Audio Technica ATM450 vs Chameleon Labs TS-1: Drum Overheads

[warhead]

Somebody asked me today to compare the two, so I made clips with each in an ORTF setup above my head facing into the kit, in my new room here at Front End Audio. I am not kidding, anymore I use a laser pointer mounted on a mic stand to get the positioning right. I'll have to snap a pic next time...!

Click Here for Clips

Kit is DW 12" / 14" / 16" toms, 22" kick
Snare is Slingerland copper 14 x 6.5"
REMO coated ambassador heads toms / snare
Evans EQ3 head on kick
Zildjian A and Sabian mix, 14" New Beat hats

Cable is all Mogami
Earthworks ZDT preamps
SSL Alpha Link AX conversion
Nuendo4 @ 44.1/24, exported as 320k mp3

I figured why share with one guy when many could benefit from the efforts.

War

[CrankyRayHanky]

Ha! I just started using a laser pointer last week to line up mics....I thought I invented that technique

[warhead]

These NEBO flashlights fugging rock!!! Seriously, they fit right into SM58 style rubberized mic clips. They are combo standard LED flashlight or red laser pointer!!! Perfect for crawling around under the desk, pointing things out to clueless musicians on the other side of the glass with the pointer (without having to go in there...again!), and repeating mic tests...! - War



N.E.B.O. FLASHLIGHT FREE SHIPPING!!!! - NS

[centurymantra]

Cool test...nice to hear both of these mics. I feel compelled to comment on how I could not BELIEVE how horrendously terrible sounding the "lo-fi" version of those tracks sounded (I accidentally picked that first). I can tolerate bad audio streams to some degreee, but that sounds like listening to a cellphone in an area with bad coverage stuck up to someone's laptop speakers. I wonder why that site even offers that option.

BTW...I like those TS-1 clips.

[lpkyer]

Great samples. Still can't get over the great SSL conversion. Sounds so good. It's going on top of my list now.

[warhead]

Click the far right arrow to download, it will be 320k mp3.

Lou, the SSL converters have taken my sound to the "HNL" (ho' notha' level).

War

[Nu-tra]

Thanks Warren!

[lpkyer]

Originally Posted by warhead

Click the far right arrow to download, it will be 320k mp3.

Lou, the SSL converters have taken my sound to the "HNL" (ho' notha' level).

War

Yeah because you know I'm getting familiar with your drumming after listening many of your great samples, and since youve been using those SSL converters I really can hear all the nuances much better. Thanks for this sample once again...
I'm surprise at how the 450 hold very well to the TS-1s

[Nu-tra]

I want to hear the beyer mc930's compared to the others.

[warhead]

Sorry, didn't have any around (MC930)...!

War

[Brad McGowan]

Warren,

How exactly do you use the laser pointers?

Brad

[warhead]

Brad, I point them at the capsule dead center from as straight on as possible. For pairs this is the best I can do. However, for single mic testing (which would be most of the time) what you can do is use pointer A to hit center of the capsule and pointer B to hit the top or side of the mic for more positioning info. Essentially you are creating a 90 degree angle then that tells more of the story angle wise etc.

You could probably leave a laser pointer on for a month before the battery died, or longer. So I just put them in mic stands, turn them on and point them, then they do not move for the remainder of the testing. Those flashlights I linked above (FYI I did not buy from there, but they have a good price) are so perfect for this and crawling around behind the racks it's ridiculous. You can find sellers who have multiple colors also, I have a black and blue one.

Next time I do this I will snap pics and post them.

War

[MadGuitrst]

Interesting.......

They each did their own thing better or worse on drums and cymbals/hats.

Drums:
The TS-1s sounded much better on drums, picking up way more body and depth.
The 450s sounded pinched and small in comparison....mostly hearing the snap of the heads rather than the body of the drum.

cymbals/hats:
The 450s were clearer and more sparkly.
The TS-1s sounded a bit dull yet they somewhat splattered at times.

I would say that they sounded like they were placed differently - not that they were. But that brings up a point that different mics need different placements - not saying anything was wrong with either....just that depending on which mics you have you may have to move them around to find the optimal sound.

Thanks for sharing, Warren.

[heisleyamor]

I didn't see this thread until now. Very cool. ATM450s sound amazing for the price of 2. I actually think they would blend better in a mix with other drum mics over the TS-1s. The highs have more sparkle and would cut through the mix well.

[monkeyxx]

I think the ATM450 is the clear winner here... I think the TS1 is a little on the tubby side for drums in a mix. the AT is nice and clear

[warhead]

You can now hear these two mics, against 8 others by clicking on the "Tuesday Testers" link in my signature. It's located within our SDC link on the page.

So far there is also a comprehensive preamp comparison and ribbon mic test as well.

War

[monkeyxx]

cool... I'm just loving that SE ribbon mic on electric guitar. I think the peluso R14 and the AEA R84 sound super on the drumset

[warhead]

Can I just say sir that you have excellent taste then.

I pick the sE R1 regularly over any others on guitar cab, and personally own an R1 for this very reason.

And I am totally with you on the other two: I own an R84 and it slays on drum kit...however that Peluso...man! There is a low end kickin' on drums that is arguably tops for this position.

I still consider my AEA R84 to be THE best all rounder though, once you hit vocals maybe you will hear why.

War

[1/2 Normal]

Originally Posted by warhead

These NEBO flashlights fugging rock!!! Seriously, they fit right into SM58 style rubberized mic clips. They are combo standard LED flashlight or red laser pointer!!! Perfect for crawling around under the desk, pointing things out to clueless musicians on the other side of the glass with the pointer (without having to go in there...again!), and repeating mic tests...! - War



N.E.B.O. FLASHLIGHT FREE SHIPPING!!!! - NS

Just grabbed a couple!!!!

[monkeyxx]

I'm embarrassed! I don't know nothin, but thanks! I guess half the battle of being a good recordist is having good taste in tonalities. that's pretty cool that our tastes are overlapping. now only if I had enough money to order some fancy ribbon mics! thanks for the shootouts

[warhead]

Originally Posted by MadGuitrst

I would say that they sounded like they were placed differently - not that they were. But that brings up a point that different mics need different placements - not saying anything was wrong with either....just that depending on which mics you have you may have to move them around to find the optimal sound.

Thanks for sharing, Warren.

MG, I meant to comment on this earlier. The ATM450 actually get the short end of the stick in a way because yes I normally place them closer in than this. The imaging, detail and clarity, as well as the depth (not quite delivered here) still make them my first reach on drums.

As always clips on the internet aren't the whole story, I like both of the mics for different reasons. Actually, if you check out that SDC test that we did during our Tuesday Testers night the AT3031 is very interesting to say the least...it's always been my favorite hi hat mic but it had a nice thing going on with overhead also.

War

[Jax]

Ah, originally I glanced at the thread title and mistook the 450 for the 4050. Listening to the clips, I thought the 450 was actually the 4050, and my ears lead me to believe that's what I was hearing because they sound very similar.

The main difference is the 4050 picks up more room and ambient information, as you might expect from a LDC. The 450 also sounds a little faster, but surprisingly not much.

I like the TS-1's penchant for greater detail, albeit at the cost of a slightly too bright top end. The quickness of transient pickup is pronounced compared to the 450. These would be great for a fast tempo and/or busy rock tune.