th January 2010
Old 20th January 2010
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Hmmm, not necessairly bro Lynn Fuston put out a shootout cd years ago which I purchased, and a whole lot of folks picked the "lesser' Sytek pre over the Focusrite -even with the key results. I do understand what you mean though as far as people really being objective, but there really were so many files I just thought that the OP would get more feedback if he put the key up. It's cool and well appreciated either way.

Peace- Jay
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20th January 2010
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I hear you.

I just think that when psychoacoustics come into play, your ears will fool even the most objective professionals.

You see it all the time.
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20th January 2010
Old 20th January 2010
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Angus,

Thanks for this posting. It was really interesting to hear the ACMP-73 along side a Neve 1073. What is your impression of the ACMP compared to the 1073 (at end of day)? They did sound kind of similar. Of course, I don't have great ears and I use a questionable monitoring environment. I bought two of the ACMP-81's from TNC. I've swapped out the transistors and I'm still wondering if additional mods are needed.

Also, why does the 1073 sound so different at the end of the day?

RGx2
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20th January 2010
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Differences will be in the performance - by the end of the day we were all getting tired which is why I did it that way.
It can be hard to pick up subtle differences if your monitoring is not good.
The guy who owned the studio where we did the shootout (Khesrow) and I both felt that the 283 was closest to the 1073 and that the Portico in Silk mode was the next closest.


BTW - the key can stay up for now - hasn't been that much interest anyway.
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4th March 2010
Old 4th March 2010
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Wow - tons of work you guys went through! Thanks for sharing!
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6th March 2010
Old 6th March 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anguswoodhead View Post

BTW - the key can stay up for now - hasn't been that much interest anyway.
I was interested

just doing a random search about the ACMP-81 and this thread came up.

They are selling them now on Ebay for 595 racked, seems a fair price if they are anything like the 73's, not quiet the group buy price...

The guy says he is a good ole' buddy of Chance's and that the hum issue's have since been worked out.....

Hey don't kick yourself over it, it may not have made a huge plash here, but that happens sometimes doesn't always make sense, but certainly useful information for future lurkers and slutz alike, I mean this is bookmarked on my laptop now and will be my go to thread for comparisons as I nibble away at the used stock of pre's on fleebay....


keep shinin

jerm
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19th May 2010
Old 19th May 2010
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amek 9098

i dont know if its just me, but i liked the sound of the amek on all the vocals. seem like it works well with the c800g
#28
20th May 2010
Old 20th May 2010
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Neve 1073

Quote:
Originally Posted by anguswoodhead View Post
OK - I hear ya.
Here are the results - comments?

Mic Pre...
1 - Neve 3415
2 - Neve BA283
3 - Neve 1073 at the end of the day
4 - CLabs 7602
5 - Amek 9098
6 - Neve 33415
7 - Portico 5012 in Silk mode
8 - Chandler LTD-1
9 - Neve 1073 at the beginning of the day
10 - Portico 5012 in normal mode

11 - TNC ACMP-73

Hello,

I'm wondering if you kind enough to tell me if sample 3 is AMS Neve 1073 or not.

Thank you very much.

Stephen,
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#29
20th May 2010
Old 20th May 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen.S.C View Post
Hello,

I'm wondering if you kind enough to tell me if sample 3 is AMS Neve 1073 or not.

Thank you very much.

Stephen,
No - the Neve 1073 is an 'original' 70's Rupert Neve 1073.
We did not use any AMS-Neve units.
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20th May 2010
Old 20th May 2010
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Neve 1073

Quote:
Originally Posted by anguswoodhead View Post
No - the Neve 1073 is an 'original' 70's Rupert Neve 1073.
We did not use any AMS-Neve units.
Thank you very much again.

Stephen.
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