Focusrite ISA828 vs ISA428 vs ISA115HD and many more

[PMoshay]

Me (Peter Moshay) & Rich Tozzoli did a side by side comparison for people to check out. We tested:
ISA828
ISA428
ISA115HD (original model pre from the late 80's)

We also tried in the same session..
Vintech 473 (at 300ohms & 1200ohms)
Neve 1066 (high only)(newly recapped)
Inward Discrete+
ADL600 (all impedences)
API 512b


The ISA's were tested 2 at a time as i did not want to split the mic 3x, The same performance & mic into both pre's.
ISA828 & ISA428......... Then ISA828 & ISA115HD
The mic was a Neuman M49 in cardiod on a Gibson Hummingbird AC guitar.
Levels were matched on the ISA's......... Levels on the other pre's were matched by ear only......NO EQ WAS USED ON ANYTHING.
Analog out on all pre's was used only......into a Digi192, clocked by a Big Ben.

I will post the video soon of how it was done.

24bit/44.1k/Wave Protools 7.4 session
MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service

[Red 7]

Thank you very much for posting this. I was very curious about ISA 428 & 828 preamps. I heard a lot of bad things when they spoke about those preamps. I don't think now it was fair. I really appreciate that you uploaded those tracks. Thank you!

[PMoshay]

I'm not really sure why there has been any negative talk about the new ISA gear.
I have been a original ISA owner since they came out in the late 80's and loved them.
I wanted to hear for myself what people might have been talking about when they compared the new ISA series, and since i own them, i decided to do my own test.

I think that some of the opinions that are out there have been adopted from other people without even listening to the gear...... from what we heard, the new units sound fantastic.

Please listen for yourself and make your own judgements, thats why we did the test.

Listen to the other pre's we included to compare to as well.

[Red 7]

Originally Posted by PMoshay

I'm not really sure why there has been any negative talk about the new ISA gear.
I have been a original ISA owner since they came out in the late 80's and loved them.
I wanted to hear for myself what people might have been talking about when they compared the new ISA series, and since i own them, i decided to do my own test.

I think that some of the opinions that are out there have been adopted from other people without even listening to the gear...... from what we heard, the new units sound fantastic.

Please listen for yourself and make your own judgements, thats why we did the test.

Listen to the other pre's we included to compare to as well.

That's why I'm so surprised. Comparing them to Neve's for example, they're doing very well.

[PMoshay]

Here's the insides of the units

[lpkyer]

I listened and here are my favorites

1- Neve 1066
2- Focusrite ISA115
3- API 312 (good alternative, would sound good in a mix more than by itself)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ("3D"sounding quality line)

4- Focusrite ISA 428/828
5- Inward
6- Vintech

[PMoshay]

I've had many various responses from people listening to these.

I gave the session without the mic pre's names to some people and it was interesting to see the responses, i wonder if the names influence things?

I was myself very surprised listening to the 3D Audio preamps in paradise sessions which models i ended up choosing.
Some models were better for drums and not a good choice for guitar.

It's all good info! Try the 3D audio sessions from Lynn Fuston..... They're a gearslutz benchmark test, a must for any serious engineer.

[lpkyer]

Originally Posted by PMoshay

I've had many various responses from people listening to these.

I gave the session without the mic pre's names to some people and it was interesting to see the responses, i wonder if the names influence things?

I was myself very surprised listening to the 3D Audio preamps in paradise sessions which models i ended up choosing.
Some models were better for drums and not a good choice for guitar.

It's all good info! Try the 3D audio sessions from Lynn Fuston..... They're a gearslutz benchmark test, a must for any serious engineer.

When I open the files in samplitude, I dont really see the names anyway...to me the Neve just really sounded that more 3D, wam and alive. I'm listening on ADAMS A7s.

[JD Latorre]

Thanks for taking the time to put this together. I have owned my ISA 428 for over a year and have been very happy with it, but I don't own any high end pres to compare it against. I was very happy with how it stood up against what most would call higher end pres.

I see you have the optional converter card for the 428 in the pics above. Have you ever compared it against your 192 (clocked to the big ben). I have a 002 and the 428 convertors are certainly an improvement, but I have always wondered how that optional card stacks up against more high end stuff.

Not trying to give you something else to do, just wondering if you would share your thoughts

Thanks again for posting the files

[PMoshay]

Originally Posted by JD Latorre

Thanks for taking the time to put this together. I have owned my ISA 428 for over a year and have been very happy with it, but I don't own any high end pres to compare it against. I was very happy with how it stood up against what most would call higher end pres.

I see you have the optional converter card for the 428 in the pics above. Have you ever compared it against your 192 (clocked to the big ben). I have a 002 and the 428 convertors are certainly an improvement, but I have always wondered how that optional card stacks up against more high end stuff.

Not trying to give you something else to do, just wondering if you would share your thoughts

Thanks again for posting the files

I have not tried the digital card comparisons..... i heard that the new ones for the 828 are alot better. I did the test using the analog outs to keep it all fair.
As far as clocking goes...... i would have to try it and listen to see if it improves. I have heard quite a bit of digital gear NOT sounding better when clocked by an external source......it stands to reason that it was designed around its own clock, and possibly not much attention gets spent on making sure that a piece of gear will preform well if externally clocked........but thats just my educated guess and observation.
I do know some pieces of gear that DO NOT sound better clocked by my Big Ben.

[JD Latorre]

Originally Posted by PMoshay

I have heard quite a bit of digital gear NOT sounding better when clocked by an external source......it stands to reason that it was designed around its own clock, and possibly not much attention gets spent on making sure that a piece of gear will preform well if externally clocked........but thats just my educated guess and observation.
I do know some pieces of gear that DO NOT sound better clocked by my Big Ben.

Yes, I've heard that observation made many times--it's one of the reasons I have never gone out and purchased an external clock--just seemed like a gamble.

Thanks

[PMoshay]

Originally Posted by JD Latorre

Yes, I've heard that observation made many times--it's one of the reasons I have never gone out and purchased an external clock--just seemed like a gamble.

Thanks

In a large studio format where you have to interface lots of digital gear, it's hardly even an option to leave independent pieces of digital gear on its own clock, if you do then you are doing constant AD-DA conversions which MAY have it's own issues.

One master clock is a not really an option if you really think about it, something has to be the master somewhere, so you are gonna have to choose a master clock piece in your system. Doing everything in the box makes it simple......... but when did simple become priority over sound..........

[faust]

Originally Posted by PMoshay

I've had many various responses from people listening to these.

I gave the session without the mic pre's names to some people and it was interesting to see the responses, i wonder if the names influence things?

I was myself very surprised listening to the 3D Audio preamps in paradise sessions which models i ended up choosing.
Some models were better for drums and not a good choice for guitar.

It's all good info! Try the 3D audio sessions from Lynn Fuston..... They're a gearslutz benchmark test, a must for any serious engineer.

Hi Peter,
Downloading your session now, and curious to hear it. I have owned the 428 (although I don't have one at the moment) and used it many times in sessions. I also own api and neve preamps and use most of the big players at work. I have to say that the 428 is a solid box and a crazy good deal for the $. Especially if you get one on ebay (they sometimes go for as low as $1200). They have a great detail and air on the top end. I found them good on acoustic guitars and certain vocals. Definitely worth having alongside even the higher end stuff imo. I have had several friends that had less than 2k to spend and needed more than 2 pres, and I recommended the isa 428. For that kind of budget there's not much else out there that I can think of that gives you 4 neve designed mic preamps? The biggest downside to the unit is it runs extremely hot. It's scary how hot they get actually!

Mike

[Cosmonauta]

Unfortunately I´m not able to download. I tried the whole day.

The site says:
"All download slots assigned to your country (Brazil) are currently in use. Please try again in a few hours or install the Megaupload Toolbar for immediate access - with the toolbar installed, there are no more slot limitations for you!"

But this damn toolbar is not even compatible with OSX...

[Red 7]

Originally Posted by Cosmonauta

Unfortunately I´m not able to download. I tried the whole day.

The site says:
"All download slots assigned to your country (Brazil) are currently in use. Please try again in a few hours or install the Megaupload Toolbar for immediate access - with the toolbar installed, there are no more slot limitations for you!"

But this damn toolbar is not even compatible with OSX...

It will not work on Mac OS X. I had the same problem. You should use something like VPC or VMW Fusion or Parallels Desktop.

[PMoshay]

Originally Posted by lpkyer

I listened and here are my favorites

1- Neve 1066
2- Focusrite ISA115
3- API 312 (good alternative, would sound good in a mix more than by itself)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ("3D"sounding quality line)

4- Focusrite ISA 428/828
5- Inward
6- Vintech

Interesting that you did not hear a 3D sounding Vintech...... on my A7's it was jumping out.
The idea is so people can find the sound they like though.
Hope it helps people navigate the sea of preamp choices, lots of good stuff out there.

[Ciozzi]

Thank you for this test. I prefered the vintech 473 cause it sounds like a Neve with some added sparkle to me. Neve and api sound great though and I guess the reason is their midrange-forward character. The Focusrites are like I remember them... just average, not bad but boring compared to other top notch pre's.

[EgyptionRing]

I like the presonus adl600, didn't think I would, clean with some sheen.