First Synth; Advise Wanted?

[Yoozer]

"Help me please" is a really bad topictitle; next time if you have a question, please just put your question in there. In this case, your topic should've been called "Roland Gaia or SH-201 for hiphop/electro?"
Virtually everyone posting a thread here needs help so that's taken as obvious .

Originally Posted by Babyjohn

important to me is a good sound and a multitimbre.

That rules out the SH-201.

Advise that it is better in this price category?Or maybe you have other ideas?

What kind of sounds do you need - realistic or synth sounds?

What plugins do you already have (if any?) IMHO, there are several plugins that cover SH-201 territory quite well, even free ones - so that can allow you to spend your money on a synthesizer that offers sounds free plugins don't have.

[Babyjohn]

Originally Posted by Yoozer

"Help me please" is a really bad topictitle; next time if you have a question, please just put your question in there. In this case, your topic should've been called "Roland Gaia or SH-201 for hiphop/electro?"
Virtually everyone posting a thread here needs help so that's taken as obvious .


That rules out the SH-201.


What kind of sounds do you need - realistic or synth sounds?

What plugins do you already have (if any?) IMHO, there are several plugins that cover SH-201 territory quite well, even free ones - so that can allow you to spend your money on a synthesizer that offers sounds free plugins don't have.

Ok.Sorry for "Help me please",you are right).I need synth sound,cause for realistic sound i would buy yamaha motif.I have Diva,Image-Line Plugins,Rob Papen Plugins and many other,but i want hardware synth.Gaia sound is bad?SH-201 sounds great,but polyphony 10 and 2 multitimbre(it isn`t enough,cause it would my first synth and i wanna make tracks with this one).

[Yoozer]

IMHO, Rob Papen's Predator should already cover for everything the SH-201 can do, really!

The Gaia's not bad, but sample-based - and in terms of multitimbrality it's sort of like the CS1x; one "cool" synth part, and 15 parts that are a little more boring - they're General MIDI sounds, that is, "realistic". They can also only be accessed via MIDI as well, so if you want to play them you're going to need either an external keyboard or Cubase.

Must it have a keyboard, or is a module/rack also good? Because in that case I'd get a Blofeld or secondhand Access Virus B/C - they've got 16 parts of multitimbrality, and are IMHO more capable than the SH-201. Those are truly multitimbral - the synth sounds are available on all the channels.

[Reptil]

Hi, and welcome

Since you're thinking of getting a first hardware synth, there's two things you'd have to consider: First, do you have a converter with your computer so you can record it? Second, it's very practical to be able to control the synth with the computer sequencer (also called DAW - digital audio workstation). What you do is you connect it through midi (or USB if it's just a keyboard) with the sequencer. Like Yoozer hinted already, you'd need a midi interface if your new synth is going to have a midi port. A small MOTU would be perfect IMO. Possibly you already got this, but I'm mentioning it anyway. You will be able to play your softsynths from the keyboard of course.

As for synths, you want an electronic sound I understand from your posts. The Gaia sound isn't bad, as in "garbage", but we've spoiled ourselves with a high standard. To add to the two synths mentioned in Yoozer's post, here's another suggestion:
For poppy electro (-house) R&B but still electronic sounding, get a Dave Smith Prophet 08. It's fairly new (no maintenance issues and old parts you replace) and has a wide variety of clean but punchy electronic sounds that would work fine with the music genres you mentioned. The keyboard has velocity and aftertouch, and smaller keyboards are IMHO better on stage, easier to carry around and set up.
I was going to mention a Mopho x4 & Tetra expander, but scoring a Prophet 08 secondhand might be a better idea. (videos of both below) Get one with the pots, not the endless encoders (the pots are better) I like the Mopho sound better myself but I don't make pop electro house.
Also check this thread: Tetra vs Prophet 08...

and the Mopho x4

[Reptil]

Another one is the Korg Radias (4 part multitimbral)
underestimated synth IMO. flexible, good sounding and cheap enough. I'd like to check one out some day.

[Yoozer]

One big difference in terms of hardware synths are expectations. Virtually every plugin has built-in effects. The Gaia has it too - in the store a patch with a bit of delay/reverb and chorus is going to sound pretty polished. This in contrast with the Mopho x4 which has no effects processor on board.

However, for most here that's not a problem; people have either dedicated effects (which are almost always better than the built-in ones) or use the ones in the DAW after recording the synth "dry".

Also, multitimbrality is not considered much of an issue anymore, again because of DAWs - people simply record the synth's output as audio multiple times. This gives less flexibility when you want to try a few takes and change the notes, but more in terms of effects. It takes longer because you have to record line by line, but an option is to play it first with a plugin and then replace it with the hardware synth version. That way you still get to compose without much limitations, and you don't have to sacrifice anything in terms of sound.

So you can see, the criteria can be different for the people who are responding.

[Babyjohn]

Originally Posted by Reptil

Hi, and welcome

Since you're thinking of getting a first hardware synth, there's two things you'd have to consider: First,

Hi and thanks)

Mopho x4 sound is beautiful,so cool,but price on ebay 1300 it`s more than i have now.what is with polyphony in this one?how many midi-tracks i can write in sequencer with this one?I have microkorg XL and with this i can write only 2 midi-tracks in one project with different sound,it`s bad for me)I want synth with possibility write 16 midi-tracks in sequencer with different sounds on each.Sorry,i hope you understand that i mean.)

[Reptil]

You're welcome!
yes, I think the Mopho x4 is ONLY multitimbral if you add another Tetra.
so..
Mopho x4 plus Tetra is 4x multitimbral (analogue synth, DCO (digital controlled oscillators)
the Prophet 08 is 4x multitimbral
the Korg Radias is 4x multitimbral
the Virus TI is 16x multitimbral (older Virus also multitimbral but less polyphony so go with the TI)
hope this helps.

oh ps I edited your quote of my post

[seqai]

If you need a powerful synth and quite limited with your budget maybe you should consider Waldorf Blofeld, it's little synth but still with huge capabilities. It's main problem that its OS still quite buggy and I certainly wouldn't recommend it for life use, the polyphony is up to 25 (with 16 part multitimbrality) voices, but the effects, comb-filters could "eat" much earlier than you reach all 25 voices.
But for home/studio work it's still great.
My personal love is Alesis Micron, however the polyphony is only 8 voices, multitimbrality if I'm not mistaken is 4 timbres (or maybe 8 in later versions, not sure). Still it's very versatile and stable as swiss army knife, but at the same time difficult to program. However with hypersynth software you sould easily program it from your pc and even integrate it with your DAW.

[Babyjohn]

Originally Posted by Reptil

You're welcome!
yes, I think the Mopho x4 is ONLY multitimbral if you add another Tetra.
so..
Mopho x4 plus Tetra is 4x multitimbral (analogue synth, DCO (digital controlled oscillators)
the Prophet 08 is 4x multitimbral
the Korg Radias is 4x multitimbral
the Virus TI is 16x multitimbral (older Virus also multitimbral but less polyphony so go with the TI)
hope this helps.

oh ps I edited your quote of my post

)are you kidding me?)virus costs 2000.I`m from Russia))

[JimmiG]

Why do you want a hardware synth? Is it because of the sound, or because you want physical hardware and controls?

I have a Roland Gaia, and while it doesn't sound as good (or rather, it's not as versatile) as some of my other synths like the Virus TI Snow or Waldorf Blofeld, it's much more fun and immediate to program. You just grab a slider or knob. No need to launch Virus Control or navigate to the right menu on a tiny LCD screen.

[squarebox]

Originally Posted by Reptil

You're welcome!
yes, I think the Mopho x4 is ONLY multitimbral if you add another Tetra.
so..
Mopho x4 plus Tetra is 4x multitimbral (analogue synth, DCO (digital controlled oscillators)
the Prophet 08 is 4x multitimbral
the Korg Radias is 4x multitimbral
the Virus TI is 16x multitimbral (older Virus also multitimbral but less polyphony so go with the TI)
hope this helps.

I think the Prophet 08 is only 2 part multitimbral, right?

[verve92]

Gaia all the way. Though it is the most hated synth in the history of GS.
Does it sound like a Virus Ti or Prophet 08? No way.
But the interface will teach you basic subtractive in NO TIME! Plus it has crazy polyphony, nice arp and sequencer (sequencer with free software) and mono mode. Play one. I am sure they are more available in Russia then the DSI's or many other synths from what I hear anyway.
Great sounds can be done with it and it and the effects are good. Don't go nuts with a big $$ synth. You may not hit it off with synth. Who knows?
One thing about the Gaia, is it inspired me get the rig I have below, the guitars I have had for years and years.

[Reptil]

yes, I stand corrected

Is the Prophet '08 multitimbral?
It is bitimbral. That is, it can play two patches simultaneously via MIDI in Multi mode (on two MIDI channels) or from the keyboard in Split or Stack mode. Each Prophet '08 program consists of two layers and each layer can contain what is essentially a different patch. Both layers can be played simultaneously in stacked or split keyboard mode with each layer routed to its own stereo output. In Multi, Split, or Stack mode, each patch is allocated four of the eight voices.

Originally Posted by Babyjohn

)are you kidding me?)virus costs 2000.I`m from Russia))

I've tried to find synthesizers that give you something extra over software.
I have no way to know how cheap or expensive synths are in Moskow.
My recommendation is to try and find a secondhand one locally, or try german ebay
virus TI | eBay

[seqai]

Babyjohn, I think you should also consider buying the synth you choose in some european internet store or from even US ebay. The prices in Russia are 1.5x, 2x or even more times expensive even with shpping charges. If you're ready to wait it's really worth the time. I personally buy in German musicstore.

[Babyjohn]

watch youtube and think about waldorf blofeld.what you say about this one?

[JimmiG]

Originally Posted by verve92

One thing about the Gaia, is it inspired me get the rig I have below, the guitars I have had for years and years.

Agreed, that's the whole point of your "first synth". It should be affordable and easy to use, while still sounding decent enough to inspire you and keep your interest. There's no need for your first synth to cost many thousands or for it to be the best sounding synthesizer ever. It's the same with any intrument - if you're just starting out playing the guitar, you don't buy the most expensive one available right away, when you barely know how to play it.

[tjporter]

There is always the old-fashioned way - going to a (second hand) music store & trying synths that are in your price range.
And if you find a cheap Polivoks, let me know.

[verve92]

Originally Posted by JimmiG

Agreed, that's the whole point of your "first synth". It should be affordable and easy to use, while still sounding decent enough to inspire you and keep your interest. There's no need for your first synth to cost many thousands or for it to be the best sounding synthesizer ever. It's the same with any intrument - if you're just starting out playing the guitar, you don't buy the most expensive one available right away, when you barely know how to play it.

My first guitar was a cheapo Hohner Strat copy. Played through a 15 watt solid state amp. My dad got it for me over 20 years ago and said make it sound good and we'll see about a better rig down the line.
Looking back having that crappy gear forced me to develop techniques rather than great sound. Threw on one of those old DigiTech racks with giant pedal board. Had to be late 80's. Still have it in my attic.

[danielb]

Originally Posted by Reptil

You're welcome!
yes, I think the Mopho x4 is ONLY multitimbral if you add another Tetra.
so..
Mopho x4 plus Tetra is 4x multitimbral (analogue synth, DCO (digital controlled oscillators)
the Prophet 08 is 4x multitimbral
the Korg Radias is 4x multitimbral
the Virus TI is 16x multitimbral (older Virus also multitimbral but less polyphony so go with the TI)
hope this helps.

oh ps I edited your quote of my post

It would be nice to see a demo of the Virus that actually does it justice. This one is full of horrible noises, and even Jexus makes it sound boring and ordinary.

My Radias, BTW, constantly surprises me with how brilliant it sounds. Like the Virus, it is by no means an "instant gratification" synth (this is the price you pay for its huge versatility), but if you work at it it will give fantastic results.