I mean if he's willing to buy all sorts of samplers and outboard in his quest to clone some specific sound, then that's well within his rights. Me personally, I think life's too short, so I choose samplers on the basis of efficiency and facility, and choose samples and processing tools on the basis of sound... But again that's me and he's entitled to do it differently than I do...
I mean if he's willing to buy all sorts of samplers and outboard in his quest to clone some specific sound, then that's well within his rights. Me personally, I think life's too short, so I choose samplers on the basis of efficiency and facility, and choose samples and processing tools on the basis of sound... But again that's me and he's entitled to do it differently than I do...
The point for me is that once I can reliably and quickly create the sound I'm after producing is way more efficient and satisfying. And what I'm looking for here applies to all sorts of sounds and heavily influences the overall sonics of a production, it's not just trimmings.
seriously if you give me a drum break, and a reference file of exactly how you want it to sound, i can take it and make it sound exactly like that with itb tools. i think you're on a never-ending quest for something you're never going to find in a hardware sampler.
seriously if you give me a drum break, and a reference file of exactly how you want it to sound, i can take it and make it sound exactly like that with itb tools. i think you're on a never-ending quest for something you're never going to find in a hardware sampler.
you won't get that s950 sound ITB sorry. You might get a little close. Tell me another sampler that lets your sample in really hot without the fear of digital clipping. 900/950 is one of a kind.
Location: fear and loathing across the country, listening to my 8-track
Posts: 2,964
Quote:
Originally Posted by living sounds
So is this the channel comp, the gate or a combination of both? Certainly goes in the right direction.
That's the MPC-30. More vintage than vintage.
Nah, just playing.
It's FX Pansion Guru and it's sample editor/positioning +
hold/decay envelopes. Then some ITB EQ, slight...
Little bit of parallel compression after gate into UAD-33609,
then married into UAD-Fatso Sr.
BUT, the samples I'm using have been processed OTB
when created.
Point is, there's no point. I just was bored and played a
game with my computer using your description of what you
thought was happening. Fast attack = moving the start point.
Low-mid punch = HPF + drive + phase shift
Combined with Gate into Parallel for texture, drive emphasizing
attacks.
Groove glue on master, making attacks consistent.
I used to sell all the samplers mentioned in this thread.
MPC3k has the punchiest low mids.
But a lot of people have them. How many tracks have you heard
with the quality you want? What's the ratio to MPC3k users in
existence last 20+ years?
But you have your mind made up already. Buy the sampler.
You have my permission. :magicwand:
But sometime perhaps try the first suggestion I gave, which is
SSL Duende Channel, Drumstrip, Buss Comp + Slate VCC SSL
both in demo mode. See if it gets you closer. If so, perhaps
try to arrange a demo on SSL Mynx w/ EQ+Dyn. I'm sure they
float around from distributors or resellers looking to make a deal.
Well its entire memory can fit on one floppy, so scsi is not absolutely necessary. Floppy is fine, and HxC would be more than enough (don't know if its available for the S550, just saying).
As for the mouse and monitor, I have to agree its almost a must-have, but the s550 is not nearly as deep as the later S7xx series, so you can gitrdone from the front panel. I had one back in the late 90s.
Well its entire memory can fit on one floppy, so scsi is not absolutely necessary. Floppy is fine, and HxC would be more than enough (don't know if its available for the S550, just saying).
As for the mouse and monitor, I have to agree its almost a must-have, but the s550 is not nearly as deep as the later S7xx series, so you can gitrdone from the front panel. I had one back in the late 90s.
do you know if the s550 has the same sample engine, A>Dconverters as the s330 and w30? obviously it's twice as much sample time, I know the 330/w30 is 14 seconds on 30k sampling if you count both A and B 'banks'.
Well. As pointed out earlier, I dont know everything (Sorry my MPC history isn't top notch), but I do know a couple of things. Any older S series Akai will do you well . . . especially the 900/950, which you say you own. As far as the MPC goes, it's actually the 3000 I meant to refer to, not the 2000. I've heard MPC 60 also has its own flavor as well.
That said, it really does seem you're on a never ending quest. I'm not sure from what I've read that you will ever find what makes you happy . People used these machines in the past because they had no choice otherwise. Some may keep them around because of a specific sound, but many people have moved on to gear that is more effecient and has a better workflow. If you haven't found something you're connecting w/ by now, I'm not sure it will ever click, no matter what sampler you're using.
The sound that you're describing was due to tools used at the time. Every era has a different sound to it because of what was being used as standards. Yes, a lot of the tonality you're looking for has to do with the older samplers, but it has just as much to do with the desks, comps, EQ's, etc used at the time. Other people have mentioned just as much in this thread.
That said, there's plenty of modern producers getting a sound from their preferred era, by using completely ITB or Hybrid setups. I think getting a specific sound is way more about knowing your gear, learning the basics, and learning what was being used at the time, and what production techniques. It's really all out there in front of us, like it never has been before.
I'm saying this from experience. I used to spend a lot of time finding a specific sound or feeling, until I found out . . . that the sound I was dying to have, didnt even really work all the time in the music I was making.
Find your workflow first IMO. Then find out what you have to do to process the sound. In the end, its only a good song that matters. And I still stand by my statement, that you do not need specific gear to get a tone from a certain era or to get a certain sound when it comes to samples (notice I said when it comes to samples).
In conclusion, I think you may be happier getting some sort of older MPC, making beats, and recording it through some of the consoles listed straight into your computer, and then doing some post processing. That's my honest belief, and it may be way better for your workflow. If you're making mostly beats, why waste time with old SCSI samplers that are way more pain than they are worth? Get samples you want, find them, or buy them, import them into an older MPC, so you have a good sound source, create music, put it in your computer through a good board, and have at it.
All right, really good tip about the SSL! I listened to older recordings I made with my SSL compressors and liked them a lot better. Turns out some of my more recent mods, while measuring better, were counterproductive to the sound. I also re-tooled my console to sound more like an SSL (the EQs).
Here's a short loop with a few vinylistics samples played from a soft sampler in Reaper (swing quantization doesn't work somehow), put a gate on kick and snare, compressed and eqed OTB. Sounds pretty punchy now, and with the hardware samplers it's only going to sound better.
1176s I got, they're got for rock snare drums and a lot of other things, but you need a longer attack time for this lower mid kind of kick attack in my experience.
living sounds, how do you like drums on this track?
-if you could bet, which sampler would you say this is?
I'll tell you the answer later, i'm close friend with this producer.
To be honest, not very much. Listened to several versions, found one that had better low end definition than the rest, but even then it's not my cup of tea. Sorry I can say nothing better about the sound (since it's your friend), but at least I like the beat a lot!
Which sampler was it?
But then he pointed to one "little" info that is often forgot to be mentioned by some other producers. That is, each track is rendered individually and sent to a certain studio in NY where they would do "the processing". All costs covered by his label.
I think a lot of us aren't always told the truth. i.e. when you read Justice uses Cubase only, or this guy uses only that, somehow they "forget" to mention the post production part. But the reason is obvious. If You or me would know how to get the sound of that Missy Elliott track you posted earlier, i doubt we would be here talking on a forum. More likely on a private yacht, enjoying summer time on some remote island...
Bottom line, i don't think we will ever know the truth. And I doubt that those who know - are crazy enough to give their secrets away - particularly not on a forum with 100k+ views per day. Timba says "it's in the sound of SSL". Right, but what you got in the back hidden in those racks buddy?
(back to topic, i think the scamp would be overkill. You might want to PM Roginator, he actually tried all the compressors of this planet and is a fan of samplers. Maybe he knows)
To me analog processing is a given. I'm fully OTB for years and the difference is obvious. I always lough about statements about people working all ITB when I listen to their tracks, because it's obviously baloney. But there are often tracks on albums by high profile artists which sound like full ITB as well.
What I'm looking for is really the piece of the puzzle of a sampler that will always give a punchy attack. ;-)
Roginator likes the ADD One best. Haven't tried it yet, it's hard to come by and not as easily integrated as a more recent AKAI. Since the sound I'm looking for is quite common in music from a certain period I thought there might be some obvious rather widespread instrument involved.
The credit list for that Missy Elliot song is long, and this has been my reference track for the best bass period for years.
I asked Dave Pensado (didn't mix this one though) when he guest hosted in this forum how he got drums punchy, and he explained his elaborate multing technique envolving lot's of high end outboard. At that level these tricks are certainly used, but for an obscure mid-90s trip hop band I guess the recipe is much simpler, and samplers look like an obvious thing to look at.
Does anyone know if the S01 sounds like the S20? The specs of the sound engine are the same at least.
Here's the same loop now with the samples loaded into the S1000 and edited there. Also a couple more compressors, the console inputs overloaded and an Exciter added on the master bus. No gates.
Sounds good, and nice to see you're getting where you wanted.
I've always considered the drums of these two tracks, especially the first one, some of the best sounding hip hop beats ever made. Drum sounds are obviously sampled from break beats. What do you think?
IMHO your S1000 punchy drums sound a little harsh in comparison. I know it's something you just quickly made. But I'm making this point because many post-1999 hip hop drums I've heard sound harsh in the same way, and I think something good has been lost there.
Sounds good, and nice to see you're getting where you wanted.
I've always considered the drums of these two tracks, especially the first one, some of the best sounding hip hop beats ever made. Drum sounds are obviously sampled from break beats. What do you think?
IMHO your S1000 punchy drums sound a little harsh in comparison. I know it's something you just quickly made. But I'm making this point because many post-1999 hip hop drums I've heard sound harsh in the same way, and I think something good has been lost there.
Yes, my loop isn't what I would put on a record, apart from the high end the attacks are too snappy for hip hop and sound overprocessed like late 80s pop. ;-) I layered an 808 kick below the beat and it gets better though, the important thing for me is that I can get the sound I want with some work.
Generally I like clear, definied sound with lot's of high end, but I also think some took it too far, Dre's "2001" album for example is almost too aggressive (although it sounds generally great, of course).
"Flexi With Da Tech" sounds too muddy for my taste, I associate that with typical SP1200 sound and lower fidelity analog equipment. But maybe it's just bad Youtube resolution.
"Wrong Side of Da Tracks" sounds nice, great low end punch. But again, I like a little more high end definition.
I always liked Kruder & Dorfmeister's sound, which has a nice balance of clear high end and punchy lows:
Listening to it now I think this might be the S1000 as well, at least I imagine hearing the typical artifacts in the high end.
As far as hip hop is concerned, I pick this as my favourite beat, musically and sonically:
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