Gyratec G14 vs. Massive Passive audio test

[yareck]

Here are 4 files. Settings are simmilar but NOT IDENTICAL, because constructions are different and obviously this is all I could do....

Old links were deleted, but here is updated link with all tests done by me (including this one):
http://www.master-your-track.com/tests.zip

Settings:

1. Massive Passive boost
- no eq - lo shelf - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 12k shelf - ultra high shelf
2. Gyratec G14 boost
- no eq - lo bell - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 12k bell - ultra high bell
3. Massive Passive cut
- no eq - lo shelf - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 8k bell - soft high shelf
4. Gyratec G14 cut
- no eq - lo bell - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 8k bell - 12k bell

Enjoy!

[matucha]

now this is going to be interesting... thanks

[matucha]

Gyraf seems fuller on boost... with cut there is less of the difference. Maybe if you boost the bottom more on MP it's going to be closer to gyraf?

[yareck]

Originally Posted by matucha

Gyraf seems fuller on boost... with cut there is less of the difference. Maybe if you boost the bottom more on MP it's going to be closer to gyraf?

It's the bandwidth knob. I can turn it left and it will sound simmilar to the Gyraf, but more muddy than Gyraf.
From the other side it is not possible on Gyraf to get this kind of a deep low end below 50 Hz.
I wanted only to show the strengths...and also the differences in the strengths (mids)... that's fair I think...

and in general you are absolutely right - Gyraf sounds fuller :-)

But someone could say it changes too much of the original sound...

so depends what you want :-)

[matucha]

ah... I was only listening to bypassed ones! and in bypass the gyraf rulez

with actual EQ it is so different, that I couldn't say my preferences anymore... boosting lows or lowmids with gyraf is a bit muddy, but it is much stronger than MP... massive has strong midrange character to it, not bad at all... I can't hear any hint of harshness in the boosted highend on any of those EQs. Though it seems like the gyraf files has 2 times more gain/reduction going on than manley. The mid boosts on manley gave the sound interesting qualities (density and firmness) that I couldn't hear in gyrafs.

Different beasts ;-)

[yareck]

Originally Posted by matucha

I can't hear any hint of harshness in the boosted highend on any of those EQs.

Isn't that interesting, because many people say about harshness on the MP's high end...

[matucha]

like many say VariMu "destroys" the lowend...

but what can I say? I didn't have them at my place and it is damn hard to get such a things on demo around here. So it is about files like these, blind buying and then shuffling things untill you're satisfied


Other thing is, how does they (MP and G14) behave on less nice material, where the HF content isn't in a such a good shape as in this sample? MP could be much less forgiving = harsher. G14 could cover that with some euphonic distortion and make it less of the problem... who knows.

[yareck]

Originally Posted by matucha

Other thing is, how does they (MP and G14) behave on less nice material, where the HF content isn't in a such a good shape as in this sample? MP could be much less forgiving = harsher. G14 could cover that with some euphonic distortion and make it less of the problem... who knows.

When the content is really poor, the Gyraf is always better. It just adds something "euphonic" like you said... a kind of psychoacoustic.. it covers most of drawbacks (not only at the high frequencies), but you don't feel it sounds like Behringer psychoacoustic ;-) Not in this price range :-) It also works with better mixes...

If I would choose beetween two I would stick to Gyraf, but it's hard to choose.

This is no problem just send the example you want to test and I will put it here or send you... whatever... I exactly know how difficult may be to get demo here in Poland or Czech.

[matucha]

Thanks for your offer, but there's no need for that, it can't substitute the expirience.

But I'd be interested to hear this kind of "comparison" between varimu and gyraf (and Thermionic Phoenix), so if you have anything like that, I'd appreciate to hear it. I'd just like to have a vague idea about the character.


Some time ago I was complaining to my friend from Spain (!hola Enrique!) about the problems we have here when we want to try some gear. And he pointed out that we should be happy we have Gearmany just over the hill, so we can take a car, try something and return home in one day. It's not so easy and trying gear in a foreign environment isn't as good as having it "at home", but still he had a point. At least at this historical moment it's good to be so close to Germany

[yareck]

Originally Posted by matucha

I'd be interested to hear this kind of "comparison" between varimu and gyraf (and Thermionic Phoenix)

Me too...probably... but unfortunately I don't have any of them and it looks like purchasing Glory Comps has became the end of search for the nice vari-mu sound...

BTW. let me know the German company which will borrow you equipment for demoing

[carlsaff]

Originally Posted by yareck

Isn't that interesting, because many people say about harshness on the MP's high end...

I've never understood this, either. The MP is capable of some truly stunning mix clarification. It's the first piece I turn to when a mix is muddy. I don't use it in the sub range much (a little too unpredictable) and the air band on my NSEQ-F is better. But in the mids, high-mids and treble ranges, I much prefer it to my other options.

[Zuewi]

Thanks for the Test it's really great! Hands up
Want more of it... :)

I somehow like the sound of the Manley a bit more cause it's more open and it really cleans up the stuff well, if you look back to the origianl file you can't believe what u hear.
On the other hand the Gyratecs sound has a mit more fattness and the hights have something special.

[sexxy]

Gyratec G14 boost
Massive Passive cut

[Spartacus]

Originally Posted by sexxy

Gyratec G14 boost
Massive Passive cut

héhé i would say the opposite :
Massive in boost (especially in the meds) is very musical, it adds always something musical and very natural, Gyraf on boost sounds a bit "un-natural", it dislocates a bit the whole mix...maybe because massive is more "wide"

On cut i like the gyraf, more precision on cut!

[Zuewi]

yareck, will your great test be continued with a GML?
...hopefully

[yareck]

Originally Posted by Zuewi

yareck, will your great test be continued with a GML?
...hopefully

The test was unfair for Gyraf (maybe because of the style of music). Today I had a meeting with the most famous mastering engineer here in Poland known here for years (his name is Grzegorz Piwkowski and in fact he was my teacher), and the one equalizer in my setup that really catched his attention was the Gyraf! I'll try to put better examples of this wonderful EQ soon!

Regaring Massive Passive I'm going to make a mod to make it working in M/S mode, or I will sell it.

In the meantime I'm going to show you example of this "GML sparkle" vs. "diamond glass breaking top" tomorrow, I believe it could be inspiring to hear this :-) I'm stunned as far !

[blaugruen7]

Originally Posted by yareck

In the meantime I'm going to show you example of this "GML sparkle" vs. "diamond glass breaking top" tomorrow, I believe it could be inspiring to hear this :-) I'm stunned as far !

i am really interested!!!

[Zuewi]

Yea an example of Gyraf/MP/GML would be awsome!
And yes...maybe it was the wrong song for the Gyraf but the right one for the Massive...
If you going sell it I'd buy it for a nice moderate price ;)

Cool that the Gyraf fascinated this famous man so!

Originally Posted by yareck

The test was unfair for Gyraf (maybe because of the style of music). Today I had a meeting with the most famous mastering engineer here in Poland known here for years (his name is Grzegorz Piwkowski and in fact he was my teacher), and the one equalizer in my setup that really catched his attention was the Gyraf! I'll try to put better examples of this wonderful EQ soon!

Regaring Massive Passive I'm going to make a mod to make it working in M/S mode, or I will sell it.

In the meantime I'm going to show you example of this "GML sparkle" vs. "diamond glass breaking top" tomorrow, I believe it could be inspiring to hear this :-) I'm stunned as far !

[Lagerfeldt]

It's a real pleasure listening to and working with the Gyraf G14.

1) Original file
2) G14 with a bit of 60 Hz and 22 kHz boost
3) G14 with a bit of 60 Hz and 22 kHz boost + output trim saturation

Notice the full and warm low end, but still very firm. And the very fine highs, without getting shrill at all. Just not possible with a digital EQ in my opinion. And the slightly wider stereo image is also a bonus, probably the trafos contributing too.

The files are about the same level although especially the saturated file seems a lot louder. They're NOT mastered, so use that little volume knob thing on your monitor controller to turn it up ;-)

http://www.popmusic.dk/temp/g14audio.zip

I must say it's just what the doctor ordered in my setup.

No wonder Tape Op called it "The best sounding equalizer. Ever."

--

I like the fact that it also seems unproportionally louder considering it's only measures about 0.5dB higher after EQ. A very effective loudness curve where you get more than you "pay" for And not due to transient compression in the tubes, maybe I got lucky with the phase relations. This is especially evident in the saturated file.

If I may continue my G14 rant, a very important aspect for me on buying the G14 was:

When the eq is patched in and active, but all band controls are set to middle (not active), it's quite linear sounding, all things considered. Primarily you just get the transformers sweetening and widening the signal a bit while the tube sound is not very noticable. So even though it certainly is a color box, the bands don't "sound" when the cut/neutral/boost knob per band is set to neutral position and the output trim is kept at unity.

This means you really have a choice in how much (tube) coloration you want, and it also means you don't have to be afraid of too much overall coloration if you just want to use 1 single band in a mastering situation. And if you want real saturation crank the output trim above unity and pad your converter.

So very unlike the way e.g. the Gyraf Gyratec X is designed, where you have coloration all the time. And in my opinion a way better sounding eq than the Manley Massive Passive.

I'm mostly doring corrective EQ with the digital Flux Epure and then sweetening with the G14, perhaps a touch of cut too.

[Lagerfeldt]

Also as a little curiosity, the frequency labels on the dials are determined by how the are perceived, not how they are measured.

[wildpark]

hi thanks for the files

which zip program is used

iam here under mac osx 10.4 with stuffid but only errors schown up.

thx patrick

Originally Posted by yareck

Here are 4 files. Settings are simmilar but NOT IDENTICAL, because constructions are different and obviously this is all I could do....

Old links were deleted, but here is updated link with all tests done by me (including this one):
http://www.master-your-track.com/tests.zip

Settings:

1. Massive Passive boost
- no eq - lo shelf - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 12k shelf - ultra high shelf
2. Gyratec G14 boost
- no eq - lo bell - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 12k bell - ultra high bell
3. Massive Passive cut
- no eq - lo shelf - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 8k bell - soft high shelf
4. Gyratec G14 cut
- no eq - lo bell - 500 Hz bell - 1k bell - 2.5k bell - 8k bell - 12k bell

Enjoy!

[Lagerfeldt]

Originally Posted by wildpark

hi thanks for the files

which zip program is used

iam here under mac osx 10.4 with stuffid but only errors schown up.

thx patrick

Are you asking me or the OP?

My zip file works fine under both 10.4 and 10.5 and is stuffed using the Mac OS X's built-in file compression function (to zip).

I also have no trouble opening the OP's zip file, so something must be wrong with your StuffIt.

[wildpark]

no the op

Originally Posted by Lagerfeldt

Are you asking me or the OP?

My zip file works fine under both 10.4 and 10.5 and is stuffed using the Mac OS X's built-in file compression function (to zip).

I also have no trouble opening the OP's zip file, so something must be wrong with your StuffIt.